Heist will be left out in 3.24

Hey guys,


i wanted to discuss about the status of heist in 3.24. It seems like it gets a huge nerf this time in terms of accessibility.

- Heist loses his sextants (as everyone does)
- Heist receives no scarabs
- Heist receives no increases to appearance rate via atlas tree and stays at 40% with 9 points invested.

Now to compare it to some other mechanic, lets look at Delirium:
- Delirium lost his sextants, same treatment for everyone.
- Delirium receives updated scarabs, 5 in total.
- Delirium receives big increases to appearance rate via atlas tree, which allows a 100% appearance chance with 9 points of investment. (This also holds true e.g. for harvest, betrayel or blight)

I hope GGG addresses this issue prior league launch and tweaks some atlas nodes at least.


Stay sane, exiles and have a smooth leaguestart!

Heist is quite different than delirium. Heist doesn't add any monsters to the map. The node that gives you a bunch of boxes and more chance for blueprints would be op if you increased the heist nodes. You are already overwhelmed with contracts you can't/won't run the way it is. If you could filter out gianna contracts it would be reasonable but you can't afaik.

Also huck being in the map benefits you to where if it was near 100% in a map you would have 1 free aura all the time.

"

Lonnie455Rich wrote:

Heist is quite different than delirium. Heist doesn't add any monsters to the map. The node that gives you a bunch of boxes and more chance for blueprints would be op if you increased the heist nodes. You are already overwhelmed with contracts you can't/won't run the way it is. If you could filter out gianna contracts it would be reasonable but you can't afaik.

Also huck being in the map benefits you to where if it was near 100% in a map you would have 1 free aura all the time.

That take is too shortsighted. What makes Heist actually good besides speedrushing Gianna are the implicits. As of now I haven´t seen any way to incorporate the Sextants into the current system, leaving Heist in actually a very bad state. With those implicits you were able to make solid profits without relying on lucky drops from blueprints. On the opposite side, top end heist bases already cost a freaking mirror. Those changes will not help making them cheaper, making heist a total coinflip and luck-based farming mechanic.

"

Lonnie455Rich wrote:

Heist is quite different than delirium. Heist doesn't add any monsters to the map. The node that gives you a bunch of boxes and more chance for blueprints would be op if you increased the heist nodes. You are already overwhelmed with contracts you can't/won't run the way it is. If you could filter out gianna contracts it would be reasonable but you can't afaik.

Also huck being in the map benefits you to where if it was near 100% in a map you would have 1 free aura all the time.

You forget some important things:
- Yess Delirium adds monsters, which in turn makes delirium even better than smuggler caches! (more monsters are a no-brainer, you love them)
- Delirium drops a ton of cluster jewels as well, so its comparable to the blueprints/contracts, which in turn weakens your argument.
- Having Huck with you is definitly a big upside. Not gonna argue against that.

Nontheless the accessibility of delirium is by far higher than heist, especcially via the new scarabs (we have to see how good they actually are). And Heist took a big hit with the removal of two sextants, both do not get replaced in any way it seems and were quite relevant if you wanted to farm heist.

"

Lonnie455Rich wrote:

Heist is quite different than delirium. Heist doesn't add any monsters to the map. The node that gives you a bunch of boxes and more chance for blueprints would be op if you increased the heist nodes. You are already overwhelmed with contracts you can't/won't run the way it is. If you could filter out gianna contracts it would be reasonable but you can't afaik.

Also huck being in the map benefits you to where if it was near 100% in a map you would have 1 free aura all the time.

What game did you play in 3.23, because my experience is the absolute opposite.

8% Base Chance, +40% from all Heist nodes that increase Chance, + um to 18% from blocking every other Bonus Content. Then apply the 30% Chance for a second cache and the 5% for six more caches.

This means on average you get 0.768 to 1.056 Caches per map (no block vs. all block).

You need about 5-7 contracts for a blutprint and reveals and markers to finance the run. So you got to run 7-9 Maps per Blueprint you want to run.

I ran every contract I got and still hat to buy extra markers in order to be able to run my Blueprints.

