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Thank you for the answer Mark , I was also wondering this.
May 15th 2012 - The day the king of ARPGs died. January 23rd 2013 - A new king takes the throne.
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Posted bybluejays90#2103on Aug 9, 2012, 10:40:22 PM
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Mark_GGG wrote:
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WhiteBoy88 wrote:
Edit: Minions also get your total IIR and IIQ added to theirs for any kills they make, so they have more than 14% if you're wearing any other IIR/IIQ gear.
Y'know, I've never even stopped to think about this, but this isn't technically true anymore.
It's still true for the iiq/iir support gems, as it always had been, but when I told people that, those were the only possible way to get iiq/iir stats on a minion, so it was true in all cases.
I never anticipated Necromantic Aegis, and up until seeing it discussed here never realised it made something I'd said in the past false (and I've quite possibly repeated that in the time since NA was implemented without realising this).
The reason the minion's iiq/iir from supports (which is all they ever used to get) got added to yours is that the support gems specifically work on things you kill, by telling an enemy you hit 'drop more stuff if this hit kills you'. So the minion would hit the enemy, the enemy would get the 'drop more if killed by this hit' thing, and then the kill would be assigned to you an benefit from your passive iiq/iir from gear.
But now that minions can get iiq/iir from gear, that's not actually accounted for, since the kill is assigned to you - so that bonus is never applied on minions, only the support one.
I'll talk with Chris and Carl at some point and see whether we want to change that (I suspect we will).
I am really shocked by this. So why "Raise zombie" and other summoning skills have IIR/IIQ mentioned in skills description when IIR/IIQ comes from items (hitting "C" and observing MISC stats).
It is kinda crucial question for a summoners that stack IIR/IIQ in gear because what is the point of doing so if summons do not benefit from the gear of summoner...
Last edited by kaziuko#4002 on Aug 19, 2012, 2:28:47 AM
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Posted bykaziuko#4002on Aug 19, 2012, 2:21:36 AM
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Mark_GGG wrote:
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WhiteBoy88 wrote:
Edit: Minions also get your total IIR and IIQ added to theirs for any kills they make, so they have more than 14% if you're wearing any other IIR/IIQ gear.
Y'know, I've never even stopped to think about this, but this isn't technically true anymore.
It's still true for the iiq/iir support gems, as it always had been, but when I told people that, those were the only possible way to get iiq/iir stats on a minion, so it was true in all cases.
I never anticipated Necromantic Aegis, and up until seeing it discussed here never realised it made something I'd said in the past false (and I've quite possibly repeated that in the time since NA was implemented without realising this).
The reason the minion's iiq/iir from supports (which is all they ever used to get) got added to yours is that the support gems specifically work on things you kill, by telling an enemy you hit 'drop more stuff if this hit kills you'. So the minion would hit the enemy, the enemy would get the 'drop more if killed by this hit' thing, and then the kill would be assigned to you an benefit from your passive iiq/iir from gear.
But now that minions can get iiq/iir from gear, that's not actually accounted for, since the kill is assigned to you - so that bonus is never applied on minions, only the support one.
I'll talk with Chris and Carl at some point and see whether we want to change that (I suspect we will).
On the same sorta subject i have firetrap connected with item quantity support. so if a mob dies to the initial explosion it is applied or is it the explosion and burn damage as well?
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Posted bylukeyz#4249on Aug 19, 2012, 3:54:17 AM
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Hehe :P I have a summoner/curse build and I got two Death's Harps in about 2 hours lol.
Congrats on the mirror!
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Posted byArchey#3683on Aug 19, 2012, 1:17:11 PM
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kaziuko wrote:
I am really shocked by this. So why "Raise zombie" and other summoning skills have IIR/IIQ mentioned in skills description when IIR/IIQ comes from items (hitting "C" and observing MISC stats).
It is kinda crucial question for a summoners that stack IIR/IIQ in gear because what is the point of doing so if summons do not benefit from the gear of summoner...
Hell !
So am i..
I'm playing a summoner and i stacked all my stuff on rarity/quantity (something like 150/50 at the moment) i've always thought it was working....
I was also wondering about necromantic aegis (if rarity/quantity on shield) but seriously, i'd have never imagined my rarity/quantity wasnt working on my minions. Just why ??? What's the explanation to this ? A summoner has summons as spells, why can't he do his magic find as other classes ?
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Posted byOlecrane#1942on Aug 19, 2012, 2:45:08 PM
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My guess is that Increased item quantity and rarity always works with minions. The only bonus that are applied to your minions from your shield with the keystone are the stats defense etc,à
At least its how it should be..
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Posted byolalonde#5006on Aug 19, 2012, 2:50:28 PM
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+1 Olalonde, that's how i thought it was working
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Posted byOlecrane#1942on Aug 19, 2012, 2:52:34 PM
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kaziuko wrote:
I am really shocked by this. So why "Raise zombie" and other summoning skills have IIR/IIQ mentioned in skills description when IIR/IIQ comes from items (hitting "C" and observing MISC stats).
It is kinda crucial question for a summoners that stack IIR/IIQ in gear because what is the point of doing so if summons do not benefit from the gear of summoner...
That's still correct. If you have IIQ/IIR from items, it does apply to kills by your minions, because those get assigned up to you. The character screen is correct.
The case which doesn't work is where IIQ/IIR is on the shield, and is thus put onto the minions instead of you (and will not show on the character panel in this case), and thus because they assign the kill to you, the IIQ/IIR on them is lost.
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Posted byMark_GGGon Aug 19, 2012, 7:33:25 PMGrinding Gear Games
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lukeyz wrote:
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Mark_GGG wrote:
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WhiteBoy88 wrote:
Edit: Minions also get your total IIR and IIQ added to theirs for any kills they make, so they have more than 14% if you're wearing any other IIR/IIQ gear.
Y'know, I've never even stopped to think about this, but this isn't technically true anymore.
It's still true for the iiq/iir support gems, as it always had been, but when I told people that, those were the only possible way to get iiq/iir stats on a minion, so it was true in all cases.
I never anticipated Necromantic Aegis, and up until seeing it discussed here never realised it made something I'd said in the past false (and I've quite possibly repeated that in the time since NA was implemented without realising this).
The reason the minion's iiq/iir from supports (which is all they ever used to get) got added to yours is that the support gems specifically work on things you kill, by telling an enemy you hit 'drop more stuff if this hit kills you'. So the minion would hit the enemy, the enemy would get the 'drop more if killed by this hit' thing, and then the kill would be assigned to you an benefit from your passive iiq/iir from gear.
But now that minions can get iiq/iir from gear, that's not actually accounted for, since the kill is assigned to you - so that bonus is never applied on minions, only the support one.
I'll talk with Chris and Carl at some point and see whether we want to change that (I suspect we will).
On the same sorta subject i have firetrap connected with item quantity support. so if a mob dies to the initial explosion it is applied or is it the explosion and burn damage as well?
Both I think. Both damages come from the spell, so resulting kills should benefit from IIQ.
"Minions of your minions are your minion's minions, not your minions." - Mark
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Posted byciknay#1000on Aug 19, 2012, 10:44:55 PM
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lukeyz wrote:
On the same sorta subject i have firetrap connected with item quantity support. so if a mob dies to the initial explosion it is applied or is it the explosion and burn damage as well?
IIQ/IIR on kill, from the support gems, are applied at the point something is hit and take effect if that hit kills them. They cannot affect DoT, although we hope to find a way around that in future.
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Posted byMark_GGGon Aug 20, 2012, 1:01:38 AMGrinding Gear Games
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