Why dedicate my time if I can lose all my XP with a death penalty?

"

MrPedez#4934 wrote:

It makes perfect sense. NOONE should ever reach lvl 100 by dying all the time. If u cant get to lvl 100 without xp loss being removed i can tell u why... Either you or ur builds sucks, its really that simple.

"

MrPedez#4934 wrote:

Like i said earlier, not every build is made with lvl 100 in mind, most chars are just currency farmers and lvl 100 is not needed at all. lvl 90+ is more than enough for this. Sometimes i do however make a char meant to go 100 just for the challenge and it should be a challenge and not just a guaranteed outcome from playing that char for a week or two AkA participation trophy that anyone can get.

Ok so it's not really that simple. There's far more variables than "you or your build sucks".

Regarding lvl 100(or 99 in d2)

Back in the day i had a bunch of lvl 95 characters in d2 and in poe i have only one lvl 100 and also some lvl 92-96

Lvl 100 is not really worth it and characters are fully functional at lvl 95 for all content, so yeah not optimal design but also not a big problem.

For full release of poe2 they will probably change some things. Right now it's a bit overkill obv. I stopped at lvl 90 for EA.

"

PhillipBurns#5461 wrote:

Here is the approximate formula for reaching level 100 in PoE1 and assuming it's the same for PoE2.

In PoE1 it takes on average 500 hours of gameplay to reach max level without dying.

A league last on average 90 days.

Thats roughly 4 1/2 hrs of gameplay a day for 90 days

In PoE2 - if they use the same experience formula & you include these factors; you have a bad design, imo.

Dying involves ;

- lost waystone/map
- lost content/juice
- lost currency/items unlooted
- lost exp
- lost time investment of all the above


Dying gains ;

- potential knowledge of why you failed
- potential to improve character


If you don't have a level 100, please don't comment. If you dont care about reaching level 100, don't comment. If you do have a level 100 from the leagues, please explain how you would manage this in a league & describe your time situation, as I don't think the average person even has a chance at reaching those play time #'s. I would love the perspective of someone who reaches level 100 every league while sharing the situation in their lives that allow for such playtime.

I assume they have a lot more 'free' time than most, or maybe they're streaming the game as they play for income, maybe they live with their parents, maybe they're working from home but actually gaming, I honestly don't know. Would love some perspective.

Yeah I only got lvl100 once and it was by doing Sanctum literally all day for 3 days straight. I have that much free time cus I'm a NEET.

Soooo yeeah, I think this kind of grind is a bad design in a seasonal game. Most average players won't have the time to reach lvl100 or they've quit the league because they're done with all their goals before that.(challenges or whatever) So lvl100 becomes this non-goal that is always out of reach and kind of pointless to even have. Why not make the max level 90 then since every build "works at lvl90"?

And if you realistically wanna get lvl100 in PoE 1 without taking forever and dying while losing your mind over the exp loss then the best thing to do is hop on TFT,whisper a legion 5-way rota host(or just look for one in trade 820) and pay them some divine orbs and afk in the center while the headhunter KB wander explodes the screen 300 times as you sit there with 800x600 resolution windowed mode because its less of a strain on your PC to have the game running like that in a legion 5-way.

Oh yeah I forgot I had another lvl100 back when they introduced the 30% exp gain per shrine effect on you scarab, did 30x Dunes maps and got from lvl99 to 100 and it was the most fun I ever had grinding to max level. I deleted that char because it was an outdated version of a build. Too bad GGG removed that scarab the very next league when literally nobody asked for it to be removed. It was not OP at all, I guess it was just "too fun" for The Vision. The one time we had a fun way to farm exp without paying 5 divines for a legion 5-way rota and they completely gutted it. It's just sad.

GGG could do lots of things, but imo this outdated silly penalty just needs to go.

XP penalty is an outdated design, but it's there for a reason, it adds a mayer to the game. I think the key to satisfy everyone is to completely rework that aspect. Ditch the XP penalty but create something like a ladder and rewards for people who are reaching level 100. S tier for deathless, A tier for one to five death, B tier for 6 to 10, etc.

You can reward nice Hideout MTX to flex on every trade, and also you create another chase for hardcore gamers and make the challenge of leveling to 100 more interesting (imo).

I trust that GGG is capable of making something even better than that, but that's if they're willing.

"

MEITTI#3999 wrote:

"

ChillzyLive#1813 wrote:

Simple solution to appease everyone:
- Reduce the penalty by 50% so people aren't hurt and butthurt as much.
or
- Remove the penalty but lose the gear picked up.
Should of stashed it if you thought it was that valuable.