Now we will lose Sextants which were the only Way to push the value of Contracts somehow, since Contracts and Blueprints are not considered maps, so there is no way to push quality or quantity.
And from all we saw so far, Heist will remain the only mechanic without scarabs to help with more efficient Contract/Blueprint farming or gaining those implicits sextants provided.

The map crafting option could be mandatory to Heist players in order to more then double their income of Heist related Items per map, while most players running other mechanics will never have to bother with their prefered Map crafting option, as they can push it to 100% appearance just by skilling their mechanics clusters and not even blocking other mechanics, giving them way more diverse Ways to designing their mapping strategies.

The new Atlas Tree has been seen as a great way to enable (SSF) players to gain access to the content they want to play more easily. But if you want to play Heist you have no improvement at all. Heist just got nothing but the return of the map craft, almost forcing it onto you if you want to be able to somewhat sustain your ability to run Heist Content.

I don't mind if Heist is gonna die. Heist Mafia ruined game for all of us by selling alternate quality gems for stupid amount of money. Idk who was worse Lab Mafia or Heist lol

"

NasusPodInta wrote:

I don't mind if Heist is gonna die. Heist Mafia ruined game for all of us by selling alternate quality gems for stupid amount of money. Idk who was worse Lab Mafia or Heist lol

you could always just run the content yourself, you know..

"

ArtCrusade wrote:

"

NasusPodInta wrote:

I don't mind if Heist is gonna die. Heist Mafia ruined game for all of us by selling alternate quality gems for stupid amount of money. Idk who was worse Lab Mafia or Heist lol

you could always just run the content yourself, you know..

Sure, but given Gecko's post, that's running a lot of worthless contracts just to work up the markers to have a chance at finding the alt quality gem you wanted. Could you buy the markers and skip it? Yes, but not running contracts also means not building up room reveals, so you'll have to spend even more on fully identified blueprints. Either way, it's still only a chance at getting what you want, and there's no guarantee you'll get back what you spent to run the blueprint.

This is still a concern even after alt quality gems got removed, except now the main value are those exceedingly rare and overpriced amulet bases.

None of this helps the fact that Heist is falling to the wayside, especially with the lack of scarabs to compensate for the removed sextants.

"

Pizzarugi wrote:

"

ArtCrusade wrote:

"

NasusPodInta wrote:

I don't mind if Heist is gonna die. Heist Mafia ruined game for all of us by selling alternate quality gems for stupid amount of money. Idk who was worse Lab Mafia or Heist lol

you could always just run the content yourself, you know..

Sure, but given Gecko's post, that's running a lot of worthless contracts just to work up the markers to have a chance at finding the alt quality gem you wanted. Could you buy the markers and skip it? Yes, but not running contracts also means not building up room reveals, so you'll have to spend even more on fully identified blueprints. Either way, it's still only a chance at getting what you want, and there's no guarantee you'll get back what you spent to run the blueprint.

This is still a concern even after alt quality gems got removed, except now the main value are those exceedingly rare and overpriced amulet bases.

None of this helps the fact that Heist is falling to the wayside, especially with the lack of scarabs to compensate for the removed sextants.

No build needs a Simplex amulet to function.

But rest assured, those amulets actually will be less rare in 3.24 because there will be div cards for them.

Just to make it clear: I will be heisting no matter what.
But I feel like some people miss the implications from this oversight.

Heist ist pretty niche by now which means you have to pay a premium for the Heist exclusive drops you might need.
With every other mechanic getting changes and Heist being left in the dust, this could lead to even fewer people farming Heist, while the need for some high value Replicas and the Orbs remains mostly untouched (Maybe it even rises as Orbs have chances for white Sockets, and the White Craft from Vorici is gone).
Prices for Heist related Drops could go up quite significant.
On the other side if I end up spending 5 Chaos extra per map to run as many blueprints as I can, I will price that into each and every Trade for those Tailoring/Tempering Orbs and every Replica I will put onto the market. This is likely to raise prices by maybe a 15% for more common drops like Orbs but high value Amuletts and Replicas could end up costing way more then before.

Even if you dont wanna play Heist or dislike the content, I feel it is not wise to disregard the problem of Heist not getting touched by the patchnotes as other content did because if you ever end up needing a heist drop you might end up playing a premium for that as a direct result.