PoE needs a difficulty factor setting

"

SL4Y3R wrote:

No

??

"

tinko92 wrote:

"

ScrotieMcB wrote:

I'd consider something more along the lines of:

• XP gain is now split evenly among nearby party members instead of granting the full amount to each (ex: 4 players get 25% each, instead of all 3 players getting 100%).
• Item rarity increased by 25% per additional player (max 125% more).
• Pack density for non-unique monsters increased by 40% per additional player (max 200% more).
• Non-unique monster life increased by 40% per additional player (max 200% more).
• Non-unique monster XP gain increased by 15% per additional player (max 75% more).
• Unique monster life increased by 100% per additional player (max 500% more).
• Unique monster attack, cast, and move speed increased by 10% per additional player (max 50% more).
• Unique monster quantity of item drops increased by 40% per additional player (max 200% more).
• Unique monster XP gain increased by 80% per additional player (max 400% more).
• Unique monster AI altered to change targets between various party members more often during combat.

With this written, I can safely say that you have no idea about the high level mapping in PoE (when death is costly, either by time or money). You are absolutely clueless in that area.

Those lines of yours would not change the mapping mentality as it is now, brainless map clearing with boss skipping.
With that bonus IIR which is just ridiculous considering how map rotations work, but since that is completely against solo play, I really have no idea why it's not here already. Yes, even that experience gain change wouldn't change the effectiveness of map rotations, in 6 player party it would mean the same experience as solo,

No, it wouldn't. In fact, one core attribute of this system is that group play would never be as efficient as solo play in terms of XP gain. Ever. Read the first point again, and actually do the math.

"

RutRoh wrote:

"

SL4Y3R wrote:

No

??

No they are not planning on increasing the max level past 100. They *might* introduce higher lvl zones, however I still see them reducing difficulties instead of increasing zone level.

"

johnKeys wrote:

so I just gave up trying and became an Altoholic.

but this is what Im saying john. Im not saying anyone who hasnt got a lvl90 character is a bad player, that would be ridiculous and obviously not true. But if you are not trying to get there, you are not going to get there.

And thats fine, its perfectly legit to not care about the grindy bit at the end and to enjoy playing through the main game, rerolling, I wouldnt knock that one bit. I do the same around 88-92 somewhere, thats where I plan my builds to, level grinding past there is just too much grinding for me, Id rather reroll and play that high level char for fun and item grinding.

But if you want to get to 90, if you are trying, then theres sure ways to just mow through content. If you are trying to work it all out for yourself its not at all easy, but theres a lot of informative guides out there. Its a game that people put 1000s of hours into, of course theres a learning curve, but if the game didnt force you to think it wouldnt be so rewarding when you succeed. Its just knowing what you are doing that turns it from a hard game into an easy game, I dont think the answer to players not knowing how to get to where they want to be is to put in a slider that makes the game easier.

I agree with people saying tutorials, guides etc are what players who find it to hard to move forward need. But part of the game is its ruthless nature, thats part of the fun. Its challenging, sometimes extremely so at first, and then you think your way around it and that feels rewarding. If what you think is "ok better turn down the slider" is that rewarding? doesnt that just feel pointless and shallow compared to letting the player figure out how to make the game easier through in game mechanics? Thats sort of the point of these games, why have all these mechanics if the one that matters is the difficulty setting in the options? Making the game easy is what you are trying to achieve as a player, and what makes it fun is resistance from the game and rng.

The vibe of the game is supposed to be unrelenting, oppressive, malicious, youve got to enjoy the pain a little with PoE like you would a good horror movie.

I heard it from a reliable source that at least 98.5% of Path of Exile accounts do not have a character which has made it to Merciless Eternal Laboratory yet. Which means that playing even one map immediately puts you in the top 1.5%.

Food for thought.

"

RutRoh wrote:

"

SL4Y3R wrote:

I expect a difficulty to be eventually removed.

I'm not sure what you mean. Do you mean like remove Merciless difficulty and only have normal and cruel?

yeah im pretty sure theyve said this somewhere? Cant be 100% sure. They have said they wont scale up gear and player levels with subsequent expansions the way D3 expansions will obviously keep pushing the level cap to 100 over time.

The full release was with act3x, the scion class, dominus etc late last year.

"

SL4Y3R wrote:

"

RutRoh wrote:

"

SL4Y3R wrote:

No

??

No they are not planning on increasing the max level past 100. They *might* introduce higher lvl zones, however I still see them reducing difficulties instead of increasing zone level.

Ahhh...following you now.

