[2.2] Elemental Minigun - Melt the screen for 1 Exalt - CoC Quill Rain

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Mothren wrote:

Test this, you'll see what your real average proc rate is in just 1 hour of testing.

Aside from you thinking that his calculations are wrong, which they might as well be - what are your recommendations on what he/we could be doing better with this build?

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Fetus wrote:

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Mothren wrote:

Test this, you'll see what your real average proc rate is in just 1 hour of testing.

Aside from you thinking that his calculations are wrong, which they might as well be - what are your recommendations on what he/we could be doing better with this build?

Quill Rain barrage based builds perform well with any kind of setup. Just wanted to right wrongs about build's capability.

Mathil just published CoCSpray build. LiftingNerdBro has a CoC Quill Rain Assassin build on Shadow forums. They can be checked for improvements.

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Hi, I'm trying this build and find it fun to play.

I don't understand why you use EK instead of Magma Orb. EK has a low range and Magma Orb was taking advantage of Elemental Equilibrium.

Could you explain your choice?

In my theory-crafting Magma Orb seemed perfect; it's projectile, and a single one at that, so my build would give it Elemental Equilibrium and also double the total number of projectiles. EK would only go from 9 to 10 projectiles, which is nothing really, and wouldn't benefit from EE. However, actually having tested both extensively, EK is better. Largely for 1 simple reason; GGG didn't make Magma Orb scale in any way with Increased Projectile Speed, not in range or speed, so the balls are simply too slow. They mess up bosses just fine but they won't even get to a pack before the pack is dead in most cases. In addition, due to not being able to "shotgun" any longer, each bounce of Magma can still hit only once to each enemy even with 2 projectiles; EK also hits only once but in a GIANT fan in front of you, essentially hitting every single mob. Test both and see, but I prefer EK, though not by a lot.

Another thing to consider is reflect rares; with Magma Orb you are more likely to die from Ele reflect but are immune to Phys reflect. With EK and the other spells you take damage from all kinds of reflect but are less likely to die to ele, which I think is overall better.

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Mothren wrote:

Mathil just published CoCSpray build. LiftingNerdBro has a CoC Quill Rain Assassin build on Shadow forums. They can be checked for improvements.

Up until this post I didn't have a problem with any of your other posts, but that one made you sound like an asshole. "Oh how could he improve? Check out these popular streamers versions cuz they are obviously better but I won't give any specifics."

Funny thing is, their versions are a work in progress, too. Mathil, for example, uses 2 Volley Fire and I just demonstrated that using a second is a waste, despite the fact in the mind it seems like an awesome choice.

In addition, neither of the other guides I saw put any focus into Accuracy, which is a mathematical mistake, unless they are somehow bypassing the 2nd accuracy check of critical strikes that I don't know about, in which case I would love to learn so I can get some passives back.

Give me some factual examples of how their versions are better or don't post shit like that; you got on my case for not posting the facts, so now I'll get on yours for the same thing. I don't mind constructive criticism; I do mind you making claims that my guide is inferior without any evidence, thus being hypocritical.

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Fetus wrote:

Aside from you thinking that his calculations are wrong, which they might as well be - what are your recommendations on what he/we could be doing better with this build?

He was partially right. My calculations were off from theory-crafting to reality. This is, I assume, due to Volley Fire adding too many simultaneous crits. The real number of spells per second on a large group is more like 45 (15 of each spell) as I demonstrated in the Blade Vortex test video. I am open to constructive criticism so if you have some feedback please let me know.

I am also incredibly familiar with both Mathil's versions and LiftingNerdBro's versions, and I believe mine to still just as good or better after analyzing (and seeing if there were improvements I could steal for my own build!). In the end it will probably amount to personal preference.

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Vaalamity wrote:

Up until this post I didn't have a problem with any of your other posts, but that one made you sound like an asshole. "Oh how could he improve? Check out these popular streamers versions cuz they are obviously better but I won't give any specifics."

Funny thing is, their versions are a work in progress, too. Mathil, for example, uses 2 Volley Fire and I just demonstrated that using a second is a waste, despite the fact in the mind it seems like an awesome choice.

In addition, neither of the other guides I saw put any focus into Accuracy, which is a mathematical mistake, unless they are somehow bypassing the 2nd accuracy check of critical strikes that I don't know about, in which case I would love to learn so I can get some passives back.

Give me some factual examples of how their versions are better or don't post shit like that; you got on my case for not posting the facts, so now I'll get on yours for the same thing. I don't mind constructive criticism; I do mind you making claims that my guide is inferior without any evidence, thus being hypocritical.

Will only delve into the constructive criticsm part and make sure a misunderstanding is fixed:

Shortly, what I said is that their build guides "can be checked for improvements". Your build does some stuff better, their builds have some neat ideas as well. I did not say their builds are "better".

Mathil for example uses diamond flask (which you mentioned in the CoC replies but its not in your flasks spoiler) to double check crits and uses only 80% critical strike chance. He did some hard bosses like daresso with the setup, though a bit slowly and with only 4.7k hp. Streamers generally do many builds, and while they have good ideas, they generally don't take time to fully optimize their builds. Therefore, more passionate people about their builds do this hard work.

