I don't think I understand reflect

You can block and/or evade both physical and elemental reflect with things like acrobatics, evasion rating, ondar's guille, spellblock etc.? Really?

Doesn't make any fucking sense?
Beyond league.
Does it have to make sense? :D
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You can block and/or evade both physical and elemental reflect with things like acrobatics, evasion rating, ondar's guille, spellblock etc.? Really?

Doesn't make any fucking sense?


Damage reduction abilities shouldn't apply to reflected damage?

Without being able to block, evade, and dodge reflect, blocking, evasion, and dodging would all be shit compared to stacking armor and +max resistances. It doesn't need to make sense in-game; it is a balance thing.

Armor doing fuckall vs. a 30' tall machine(?) smacking you with a wrecking ball doesn't make sense either, but apparently it works in Wraeclast.
Last edited by KG31459 on Feb 4, 2014, 5:22:19 PM
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KG31459 wrote:
Armor doing fuckall vs. a 30' tall machine(?) smacking you with a wrecking ball doesn't make sense either, but apparently it works in Wraeclast.
If you're wearing a plate vest and get hit by a train, that plate vest isn't gonna do much.
BreakingHearts|ScionWatchTheWorldBurn|HanaHeartbreaker|SpinnyMacCrash

Seems we're living in interesting times.
"
If you're wearing a plate vest and get hit by a train, that plate vest isn't gonna do much.


Wraeclastian train.
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Doesn't make any fucking sense?
How does that not make any sense? Why would you be unable to utilise you mitigation on such things?
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Mark_GGG wrote:
"
Doesn't make any fucking sense?
How does that not make any sense? Why would you be unable to utilise you mitigation on such things?


Ah, now that's a really good question that digs deep into fantasy lore and relativity of common sense.

My theory is that one is heavily dependent on the way someone pictures 'reflecting damage'. Fortunately, it has been extensively tested by experts from all over the globe which have have came to a conclusion visualization of reflected damage is relative to individual and maybe the kind of mental damage he received in childhood by stumbling into his parents' bedroom on a terrible stormy night while they were working on procurement of additional offspring.

1. "Mirror image"
After swinging at an enemy, a ghostly doppelganger of yours takes a swipe at you, this corresponds to current model of reflected damage. Venerable art&effect wiz Russell once heavily lobbied for an attempt to animate that, but was forced to abandon it after a particularly venomous complaint letter lodged by the game graphics engine.

2. "Pain reflection"
Very old school way of picturing reflection, it dates to misty past of fantasy role playing games, when things didn't need a thorough explanation to work. They just were, and we saw it was good. Damage is channeled back in this fashion by an especially diabolic covenant with spirits of voodoo ethos, it can't be prevented, reduced, or emotionally handled in any fashion.

3. "Hentai pawn star"
A somewhat recent approach briefly utilized even in PoE until it became too mainstream. An enemy with reflect capabilities grows a set of tentacles used to subconsciously strike back at unwary enemies using own attack rating and offensive attributes without the need to divide his attention. Unfortunately, area of subconscious is heavily influenced by hormones and libido, making such appendages used far more often for own sexual pleasure, catapulting the game in question at least 3 PG ratings up (overcap possible)... which is why it was replaced by #1 in PoE.

4. "Nipple hands"
A very exotic vision of interaction between sworn foes, that only the most tortured of minds can conceive. An enemy grows an actual PAIR... of tiny hand on his nipples, fully autonomous and capable of feats of unmatched cunning. At every possible opportunity they will attempt to pinch the derriere or bosom of unwary attackers,inflicting damage perhaps small but very hard to evade both physically and mentally. They are also capable of inflicting blindness and fear upon successful strike, causing most attackers to flee in blind terror. Unfortunately, it is truly effective only on female attackers, and waitresses have an innate second roll to dodge the unwanted attention due to intensive training.
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Last edited by raics on Feb 4, 2014, 5:57:01 PM
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raics wrote:
"
Mark_GGG wrote:
"
Doesn't make any fucking sense?
How does that not make any sense? Why would you be unable to utilise you mitigation on such things?


Ah, now that's a really good question that digs deep into fantasy lore and relativity of common sense.

My theory is that one is heavily dependent on the way someone pictures 'reflecting damage'. Fortunately, it has been extensively tested by experts from all over the globe which have have came to a conclusion visualization of reflected damage is relative to individual and maybe the kind of mental damage he received in childhood by stumbling into his parents' bedroom on a terrible stormy night while they were working on procurement of additional offspring.