"

ScrotieMcB wrote:

"

tinko92 wrote:

"

ScrotieMcB wrote:

I'd consider something more along the lines of:

• XP gain is now split evenly among nearby party members instead of granting the full amount to each (ex: 4 players get 25% each, instead of all 3 players getting 100%).
• Item rarity increased by 25% per additional player (max 125% more).
• Pack density for non-unique monsters increased by 40% per additional player (max 200% more).
• Non-unique monster life increased by 40% per additional player (max 200% more).
• Non-unique monster XP gain increased by 15% per additional player (max 75% more).
• Unique monster life increased by 100% per additional player (max 500% more).
• Unique monster attack, cast, and move speed increased by 10% per additional player (max 50% more).
• Unique monster quantity of item drops increased by 40% per additional player (max 200% more).
• Unique monster XP gain increased by 80% per additional player (max 400% more).
• Unique monster AI altered to change targets between various party members more often during combat.

With this written, I can safely say that you have no idea about the high level mapping in PoE (when death is costly, either by time or money). You are absolutely clueless in that area.

Those lines of yours would not change the mapping mentality as it is now, brainless map clearing with boss skipping.
With that bonus IIR which is just ridiculous considering how map rotations work, but since that is completely against solo play, I really have no idea why it's not here already. Yes, even that experience gain change wouldn't change the effectiveness of map rotations, in 6 player party it would mean the same experience as solo,

No, it wouldn't. In fact, one core attribute of this system is that group play would never be as efficient as solo play in terms of XP gain. Ever. Read the first point again, and actually do the math.

XP gain is mainly gated by the cost of the map. With your system a player in a full party would roughly get 87.5% of the exp of a player soloing.

However, as long as the map cost is a significant factor, that doesn't mean that soloing is more exp-efficient than doing full map groups. Make it so that a full party player gets 70% of a solo player so that a solo player can do one map level lower and still get similar exp to a full party player doing one map level higher.

"

mazul wrote:

XP gain is mainly gated by the cost of the map. With your system a player in a full party would roughly get 87.5% of the exp of a player soloing.

However, as long as the map cost is a significant factor, that doesn't mean that soloing is more exp-efficient than doing full map groups. Make it so that a full party player gets 70% of a solo player so that a solo player can do one map level lower and still get similar exp to a full party player doing one map level higher.

87.5%, with tougher fights... as opposed to 100% with easier fights now. Seems like you just can't please the extremists unless you nerf something completely into the ground.

Sorry, but I think the combination of significantly more challenging encounters and reduced XP is enough. These things could always be nerfed further later if necessary, so there's no need to go overboard.

Snorkle, I never said that slider should have an "easy mode" of Path Of Exile, but rather take the current setting as a baseline, then up the numbers from there.
also, it doesn't necessarily have to be "a slider" or a "/players x". those are just abstract terms.

the thing is, I completely gave up hope of GGG seriously adding skill-based and AI-based difficulty into this game, or even considering to do so. RNG was always king (god?) of PoE, and will always be it seems.
but all those people who say "yeah the game does give you a difficulty increase when you need to", don't know what they are talking about.
the game uses RNG (surprise surprise) to gate challenges from you, then puts gear-check on top of that RNG to increase it's power.
"you can always Alch Maps" - no. RNG. double RNG: maps and orbs. even recipes for orbs, FFS.
"maps and Vaal Fragments are cheap" - no. economy. that's not gameplay. and Orbs? RNG.
you guys just seem to (deliberately?) miss the huge elephant standing in the middle of the room.

again, Median XL did absolutely nothing to stop me from accidentally entering Toraja (or any other Uber Zone) and getting my ass kicked so hard, I then knew I need to get better.
Median XL also provided me with skill-based progression: beating "easier" (read: less insane) zones for gear and charms/amulets/gems that help pass the gear-check parts of the harder ones.
all that, without even one bit of AI.
you always have something to strive for. a goal ahead of you that's skill - not RNG - away.

that's the secondary form of risk/reward I'm talking about: one that's in the game's design itself, while the monsters can actually stay dumb, uninspired, one-shot number-mongers.

what do we have in PoE? grinding the same bloody area again and again, hoping for the dice to roll you a Shav from a fucking rock, so you can finally enter that crazy map without getting slaughtered?
oh wait, you don't even have that map yet. better grind those damn rocks until RNG generously decides to grant you one, and Orbs (or recipe ingredients) for it. or doesn't.
bloody hell I'd lose my damn sanity if I did just that, for the ~2k hours I've played.
props to guys like you and Anuhart, for still hanging in there.
but yeah then I'd have a character that's level 90+ right? no. not worth it. not even one bit.

so suppose we have "a slider", and a new player turns it up to "max" just to see how it goes.
that's me, in Toraja: dead in seconds, and know I need to get better. also, know I can always try to "max" the slider again whenever I feel I am good enough, and without the god-damned RNG having anything to say about that. it already dominates everything else.