MatrixFactor for example did a Hybrid Cyclone CoCDischarge way better than Mathil's old Fakener in patch 2.0. He combined ideas here and there and put his own effort to go hybrid and do seemingly imposibble bosses like double vaal temple with ele weakness temp chains etc. That was what I suggested.

Edit: I edited my previous post about 50 spirits in 3 seconds and 20 spirits in the first 1 second of firing into a large pack. Writing from mobile quickly, I skipped over some numerical facts, fixed to avoid misinforming people.

Edit 2: For the youtube links, to make them clickable and to give a description, you can do this:
(url=youtube.com/blablabla)This link goes to youtube about 15 procs per second proof(/url)
You will replace ( with [ and ) with ] though.

To OP and the guy with the EK comment.

After trying Magma Orbs, it's too slow, so even with EK doing about 30% less damage on tooltip it's actually faster in dps. With magma orb a lot of times mods will die to AB and Spark before MO could deal damage and with such a high projectile speed magma orb will skip many mobs sometimes without dealing damage.

A few ways you can do at this point...

1. You can run herald of ash which gives EK 15% more damage added as fire (and some minor overkill aoe) which will then work properly with elemental equilibrium trifecta...

or

2. You can run hatred which will give EK a shitload of cold DPS, then switch out arctic breathe for fireball instead.

or

3. Have +fire damage somewhere and use barrage to proc EE, and use EK raw as pure physical.

Option 1 is medium dps and only 25% mana reserved.
Option 2 is the maximum dps possible at the cost of reserving half of your mana.
Option 3 is the lowest dps but easiest and do not require any chance/mana reservation.

I tried all 3, just an idea. So enjoy.

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Mothren wrote:

Will only delve into the constructive criticsm part and make sure a misunderstanding is fixed:

Shortly, what I said is that their build guides "can be checked for improvements". Your build does some stuff better, their builds have some neat ideas as well. I did not say their builds are "better".

Mathil for example uses diamond flask (which you mentioned in the CoC replies but its not in your flasks spoiler) to double check crits and uses only 80% critical strike chance. He did some hard bosses like daresso with the setup, though a bit slowly and with only 4.7k hp. Streamers generally do many builds, and while they have good ideas, they generally don't take time to fully optimize their builds. Therefore, more passionate people about their builds do this hard work.

MatrixFactor for example did a Hybrid Cyclone CoCDischarge way better than Mathil's old Fakener in patch 2.0. He combined ideas here and there and put his own effort to go hybrid and do seemingly imposibble bosses like double vaal temple with ele weakness temp chains etc. That was what I suggested.

Edit: I edited my previous post about 50 spirits in 3 seconds and 20 spirits in the first 1 second of firing into a large pack. Writing from mobile quickly, I skipped over some numerical facts, fixed to avoid misinforming people.

Edit 2: For the youtube links, to make them clickable and to give a description, you can do this:
(url=youtube.com/blablabla)This link goes to youtube about 15 procs per second proof(/url)
You will replace ( with [ and ) with ] though.

Thank your for the coding links; As is pretty obvious, I'm new to posting videos and I apologize for the shitty quality, as it's all my old toaster PC can do. I will update those, thank you.

As to the builds, perhaps I just took it wrong but I didn't hear the "you do somethings better" part in your original post, so it just sounded to me like you were saying "if you want better versions, look here."

As for Diamond Flask, I do use one also, but I am broke and I didn't want to roll my flasks yet; I think in the Gorge video I'm using a totally unrolled, POS Diamond flask lol.

If you have more suggestions about how to make the build better I'm all ears. I really don't mind constructive criticism; it helps move things forward the fastest after all. Cheers.

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Pewzor wrote:

To OP and the guy with the EK comment.

After trying Magma Orbs, it's too slow, so even with EK doing about 30% less damage on tooltip it's actually faster in dps. With magma orb a lot of times mods will die to AB and Spark before MO could deal damage and with such a high projectile speed magma orb will skip many mobs sometimes without dealing damage.

A few ways you can do at this point...

1. You can run herald of ash which gives EK 15% more damage added as fire (and some minor overkill aoe) which will then work properly with elemental equilibrium trifecta...

or

2. You can run hatred which will give EK a shitload of cold DPS, then switch out arctic breathe for fireball instead.

or

3. Have +fire damage somewhere and use barrage to proc EE, and use EK raw as pure physical.

Option 1 is medium dps and only 25% mana reserved.
Option 2 is the maximum dps possible at the cost of reserving half of your mana.
Option 3 is the lowest dps but easiest and do not require any chance/mana reservation.

I tried all 3, just an idea. So enjoy.

Very interesting ideas here, but I have some comments about them:

1) Herald of Ash is not worth using; this is for a couple of reasons. First, it only adds Overkill DoT from ATTACKS, not spells, so the really big reason to use this spell is null and void. 2) Adding some damage to one spell is not really worth it, especially since you would need to either use a high level Enlighten or sacrifice Arctic Armor or Grace to do so. The damage it adds isn't even noticible without the Overkill procs, but the survivability of Arctic Armor and Grace are huge (especially without Kaom's. More on Kaom's later, as I finally got one).

