How do mages work?

First of all, I have attempted to read stickies to glean the answer to this; I apologize if it's a repost. If it has been posted, I'm afraid I don't understand the information really.

So, I'm having a lot of fun with the game so far; glitches and issues aside, it's a great game and worthy spiritual successor to Diablo II. However, I'm having trouble somewhat due to the mind-bogglingly huge passive tree and such. I've managed to get a Ranger character into Cruel, and making progress in Act III again on that, and generally speaking she's doing alright. Could probably use more MP but she's doing respectably well. However, I've always loved playing the Wizard in RPGs the most (and melee the least really). But while generally speaking I can figure out what the various classes are supposed to do (for example, the ranger kills things with bows, templar with melee, easy enough) but I'll be damned if I can figure out how to properly play a wizard. I've started about three different mages; two witches and a scion. However, I never seem to get very far.

My first mage seems to have gotten the farthest of any class; my build with her was essentially to beeline for Fire Damage nodes and Spell Damage. I didn't pick up nodes for necromancy spells, but I did use them, mostly as a magic "hey look over there" button, great for distracting enemies long enough for me to drop endless spam of Firestorm. That got me through most of the game, but by the end of Act III attempting to ascend the Sceptre of God I hit a wall because my minions, even buffed with Minion Life and Damage, would die instantly and I'd find myself swarmed and with no way to overcome (having skipped ice spells and the like).

So, I started a new character, this time a Scion, but I found it frustrating that I didn't have a straightforward firing spell like Fireball, and how far the damage nodes were from me, so I stopped. I tried again with another witch, this time being an all around elementalist rather than just a pyromancer, but that fell flat very quickly.

So, I wonder, is the Witch supposed to primarily be a summoner class, and her spells just a backup? It makes sense I suppose, given the phenomenally short tree if you stick to one element (for example, Fireball, Firestorm, Incinerate), but is there a way to primarily play a DPS mage? Keep in mind of course that about all of my play is solo, so I can't rely on buffs from other players etc.

I don't want to step onto the soapbox because I see more than enough of that going on here already, but I've gotta say, I really wish this game had some later-game spells that worked better. I take as an example your average progression in, say, D&D; the Wizard starts off extremely vulnerable and weak, yes, but by the high levels it's said that they don't even engage opponents directly, but alter entire battlefields. A high level mage can cause meteors to fall, earthquakes, floods, or massive lightning to strike. Actually, a high level Sorceress in Diablo II can do a lot of that too. That's kinda what I like about playing a mage character; someone who starts off small but can later devastate hordes of enemies at will. I'm not saying every game should be the same, and I certainly find the system in Path of Exile very interesting and fun; just wish the magic had a bit more depth.

The TL;DR version I suppose is: What areas could I specialize in to maximize my playability as a mage, while still satisfying my power cravings and pyromania?

EDIT: I just realized that equipment is at least as important as the passives I go for if not more so. As it is right now, I spent my time attempting to maximize my spell damage, as well as my energy shield where possible. I went for pure energy shield equipment, not any evasion/es or armor/es or anything like that. I'd like to know if that's the best way to go, as well, since I'm wondering if I could go for some armor for damage reduction or evasion to attempt to avoid damage.

Sounds like you were prioritising offense over defense, as you say.

Here's a scion build for firestorm (or basically any other spell) which has some offense nodes, but prioritises that massive life cluster by scion. With some life on gear, you'll have 1.5k+ health and laugh at dominus' meagre attacks.

Energy shield is extremely gear dependent and you always take life first, then spec out later as your gear improves and you take CI. There are lots of spells that work, the problem is you have to get to level 84 or 85 to get a level 20 spell gem, and your mage will be wheezing from start of maps all the way there, compared to any other class.

Here's this game in a nutshell:
Increasing your damage output via passive nodes is a noob trap, all you have to worry about is your survive ability. Lategame gems and gear make up enough damage output for you to win fights, but you can't survive lategame fights if you didn't invest in passive survive-ability.
Glass cannons and characters that generally have offense>defense do not work in this game.

Hello! So the lesson to take from that, then, is that I really ought to be putting more into life and ES as I level. That makes a lot of sense, as my glass cannon approach wasn't working out so great. Incidentally, I've currently started a new-game-plus Witch using some of my stored gems, and while awaiting a reply, decided to level up a bit and see, just for fun, how well I'd do without applying any passives at all.

Well, I just killed Brutus, but I must say I doubt I'd be able to progress much further. It was, however, enlightening as to how I really didn't need to strive and reach for that extra "elemental damage" nodes, since it's quite clear that you're capable of kicking some ass without anything at all, other than leveling the gems themselves.

Looking at the witch paths, I'm noting that there's not a lot of room for HP upgrades until post-Normal (it takes > 39 skill points to hit a decent number). However, there are a TON of ES upgrades, which are kinda like HP. I suppose I can focus more heavily on that while still affording some elemental damage... let me see...

