[2.5] Death's Kiss, a Trickster Essence Drain/Contagion full build and leveling guide

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Completed 40 ChallengesBada_Bing wrote:
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Completed 29 ChallengesVulpix0r wrote:
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Completed 25 Challenges360 wrote:
Hi, really like your build guide :)

Was just wondering why you use poison as fifth link since the skill deals no poison damage on its own and the applied poison from the support gem does not spread as far as I know.


http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Poison_%28support_gem%29
The Poison gem deals 10% of the hit's chaos and physical damage as chaos damage per second, and lasts 2 seconds by default. I think it's still worth a link.


But the poison only applies to the chaos damage of the initial hit, not the chaos dot (which is the main damage). Slower projectiles/empower would therefore be a better choice unless one is using binos for poison spread 'n stack.


I don't really need the ED spread to do more damage most of the time, the poison stacks really helps against single target. Most of the time for blues and trash packs the damage Contagion spread, but I want my ED to do more damage if I encounter a rare monster. I tried Empower with Slower Projectiles, and I found the single target damage to be kinda lacking.
Poison support effectively only adds 30 dps degen times your modifiers. Poison only adds 10% of EDs roughly 300 damage. This makes it much worse than any other support which adds additional/more damage.

A leveled empower would strictly be better.

Iron will may be better than any number of supports depending on your strength.

Quality faster projectiles isnt bad. Less damage, but you can more reliably land a shot.

Finally, trap or remote mine may seem to be the very best support it... but for some odd reason it doesnt currently work with it.

For years i searched for deep truths. A thousand revelations. At the very edge...the ability to think itself dissolves away.Thinking in human language is the problem. Any separation from 'the whole truth' is incomplete.My incomplete concepts may add to your 'whole truth', accept it or think about it
Last edited by SkyCore on Dec 29, 2015 11:32:39 AM
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Completed 19 ChallengesSkyCore wrote:
Poison support effectively only adds 30 dps degen times your modifiers. Poison only adds 10% of EDs roughly 300 damage. This makes it much worse than any other support which adds additional/more damage.

A leveled empower would strictly be better.

Iron will may be better than any number of supports depending on your strength.

Quality faster projectiles isnt bad. Less damage, but you can more reliably land a shot.

Finally, trap or remote mine may seem to be the very best support it... but for some odd reason it doesnt currently work with it.



I'll try an empower, but mine is only level 2 sadly.
Thanks for the build and detailed leveling guide! I'll be trying this out on my first guy in Talisman today!
Well hello Mister Fancypants. Well, I've got news for you pal, you ain't leadin' but two things right now: Jack and shit... and Jack left town.
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Completed 19 ChallengesSkyCore wrote:
Poison support effectively only adds 30 dps degen times your modifiers. Poison only adds 10% of EDs roughly 300 damage. This makes it much worse than any other support which adds additional/more damage.

A leveled empower would strictly be better.

Iron will may be better than any number of supports depending on your strength.

Quality faster projectiles isnt bad. Less damage, but you can more reliably land a shot.

Finally, trap or remote mine may seem to be the very best support it... but for some odd reason it doesnt currently work with it.



Poison Damage calculation:

Spoiler
The base damage per second dealt by a given application of poison equals 10% of the physical and chaos damage dealt by the hit which applied that particular instance of poison.[1]

In general—because poison is a damage over time effect that deals chaos damage—its damage is affected by Stats that modify Chaos Damage, Damage Over Time and Poison Damage.[1]

If poison is applied by a projectile, then its damage is also modified by the Projectile Damage stat.[1] Source: http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Poison


So it is not just "10%", it is 10% + any multiplier that effect also Essence Drain, (I´m not sure if Spell Dmg also effect the Poison,cause Essence drain says that all dots also profitate from Spell Dmg) So it is a really really hugh singeltargetdps multiplier, even if the Target doesn´t survive the full 3 secounds of the Poision Duration.
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Completed 13 ChallengesSeelenernt wrote:



Poison Damage calculation:

Spoiler
The base damage per second dealt by a given application of poison equals 10% of the physical and chaos damage dealt by the hit which applied that particular instance of poison.[1]

In general—because poison is a damage over time effect that deals chaos damage—its damage is affected by Stats that modify Chaos Damage, Damage Over Time and Poison Damage.[1]

If poison is applied by a projectile, then its damage is also modified by the Projectile Damage stat.[1] Source: http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Poison


So it is not just "10%", it is 10% + any multiplier that effect also Essence Drain, (I´m not sure if Spell Dmg also effect the Poison,cause Essence drain says that all dots also profitate from Spell Dmg) So it is a really really hugh singeltargetdps multiplier, even if the Target doesn´t survive the full 3 secounds of the Poision Duration.


Thing is, any 'more damage' support also will gain all those same modifiers with the exception of poison. Empower is effectively a more multiplier if you ignore flat added damage (which noone would run on such a spell anyway). Going from a level 20 ED to a level 22 is a boost of 23% more base damage. Which is much better than 10%.

