Serious problem using Vaal Discipline, would like GGG response

Try to hold down the button for VD until it activates. That is what I´m doing pretty succesful with LW while casting arc with Spell Echo.

If you pay souls for VD without it beeing activated, the casting was interrupted by stun or something else. If not, it wasn´t cast at all.

I gave up on defensive Vaal Skills because I wasn´t able to reliably cast them when needed, so I would like some clarification on the behaviour as well.

Perhaps cast time should be removed in terms of balancing these skills?

3 seconds is basically a million years when you have good DPS.... Combine with increased duration... or on SRS for a bunch of increased skill duration nodes.... (I have a vaal discipline that lasts 7.95 seconds, it's enough to tank a full instance of uber atziri's 3rd form from any corner)

"the only thing that might prevent it from being cast immediately
is the secondary cast of the main skill by the Spell Echo"

You already realize what the problem is.. you said it right there. ^

If you hold down VD hotkey it should cast VD after the spell echo sequence has ended, and as long as you continue holding the hotkey for the echoed spell the entire time you're doing this, it should go right back to casting the echoed spell once VD has been cast.

"

SamSano wrote:

Try to hold down the button for VD until it activates. That is what I´m doing pretty succesful with LW while casting arc with Spell Echo.

That's what i do with LW and it is somewhat successful;
but it doesn't work with VD.

"

SamSano wrote:

If you pay souls for VD without it beeing activated, the casting was interrupted by stun or something else. If not, it wasn´t cast at all.

I have never experienced such situation (souls lost but skill not cast),
even without the EoC;
are you sure this is correct (it seems logical tho) ?

"

SamSano wrote:

I gave up on defensive Vaal Skills because I wasn´t able to reliably cast them when needed, so I would like some clarification on the behaviour as well.

Perhaps cast time should be removed in terms of balancing these skills?

Would be good i think.

"

HikaruYami wrote:

3 seconds is basically a million years when you have good DPS.... Combine with increased duration... or on SRS for a bunch of increased skill duration nodes.... (I have a vaal discipline that lasts 7.95 seconds, it's enough to tank a full instance of uber atziri's 3rd form from any corner)

Unfortunately i have the normal self-found non-crit DPS on a 4-link
(i have a 5-link which links both arc and l.tendrils to the same supports,
so it's a 4-link for them both (l.penetration, spell echo and l.leech));

it takes me more than 5 seconds (my current VD + increased duration)
to clear the majority of a big strongbox spawn (if it has extra mobs or a rogue exile),
or to kill a tough map boss

"

GodlyMe wrote:

If you hold down VD hotkey it should cast VD after the spell echo sequence has ended, and as long as you continue holding the hotkey for the echoed spell the entire time you're doing this, it should go right back to casting the echoed spell once VD has been cast.

exactly - it should !
but it does not :(

seems like the vaal skills are being "forgotten" or "lost",
or something..

"

PaladinSMD wrote:

Also make sure your cast isn't interrupted (stun for example)

This is what pisses me off with Vaal spells. If Vaal attacks always hit then why can Vaal spells be interrupted?

"

myownclone wrote:

"

SamSano wrote:

If you pay souls for VD without it beeing activated, the casting was interrupted by stun or something else. If not, it wasn´t cast at all.

I have never experienced such situation (souls lost but skill not cast),
even without the EoC;
are you sure this is correct (it seems logical tho) ?

Sadly, it's definitely correct. I've had both Vaal Summon Skeletons and Vaal Discipline use up my souls, then not cast because I get stunned. Pisses me off, because as a LL ES build, I get stunned from basically anything, so Vaal Discipline is even harder to cast reflexively.

"

HikaruYami wrote:

"

myownclone wrote:

"

SamSano wrote:

If you pay souls for VD without it beeing activated, the casting was interrupted by stun or something else. If not, it wasn´t cast at all.

I have never experienced such situation (souls lost but skill not cast),
even without the EoC;
are you sure this is correct (it seems logical tho) ?

Sadly, it's definitely correct. I've had both Vaal Summon Skeletons and Vaal Discipline use up my souls, then not cast because I get stunned. Pisses me off, because as a LL ES build, I get stunned from basically anything, so Vaal Discipline is even harder to cast reflexively.

I got a few answers from support.
One of them was:
"If you're interrupted before the Vaal Discipline starts casting, the ability wouldn't trigger, but you wouldn't lose the souls either."

I have no idea if it relates only to VD or to all vaal skills.
It does correspond to the experience i am having.

------
I have switched my spell echo support for the main skill with faster casting.
And it looks much better !

Not long enough test period to tell for sure,
and i can already tell that it is also not a 100% solution,
but in most cases i was able to activate VD with only 2-3 key strokes,
which is much better than before.

So the problem is with using spell echo.

I will put an edit on the first post.

"

myownclone wrote:

I got a few answers from support.
One of them was:
"If you're interrupted before the Vaal Discipline starts casting, the ability wouldn't trigger, but you wouldn't lose the souls either."

Wording is everything.

If you are interrupted before Vaal Discipline starts casting, then you don't lose souls. If you are in the middle of some other cast animation (like the spell echo of summon raging spirits, in my instance) and then get stunned while your finger is holding the vaal discipline button, you don't use souls up. If you get past that, and to the start of the vaal discipline animation, but not to the end of it, your souls get used up and you do not go to space today.

It's literally the exact same mechanic as non-vaal spells, except that the lost cost is much higher. The mana gets used up right as your cast animation starts, and if you get stunned in the middle of the animation, sucks for you.

If support wants to come in and claim that this is a bug, then please fix it, but I promise that it's happened to me at least a dozen times.