2) I don't think Hatred is a good move, either. Again, you are sacrificing VERY good defence auras for damage to only ONE of the three spells; the damage is negligible, the defensive auras are not. In addition, even if you go this route I wouldn't switch out AB for Fireball. The reason is it isn't needed to proc EE, really, and EE doesn't stack. So hitting a mob with cold and fire both doesn't equal = -100% resists. So just Ice and Cold rotating are enough to keep EE procced and gain the benefit and the chilled ground all over from AB is really a huge survivability upgrade. Combined with Maim, monsters are slowed by 50-60% (I can't find the math if it's additive or multiplicative).

3) This is absolutely ideal, and if I wasn't so ridiculously restricted on the mods of the few rares I have I would recommend it. Adding flat fire to your character would mean Barrage cycles EE too, making it next to impossible to ever have EE proc against you (that is, multiple cold or lightning spells hitting the same mob in a row). In reality, it would be very hard to do if you go for the Seven League Step / Kaom's Heart road, as this really only leaves you with 2 rares; Belt and Amulet. To get all of the necessary resists, INT (Ideally) and if Kaom's also STR, fire damage is just a cutesy mod that is a bonus. It really isn't needed (though having the very first hit from every spell be to an EE weakened mob would be nice) and INT/STR/resists/HP are all far more important.

Cool you tested so many ideas, though. Which did you end up sticking with?

I personally feel Grace/Arctic Armor is the best bang for the buck.

Another option that I have considered but don't feel worth it us to use Alpha's Howl and another aura. There is really nothing to add, though, except Purtiy of Elements which would free up some resists so you could instead stack all your stats (INT/STR) on belt and amulet, saving some passive nodes. I might add that as an alternative on second though, as it's a viable but more defensive option.

I master crafted add fire damage to my amulet.
So I did 3, using barrage to cycle EE.

Grace and AA for aura.

That being said option 1 isn't terrible the more I think about it... especially if you are lazy and likes to facetank stuff... you can drop grace, run blasphemy enfeeble + AA + Ash and has like 80 mana left but that doesn't really stop u from doing anything because thief's torment with barrage with a quill rain lol.

The thing with running Ash is that even tho it doesnt add much damage at all but since EE doesnt have any effect to EK's primary damage you have both barrage AND EK forcing cold/lightning vulnerability... which ideally means mobs will be twice more often to have cold & lightning weakness up while ur EK still doing its full damage (ignoring the ash damage here since they are just bonus and is not significant) your other 2 spells will do their 50% more damage twice as often... you get what I mean here? I think it's a legit option...

I didn't do the full math but the more I think about it, #1's dps might just blow away all other combinations... You lose some evasion but you will have a full time enfeeble aura up, with your AB/FP/Spark doing 50% more damage TWICE as often. Just an idea, I will run this for a few levels and see how it works.

I compared to my buddy's Ass/Zerker build...
The raw dps in this setup srsly blew away the popular "the Real King of the Hill Assa/Zerker CoC". Between 100% increased projectile damage from Drillneck, 50% more damage for 2 of your 3 main spells from Elemental Equilibrium, 30% distance bonus from deadeye, free extra projectile for arctic breathe (or Freezing Pulse)...

cost of this build in comparison is very low hp (since only 3 rare slots) if you don't run Koams Heart, and the fact that Ass/zerker has free life leech which means they pretty much never die... Thief's Torment works fine for life gain on hit but we can't facetank bosses like Ass/zerker variation with high hp as well as vaal pact and huge free life leech.

So the options are there, I totally recommend this variation if you are dps whore like me. But without koam's heart you have to play cautiously. The ideal setup would be 6L quill rain + koam's.

I actually used this build for Perandus! I started about a week ago, but it was pretty rough starting off with no starter equipment. The biggest stretch was from 40-65, Blast Rain was really the only way to get through it.

This build can pretty much be 1 ex. It really picked up after getting key components.
Notably, I actually used Blood Dance + Blood Rage, and a Herald of Thunder + Curse on Hit + Assassin's Mark. This allows me to just solely use barrage. The constant Herald of Thunder AoE + Spark shocks can give reliable power charges.

With the spare sockets, I have Ice Golem + Faster attack + blind + GMP, just for maybe if it becomes useful.

I still have 4 spare slots, and tabula. I plan on 6 linking the Quill and finding something to do with the chest piece!


This build is incredibly strong, no lie. It becomes insanely powerful ASAP you get equipment for it. You really don't need to do anything but hold right click and watch your computer lag.

Hi I looked at your build and was very excited and intrigued to see a cheap and fun yet strong build i have a lvl 40 scion left over from the Perandus league that i never respect so i was thinking of giving a CoC build a go and yours looked best

I just wanted to ask if it is still viable in 2.3.1 and what to go into with my ascendancy points after the change

please reply and thank you for the cool build