Duelist sucks, let's make it better

I'd just like to say that I think the stunning on parry idea sounds awesome to me. And that in general getting added effects when blocking is a good idea, it improves on the dual wield or shield usage.

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Moosifer wrote:

Sound great, only thing I'm confused about is:

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all block chances converted to parry chances, disables offhand.

Does this mean you'd be wearing a shield but the only benefit being it's block chance being converted to parry? In that case get that 40% block shield and you'd have 65% parry (just from 2 nodes).

Unless you mean passives that would give block % (DW and/or shield) are converted to parry which would make sense.

Yeah, what I meant is that the blocking passive you took on the tree is not parry passives.

@ransagy: Yes, I am a little worried that parry just becomes another block chance / evade addition. We already have this in the form of acrobatics, although the price of acrobatics is smaller gear selection rather than a direct malus on the character. The bonus of acrobatics (phase acrobatics) is also spell avoidance, so it will be better to try to find something else.

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zharmad wrote:

Yeah, what I meant is that the blocking passive you took on the tree is not parry passives.

@ransagy: Yes, I am a little worried that parry just becomes another block chance / evade addition. We already have this in the form of acrobatics, although the price of acrobatics is smaller gear selection rather than a direct malus on the character. The bonus of acrobatics (phase acrobatics) is also spell avoidance, so it will be better to try to find something else.

Well how we talked about it earlier in the thread I was under the impression that it wouldn't really be a block, it would be more of a avoid then strike. I think someone said something like 50-70% of weapon damage? So a successful parry would make the user take no damage then return 50-70% of their weapon damage. Someone suggested doing a flicker for spells but I think that would be extremely disorientating. Even using flicker normally you don't know where you are going or end up, a random flicker without you realizing it would be pretty jarring. I think a return fire, like 35-50% of weapon damage, like you reflect the spell back and the damage is re-scaled so stuff like vaal's lazer don't become too powerful being reflected.

Yeah, But seems kind of odd to auto-trigger an attack on a monster as a retaliation for defending against an attack.

It basically is a kind of physical reflect, but... i dunno.

A momentary debuff on the attacking monster and/or a stun sounds better to me personally.

As much as I'm interested in seeing spell parry, deflecting fireballs and other not-quite-physical things with any-ol' equipped blade doesn't make sense to me within this game. I'm definitely open to a unique having this property, though.

I'm also wary of making damage return an essential part of parry. It's ordinary definition is more like the deflection of an attack, which usually creates openings for a counter blow. It's not really the same as judo or light-sabre antics where you directly use an opponent's attack against themselves. Also, if we want to proceed with the gateway keystone idea, then the riposte would be a good follow-on path rather than built-in - this is so that "parry" itself doesn't become overloaded with too many chance-to-inflict X goodies after players build seriously into it.

ya I'm not feeling the spell parry stuff. But parry leading into riposte seemed like a good fit.

I have often wondered where the real "tanking" offensive skills were. A riposte was a thought I had a while back for evasion tanks but could've been use for blocking as well and it works for parry too. I would like to see a skill gem that works off of avoidance abilities for tanks or anyone who uses a shield/evasion. I think it could be a great addition to the repertoire of skills available and bring into a play a "tank" type of damage ability.

I don't like the thought of automated retaliation but a skill gem or keystone that would give the user the ability to do a Riposte upon successful parrying would be nice. Could set it up to a hot key like detonating mines.

Sort of like Tempest shield, except on Parry?

Tempest shield is basically lightning damage reflection. I would prefer a manual chance to riposte/retaliate. Not a charge, more like a short debuff. As said before, spell parry makes less sense unlike phase acrobatics.