Additionally, that 10% damage from poison suport is applied to ED's first hit which is relatively weak in comparison to its degen (800 base degen per second). At level 20: EDs first hit averages only 300 base damage, which means 30 poison damage before scaling. Now granted that 30 damage gets scaled massively and is a considerable increase in damage as opposed to to not using that link, but it's not enough to push it above the dps of using empower instead.

If you were to throw bino's into the equasion there would be good reason to run poison support. Otherwise, not so much.
For years i searched for deep truths. A thousand revelations. At the very edge...the ability to think itself dissolves away.Thinking in human language is the problem. Any separation from 'the whole truth' is incomplete.My incomplete concepts may add to your 'whole truth', accept it or think about it
Last edited by SkyCore on Dec 30, 2015 8:29:39 PM
Totally agreed with all the things u wrote on the build.

Im doing self-found essense drain for the same reason u chose, tested if its fun or not. Its the story 1 week before, now im at lvl 90 with totally trashy and self found gear.

Low budget build but can tank almost the high tier maps. Killed Crema Boss, Orchard,Academy,... excep Excavation.

The higher u contagion the mob packs, u will get life regen based on 0.5% of your DPS,that causes sometimes i hit 1000 life regen--> totally awesome.

Fortify helsp 20% reduced dmg, artic armour, chaos golem, immortal call, curse and 1k life regen make u the beast also.

Currently at 5L: i have 13k DPS, 6.1k life, 420 life regen without contagion, res capped
But pretty annoying when doing maps with groups since u dont have too much clear speed.

And let me ask you my question: How the fk u get that 6l OMG, im dying here to grab one.

Spoiler
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uTun1 wrote:
Totally agreed with all the things u wrote on the build.

Im doing self-found essense drain for the same reason u chose, tested if its fun or not. Its the story 1 week before, now im at lvl 90 with totally trashy and self found gear.

Low budget build but can tank almost the high tier maps. Killed Crema Boss, Orchard,Academy,... excep Excavation.

The higher u contagion the mob packs, u will get life regen based on 0.5% of your DPS,that causes sometimes i hit 1000 life regen--> totally awesome.

Fortify helsp 20% reduced dmg, artic armour, chaos golem, immortal call, curse and 1k life regen make u the beast also.

Currently at 5L: i have 13k DPS, 6.1k life, 420 life regen without contagion, res capped
But pretty annoying when doing maps with groups since u dont have too much clear speed.

And let me ask you my question: How the fk u get that 6l OMG, im dying here to grab one.

Spoiler


Trying not to brag here, but I randomly threw 1 fuse to this 6 socket drop (it's a nice base) and it 6Led. Spent 120 chaos to get the current stats. Any reason why you're using Poison instead of Slower Projectiles?
Last edited by Vulpix0r on Dec 31, 2015 1:39:26 AM
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Completed 19 ChallengesSkyCore wrote:
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Completed 13 ChallengesSeelenernt wrote:



Poison Damage calculation:

Spoiler
The base damage per second dealt by a given application of poison equals 10% of the physical and chaos damage dealt by the hit which applied that particular instance of poison.[1]

In general—because poison is a damage over time effect that deals chaos damage—its damage is affected by Stats that modify Chaos Damage, Damage Over Time and Poison Damage.[1]

If poison is applied by a projectile, then its damage is also modified by the Projectile Damage stat.[1] Source: http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Poison


So it is not just "10%", it is 10% + any multiplier that effect also Essence Drain, (I´m not sure if Spell Dmg also effect the Poison,cause Essence drain says that all dots also profitate from Spell Dmg) So it is a really really hugh singeltargetdps multiplier, even if the Target doesn´t survive the full 3 secounds of the Poision Duration.


Thing is, any 'more damage' support also will gain all those same modifiers with the exception of poison. Empower is effectively a more multiplier if you ignore flat added damage (which noone would run on such a spell anyway). Going from a level 20 ED to a level 22 is a boost of 23% more base damage. Which is much better than 10%.

Additionally, that 10% damage from poison suport is applied to ED's first hit which is relatively weak in comparison to its degen (800 base degen per second). At level 20: EDs first hit averages only 300 base damage, which means 30 poison damage before scaling. Now granted that 30 damage gets scaled massively and is a considerable increase in damage as opposed to to not using that link, but it's not enough to push it above the dps of using empower instead.

If you were to throw bino's into the equasion there would be good reason to run poison support. Otherwise, not so much.


Alright, so I've been testing out Poison vs Empower, and I can see an increased rate of degen when I connect my 2nd and 3rd ED projectile, while I do not notice that without poison gem support. I'm conflicted, I don't know whether to recommend Empower or Poison for a 6th link.

The Poison support gems makes the ED feels very much like a "poison" build because seeing the increase degen everytime your projectile hit feels pretty good. I don't see this with Empower, but mine was only a level 2 one.

Should I be recommending something else instead of Poison?
What do you think about Carcass Jack and Bino's?

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