Least your balence team GGG isn't bad as Blizzards.

"

DarthSki44 wrote:

But D4 is actually out, and did not miss. Now the pressure is all on GGG for July and Exilecon. As I have said before the silence on PoE 4.0 has drifted into confusion and misinformation, so this is a vital presentation to manage player expectations. At the very least it will be nice to see and hear things in an official capacity (for good or bad)

All that said, D4 is too big to fail, where as GGG can't fuck up this expansion. GGG needs to tread carefully while D4 will probably be north of a Billion dollars by Exilecon. Nobody here has to worry about Blizzard and D4's survival, they should be concerned about PoE and GGG. At least I would be.

There's still room for both to fail. Sure, Blizzard did great with their initial sales. Since then it's been non-stop nerfs to every class that was actually fun to play, and continual nerfs to density. If they keep going you're going to see single mobs spread out with 5 minutes of travel between them.

I'm exaggerating, but barely. Their current focus is to keep it from overwhelming people who haven't played an ARPG game in their life, but they're on track to make it boring for everyone, noobs included.

"

Destructodave wrote:

And for D4 stans, lets be real; those are PoE players. They are disgruntled PoE players. No D4 stans are coming to this backwater, tiny forum to make posts about D4. They would at least go to reddit for that. Its mostly PoE players disgruntled with the current state of PoE. Maybe they are playing a bit of D4 now, maybe its not as good as they hoped so now they have to just sit and eat crow and wait on the next bit of forum ammunition they can use. But we are definitely putting way too much stock into this tiny little forum where even I can remember someone like I_NO spamming D3 posts all day everyday for a decade.

That's not entirely true. There's a pretty good chunk of PoE players that were D3 players, and that very well could happen again.

The issue is that PoE has had the exact opposite problem of the Diablo series. It started off in a great place, especially compared to D3. At that time we'd make comparisons to the ridiculous numbers in D3 and talk trash in the forums.

Here we are in Crucible with builds that can one shot ubers. That's what, 50,000,000 in a single hit?

So many mechanics, affixes, etc have been added since PoE was in beta that the complexity has gone through the roof and ability to balance anything out the window. And more often than not, huge nerfs seem to target things so broadly that it impacts the average player just as much as the edge cases, rather than just targeting the extreme .1%. In all honesty, it seems GGG is making the same mistakes as Blizzard sometimes. Only instead of focusing on the least skilled players when making adjustments, they're focused on the ridiculous things no life streamers are doing. Both to the detriment of the core player base.

D4 was definitely a step up from D3, but not really what the older Diablo vets were looking for.

PoE 2 could be great, and could provide something for older jaded Diablo vets. There's still room for problems though, especially since it's being built on top of everything that's already there.

D4 is indeed too big to fail, it already was a finantial success

Hardly a surprise, honestly

It also scored remarkable mediocre on users rating, critics obviously gave it tons of perfect scores gushing how its "the best game from blizzard ever", and users reviews fluctuate between chilling, hating, but mostly "its not bad, but its agressively mediocre"

Again, completely predictable

EA already proved some companies can live on the back of nothing but name(even command conquer 4 was a finantial success), no matter how tarnished or how much crap they put out. People will flock to mainstream stuff in droves, nothing new

And... yeah, tons of people bought the game knowing it was gonna be mediocre and, well... you got what you asked for...

We live in a weird age where people protest against stuff by... sponsoring the thing?... i recall many streamers protested against DI by buying packs until they got some super rare item from the lootboxes and then destroiyng the item in "protest against the monetarization", like... after you already forked the cash for the lootboxes? huh... okaaay?

People today can be real weird on how they spend money...

x

"

LowBudget780 wrote:

"

feike wrote:

People today can be real weird on how they spend money...

I knew Diablo 4 was going to be mediocre going into it but for the price tag I still enjoyed playing through the campaign.

The problem with modern gamers is that they are completely unrealistic in regards to what they should expect from something like a video game that costs under 100 dollars.

You want ok seats to see a band? 100-200+ Dollars for a 2 hour show.
You want to see a movie? 30-35 dollars with refreshments.
Dinner at half decent steakhouse? 80 dollars.

Sometimes it costs me like 20 dollars just to park my car downtown.

I think I got around 60 hours of playtime out of D4 so for the price, it was still a good value. It's just an objectively bad game made by the McDonalds of video game companies so to expect something serious or long-term is completely delusional.

Game prices have not kept up with production costs and inflation. Its crazy that gamers cant realize this. I mean we were paying 50 bucks for a game in the 90s, 60 in the early 2000s. Hell, N64 games were like 80 bucks.

I mean at the time a game cost me 50 bucks, I was still paying .85 cents a gallon for gas in HS. Let that sink in.

So game costs have went up 10-20 bucks in 20-25 years? Meanwhile Gas prices have tripled to quadrupled, on top of other things.

And people scoff at game prices, saying their are getting ripped off. Microtransactions are a direct result of companies keeping a game 50-60 bucks, or being F2p.