Perhaps something like this for Normal Play?
http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgMB37CCEEGWBUKusyycVysHY-aBEVCOvhEtfIPN-riT6-4o-uq6hEg8jgFvV8m71jvh4venK4t6SRuvt4dlwbRWSpUEr5vk7HYRN4Om6yymN2Y0Cm0ZMYh5Awj0
Based on being level 38 by the time you get to Dominus and getting seven skill points beyond your level. I definitely want those elemental nodes due to the +15% resistance they offer, which can help reduce the pain a bit when one goes up to Cruel... I suppose after that point it'd come down to gear re: Sceptre of God to help carry the rest. What do you think?

This is a much better tree using the same amount of points



First, notice I took the minion node in the beginning. You will spec out of this later, but in the beginning it is very helpful.

Second, notice I skipped an ES cooldown node in the right branch. Eventually, if you go CI, you will take this node, and that lets you spec out of those 3 life nodes attached to it. The other life node clusters are also easy to spec out of and require no reworking of the tree or at most 1 node. Notice I took a strength and a Dex node. You will need these for almost any build and it makes gearing a lot easier.

Also notice, you never take all 3 paths on the left. You pick 1 and specialize. In my tree, it's lightning.

Life is much easier to scale in the beginning. ES is not that helpful until you start getting items with large rolls.

Examples:

Interesting. I do have to ask, re: not taking all 3 elemental paths, if it's alright to pass on the resistance, as the "Walker" nodes give +15% in it, and frankly, I find it very difficult to find items that enhance resistances, and ES/hp/mana/whatever. Especially in normal difficulty. I do like the HP nodes, however; I failed to notice those.

Now, I already have taken the ES Delay node, unfortunately, and a few nodes beyond that. However, other than that, I've so far filled in a good portion of exactly the same skill tree as you've noted. If I do decide not to go all 3 elements, however, I haven't decided what to do yet (oddly probably not going to be fire; I find myself relying heavily at the moment on Spark and Ice Nova).

I do note the addition of Dex and Str nodes; I assume this is for skills such as Additional Projectiles and Fork and the like. I certainly don't have a problem with including those should I come across more (I currently have a bunch of those on my Ranger, so no extras in storage at the moment).

I certainly like your tree. Think I'll stick with it (excepting that ES Cooldown node I took, but hey, it's not the end of the world. Soon as I loop around I can refund it for now and free that up for another benefit.

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Eniliad wrote:

Interesting. I do have to ask, re: not taking all 3 elemental paths, if it's alright to pass on the resistance, as the "Walker" nodes give +15% in it, and frankly, I find it very difficult to find items that enhance resistances, and ES/hp/mana/whatever. Especially in normal difficulty. I do like the HP nodes, however; I failed to notice those.

Resist nodes are generally not worth the passive point investment in the end-game unless they're something like +12% resist all in one node. The maximum possible values for resistances on item mods increase as item level increases, such that a single piece of endgame gear can have (if you are extremely lucky) +40% resistance to all elements. This is why many people opt to skip resistance nodes in favor of nodes that provide things that won't be capped, or which are more difficult to cap (such as block) - in the endgame, that is. If you are having trouble keeping resists up, it may be worth speccing into resistance nodes, then refunding them later when you have enough gear to make up for it.

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Now, I already have taken the ES Delay node, unfortunately, and a few nodes beyond that.

I skipped literally all the other posts in this thread (including your original - sorry OP!), but in my opinion, ES delay nodes can be useful for certain niche builds. My Witch, in particular, would most definitely benefit from ES delay nodes - but partly for challenge and partly because of the way I like to build her, I haven't taken any on her either.

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I do note the addition of Dex and Str nodes; I assume this is for skills such as Additional Projectiles and Fork and the like. I certainly don't have a problem with including those should I come across more (I currently have a bunch of those on my Ranger, so no extras in storage at the moment).

Again, I skipped every other post in this thread. But yes, +30 attr. nodes are very useful for meeting attr. reqs.

Well, if you were going to take those nodes for the resistances, you would do it how I have done it in this next tree. It saves you a point from each branch. In normal, resistances aren't nearly as big of deal as late game. Rather than try to max them all, you just try to know what you need when. For instance, cold res for merveil. This tree is the "skeleton" for the majority of witch builds, or was pre release patch. It takes crit nodes, and if you check all the passives carefully, you will find that it managed to pick up an astonishing +54(!)% to all resistances, with the extra 15% in lightning.



I'm going to sleep now but I'm sure someone else can help with any other questions (or explain to you why I am a complete fucking moron, that's the way things generally work around here), or I'll answer any questions you still have in the morning. Good luck.

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adghar wrote:

I skipped literally all the other posts in this thread (including your original - sorry OP!), but in my opinion, ES delay nodes can be useful for certain niche builds. My Witch, in particular, would most definitely benefit from ES delay nodes - but partly for challenge and partly because of the way I like to build her, I haven't taken any on her either.

Just to clarify, since you did skip much of the thread, it is the ES delay node he would pick up later when he starts speccing out of life. In the beginning of the build it's a bit of a wasted passive, but is required to take that path once you spec out of life nodes.