1. "Mirror image"
After swinging at an enemy, a ghostly doppelganger of yours takes a swipe at you, this corresponds to current model of reflected damage. Venerable art&effect wiz Russell once heavily lobbied for an attempt to animate that, but was forced to abandon it after a particularly venomous complaint letter lodged by the game graphics engine.

2. "Pain reflection"
Very old school way of picturing reflection, it dates to misty past of fantasy role playing games, when things didn't need a thorough explanation to work. They just were, and we saw it was good. Damage is channeled back in this fashion by an especially diabolic covenant with spirits of voodoo ethos, it can't be prevented, reduced, or emotionally handled in any fashion.

3. "Hentai pawn star"
A somewhat recent approach briefly utilized even in PoE until it became too mainstream. An enemy with reflect capabilities grows a set of tentacles used to subconsciously strike back at unwary enemies using own attack rating and offensive attributes without the need to divide his attention. Unfortunately, area of subconscious is heavily influenced by hormones and libido, making such appendages used far more often for own sexual pleasure, catapulting the game in question at least 3 PG ratings up (overcap possible)... which is why it was replaced by #1 in PoE.

4. "Nipple hands"
A very exotic vision of interaction between sworn foes, that only the most tortured of minds can conceive. An enemy grows an actual PAIR... of tiny hand on his nipples, fully autonomous and capable of feats of unmatched cunning. At every possible opportunity they will attempt to pinch the derriere or bosom of unwary attackers,inflicting damage perhaps small but very hard to evade both physically and mentally. They are also capable of inflicting blindness and fear upon successful strike, causing most attackers to flee in blind terror. Unfortunately, it is truly effective only on female attackers, and waitresses have an innate second roll to dodge the unwanted attention due to intensive training.

I endorse this quote with my personal seal of approval.
Spoiler
Last edited by Nightmare90 on Feb 4, 2014, 6:13:50 PM
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You can block and/or evade both physical and elemental reflect with things like acrobatics, evasion rating, ondar's guille, spellblock etc.? Really?

Doesn't make any fucking sense?


Depends on how you define reflect...

To be honest, when I think of "reflecting", I think of the damage not even affecting the target, but instead is reflected back to the caster.

If that is the case, then yeah, I should be able to have a defense against it.

If the reflect is some otherworldly power that be that I cannot see, then maybe having a defense against it isn't such a good idea.

All on how your perceive it.

The term reflect is actually the problem...they need to change it to something else...IMO.

"
Mark_GGG wrote:
"
Doesn't make any fucking sense?
How does that not make any sense? Why would you be unable to utilise you mitigation on such things?


First of all don't get me wrong with 'making sense', it's not like I see rhoas charging at cars and witches casting fireballs when I look out of my window but the 'making sense' part is purely about the laws of physics. I don't think it's physically impossible for a Rhoa to exist and charge at someone. I don't think it's impossible to direct a ball of fire into a certain direction (how one would conjure up a fireball is a different story, but that's solved in the game with 'thaumaturgy' - which is fine).

Blocking is a different matter. I understand blocking. I can pick up a shield and block an attack as well and sure I could theoretically block a fireball with my shield too. I know what dodging is, I understand the idea of acrobatics etc.

There is no visual feedback and the damage retribution is instant. How can I block something that is both instant and invisible? Sure, you don't see characters perform block animations and evasion animations in-game (minus block recovery) but it makes sense that this is not implemented for game fluidity reasons (do you really want to see your char dodge every other attack...?).

I don't know how you can 'block' something like a fireball reflect with a shield or dual wielding (parrying?). It's instant and invisible, it makes absolutely zero sense and you can't use the 'thaumaturgy' scapegoat because there's nothing magical about blocking, parrying or evading/dodging... I've been playing this game since day 1 or day 2 open beta and only just realized this (then again I think reflect is a fucking awful mechanic to begin with, it overcentralizes on building tankiness and doesn't allow the player to be creative with avoiding damage - in other games you can build glass cannon and through positioning or teaming up with a designated tank or employ other fun, enticing and stimulating strategies. PoE? Nope, every char needs to be at least [x] tanky, no room for creativity. I bitch more about reflect in this topic from a long time agp).

It's extremely unintuitive and there's no way to access this information readily in game.
Beyond league.

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