For all the bad things people complain about, game prices are by far one of the more absurd ones. They have been relatively unchanged, compared to most things, for 2 decades.

x

"

LowBudget780 wrote:

Ye, gaming is a super cheap hobby in 2023 even if you factor in the PC.

Entertainment in general has not suffered inflaction nearly as much as other aspects of life. If we talk raw cost-effectiveness, books are unmatched, tvs are more acessible than ever, music is straight up free even if you feel above pirating, movies costs next to nothing if you dont absolutely need to see on theaters. Some wise guy mentioned years ago that eletronics always becomes cheaper over time and since more and more of entertainment is coming from eletronics...

What increased was mostly luxury: Live shows, conventions and the like

I would still say its silly to pay for a product you know its gonna be mediocre when theres metric tons of awesome titles that you could get more paying far less unless youre super rich and money is trully not a factor, kinda like buying stuff on a store you know its overpriced just because you dont need to walk another block dont really makes much sense if you drive anything below a ferrari

I guess minding where your money goes is not rule and its just easier to just go for AAA rather than search on indie titles for good stuff

Its not just blizzard hating, take valk elysium, sits on a near red user score on steam despite being also fairly decent all things -save price- considered. Paying premium price for a mediocre product is still silly, even if it didnt made you take a loan to not get evicted

"

Game prices have not kept up with production costs and inflation. Its crazy that gamers cant realize this. I mean we were paying 50 bucks for a game in the 90s, 60 in the early 2000s. Hell, N64 games were like 80 bucks.

I mean at the time a game cost me 50 bucks, I was still paying .85 cents a gallon for gas in HS. Let that sink in.

So game costs have went up 10-20 bucks in 20-25 years? Meanwhile Gas prices have tripled to quadrupled, on top of other things.

And people scoff at game prices, saying their are getting ripped off. Microtransactions are a direct result of companies keeping a game 50-60 bucks, or being F2p.

For all the bad things people complain about, game prices are by far one of the more absurd ones. They have been relatively unchanged, compared to most things, for 2 decades.

Diablo 4 made its development money back in 5 days. They could sell it for 10 bucks and would still make profit. And this is without future expansion, battle passes and any mtx.

LOL GG nerfs are the same like all of them. D4 is fun I hope seasons dont overlap so I can play both

"

Destructodave wrote:

"

鬼殺し wrote:

This really is a live and let live situation but as the poor Wolcen devs said by way of defending their implicit move to maintenance mode, DIV will suck all the oxygen out of the room for a few months. It's not a question of whether or not people talk about it, but how. As proven by the OP, whom I genuinely thought would have known better than to compare PoE and DIV. But nope. Everyone is gonna have an opinion on this one.

Meanwhile plenty of DIV players probably haven't even heard of Path of Exile which I imagine is how everyone likes it. :)

OP has been making posts flaming Diablo on this forum for like a decade, lol. I can leave and randomly come back at various times, and she will have some diablo bashing thread up. You have to admire the dedication.

If anything she has been waiting on this moment as long as the most die-hard Diablo fan has. Gonna be a ton of these over the next few years.

PoE and Diablo remind me of Dota and LoL. One is almost oblivious to the other's existence, meanwhile one of them cant keep the other out of their heads.

Both are amazing games, but one set of fans always seems to have an inferiority complex about the other.

And for D4 stans, lets be real; those are PoE players. They are disgruntled PoE players. No D4 stans are coming to this backwater, tiny forum to make posts about D4. They would at least go to reddit for that. Its mostly PoE players disgruntled with the current state of PoE. Maybe they are playing a bit of D4 now, maybe its not as good as they hoped so now they have to just sit and eat crow and wait on the next bit of forum ammunition they can use. But we are definitely putting way too much stock into this tiny little forum where even I can remember someone like I_NO spamming D3 posts all day everyday for a decade.

Uh...I'm Charan. This is my phone account. The name is "Onigoroshi" in Japanese...I know I_NO. Fun fact: she has a drop bear pet, from back when we were a little less apathetic towards each other. Anyway you might have known but for clarity's sake there it is.

I genuinely did hope she'd grown out of the diablo bashing but eh, people don't really change. Which leads me into the real point here: I was "stanning" Diablo last millennium. Path of Exile was always a detour for me. Bloody expensive one but no regrets. It was unspoken that when or if Blizzard made a Diablo that made me happy, I would resume my original stance as a Diablo diehard. But this is, like or not, my internet home. Just because I no longer play the game for which it was made, that doesn't mean ten years of interaction and getting to "know" people just get shoved aside.

So...agreed re PoE players "stanning" DIV. Myself included, although I try keep it to Off Topic where it belongs.

While this entire thread is bait.

I will bite a bit and say this:

Some of you LOVE to ignore the many many many many wrongs they have done to gems, skills, ascendencies, items, league mechanics, drops and so on..

You think TGGG balance is good?