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I have serious doubts about effectiveness...
Let's start from the beginning. I have an Incinerate build with double curse. Warlord's Mark to gain endurance charges and leech, and Flammability for obvious reasons. My Incinerate spell had Fire Penetration... But a couple of hours ago experimenting I replace "Fire Penetration" with "Cold to Fire"... Cold to Fire did increase my damage, so I made a few intermediate maps (72 - 74) to test the configuration and I don't see any significant negative change and my Cold to Fire needs rise yet a few levels, meaning that there is still room for further increase in damage. The actual damage of my Incinerate with GMP is about 12.500 DPS, Incinerate (lvl/q) 17/20%, Cold to Fire 17/6%. What would you do? Forget the Cold to fire and use again Fire Penetration? Or level up the Cold to Fire and turn up quality? Thanks :) Bethesda is known for having good ideas and terrible realization of them. GGG is a Bethesda subsidiary or what? Last edited by Actkqk on Sep 2, 2015, 1:01:28 AM
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The thing about penetration is that it's not terribly useful against low-resist mobs, but it's a godsend against high-resist mobs.
It may feel like it's nothing special, but when you run into a curse-immune elemental resist rare with an ele resist aura, you'll be thankful that you've got penetration. So I guess it's a question of: Do you want a slightly faster clear speed in exchange for occasionally hitting a brick wall mob, or would you rather have all your DPS available to you when you need it most? IGN: Ikimashouka, Tsukiyattekudasai, DontCallMeMrFroyo
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Actually it is usefull against low resist mobs.
0% resist with a pen gem still makes it a more multiplier, 37% at level 20. The more resist a monster has the more effect the gem has. If you have cursed a monster to have -80 res then yes it is less effective but think about all the curse immune rares/bosses or even entire maps. Pen gems are better. | |
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So, in short, is allways better to have more Fire Penetration than having 5 or 6k more fire dmg in high level maps...
Thanks guys for the clarification :) Bethesda is known for having good ideas and terrible realization of them. GGG is a Bethesda subsidiary or what?
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umm not sure why cold to fire would improve your dps unless you're dealing a lot of cold damage.
do you have +cold to spells on a lot of your gear? and herald of ice? Fire Penetration gem can treat mobs like they have negative resist if they have none (this is what happens when you see "vulnerable to fire" after cursing something.) You'll notice if you curse something with high fire resist it might still say "resistant to fire" or "resistant to elements" despite having flammability on it for this reason. So fire pen gem will be useful no matter what. If you're getting more damage out of cold to fire it probably means you have a lot of added cold damage on your incinerate. Like an added cold gem or an aura or gear. Unless you've got lots of cold damage mods in your tree, it's probably going to be better for you to just go for flat fire damage gems. Not sure what you're using but for incinerate I recommend: Incinerate -> Lesser Multiple Projectiles -> Faster Projectiles -> Fire Penetration -> Empower -> Faster Casting Personally I like LMP over GMP for incinerate because you generally get enough coverage with 3 projectiles and it lets you do more damage. But hey, up to you :] Every Saturday = National Booze n Poe Day Last edited by Nasreth on Sep 3, 2015, 4:41:48 PM
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" No. My only source of Ice is HoI... The miraculous increase (nearly 1k in tooltip with GMP and a relatively low lvl Cold to Fire) is due to the use of Pledge of Hands and Faster Casting. With PoH and FC any "low" increase in dmg is converted to a "good" increase. My actual configuration is Incinerate 18/20% -> Faster Casting 15/20% -> Fire Penetration 14/20% -> GMP 20/12% -> Iron Will 20/14% and the tooltip with HoI + Fire Golem says about 12.600. I know that Anger would give me more DMG than HoI but at the same time I run Clarity lvl 20 and Arctic Armour, so Anger would not let enough mana available to cast Incinerate fluently. :) Bethesda is known for having good ideas and terrible realization of them. GGG is a Bethesda subsidiary or what?
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So you're saying your base DPS is around 12k and CtF adds around 1k to that? It's pretty easy to calculate which is better in that case:
13.5 / 12.5 is around 8% more damage. Penetration is 35% more damage against 0% resist mob with no curse. Against a cursed mob, its ((1.35+.45)/1.45), around 25% more damage. Against mobs with more resist, this figure can get as high as 250% more damage. IGN: Ikimashouka, Tsukiyattekudasai, DontCallMeMrFroyo
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" On my build 20/20 Spell Echo has nerly 6k more damage than 20/20 Faster casting. If I go first, I'll wait for you in the other side of the dark water.
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that is hardly surprising. the faster casting gem does not scale with your stats, it is just a flat chunk of cast speed , echo is a more multi which means it does scale.
if you have multiple sources of cast speed then echo just melts faster casting. really the only time one should be using faster casting is if it is the only option available. such is the case with totems. otherwise pen gems , added damage gems , echo and projectile gems / aoe gems are all one needs Last edited by Saltychipmunk on Sep 4, 2015, 8:57:32 AM
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Frankly, echo is the best dps support in the game, 53% more dps for only 110% cost per second multiplier is outrageous.
Wish the armchair developers would go back to developing armchairs.
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