Thats looking at the problem from the wrong angle. They should rather fix the instadeath and unfair death issues than remove on-death penalties.

Absolutely.
This would be ideal but I don't see it happening.

You can't have this level of dogshit server performance with the lag, and effects from multiple players shooting lightning and ice and shit, then also have people lose the map buffs they grinded their ass off for to setup THEN ALSO lose exp.

If the game played smooth and wasn't a slideshow every fucking breach, I'd be able to avoid the ondeath and floor shit that's insta-killing me most times.

"

PhillipBurns#5461 wrote:

Here is the approximate formula for reaching level 100 in PoE1 and assuming it's the same for PoE2.

In PoE1 it takes on average 500 hours of gameplay to reach max level without dying.

A league last on average 90 days.

Thats roughly 4 1/2 hrs of gameplay a day for 90 days

In PoE2 - if they use the same experience formula & you include these factors; you have a bad design, imo.

Dying involves ;

- lost waystone/map
- lost content/juice
- lost currency/items unlooted
- lost exp
- lost time investment of all the above


Dying gains ;

- potential knowledge of why you failed
- potential to improve character


If you don't have a level 100, please don't comment. If you dont care about reaching level 100, don't comment. If you do have a level 100 from the leagues, please explain how you would manage this in a league & describe your time situation, as I don't think the average person even has a chance at reaching those play time #'s. I would love the perspective of someone who reaches level 100 every league while sharing the situation in their lives that allow for such playtime.

I assume they have a lot more 'free' time than most, or maybe they're streaming the game as they play for income, maybe they live with their parents, maybe they're working from home but actually gaming, I honestly don't know. Would love some perspective.

average 500h to get to 100? In a PoE league?
Source: Trust me bro?

I have a 100 in the settlers league. Played solo 99% of the time. I have reached about 250h-ish and was 100 for a long while. I spent at least half that time in hideout and or messing around with the town. Oh and I played as melee, I consider myself a slow player since I cannot play for too too long at a time due to my migraines. Due to the illness I die quite a lot since my concentration is rather "off". Oh, and I am old AF. So there is that xD

Most of my playtime has been normal mapping. I just stayed away from T17s/bosses while levling then when I ding a new level I do all the rippy maps, harder content. It is pretty basic really. Of people actually reaching 100 I bet I am in the lower 25% skill wise and that is not counting all those getting boosted by services(which I never do).

Also have 2 100s in other leagues(I dunno why it is relevant but you asked for it) but by now I bet you don't really care to read what others say.

Also the 1 portal per map I think is the root of this issue! Remove that and that will take care of XP loss and items loss.
I wonder where else I heard of situations where you invest something and then you lose all the investments and feel like time was wasted ?
Oh yeah ... SCAMS !.. PoE2 endgame feels like and is a scam.

"

PhillipBurns#5461 wrote:

Here is the approximate formula for reaching level 100 in PoE1 and assuming it's the same for PoE2.

In PoE1 it takes on average 500 hours of gameplay to reach max level without dying.

A league last on average 90 days.

Thats roughly 4 1/2 hrs of gameplay a day for 90 days

In PoE2 - if they use the same experience formula & you include these factors; you have a bad design, imo.

Dying involves ;

- lost waystone/map
- lost content/juice
- lost currency/items unlooted
- lost exp
- lost time investment of all the above


Dying gains ;

- potential knowledge of why you failed
- potential to improve character


If you don't have a level 100, please don't comment. If you dont care about reaching level 100, don't comment. If you do have a level 100 from the leagues, please explain how you would manage this in a league & describe your time situation, as I don't think the average person even has a chance at reaching those play time #'s. I would love the perspective of someone who reaches level 100 every league while sharing the situation in their lives that allow for such playtime.

I assume they have a lot more 'free' time than most, or maybe they're streaming the game as they play for income, maybe they live with their parents, maybe they're working from home but actually gaming, I honestly don't know. Would love some perspective.

No idea where u get these numbers and i do know that i didnt spend 500 hours on any of my lvl 100 poe 1 chars. Just for ur information the world record is 31 min 39 sec fastest lvl 1-100 abusing party play and some broken strats in Necropolis league. Besides there are many ways to get to 100 fast in poe 1 even as a solo player (cowards trial,5 ways,chayula breachstones etc.) but party is always the fastest and im sure there will be some similar content in poe 2 once it releases.

- lost waystone/map ??? honestly if u die too often to sustain ur maps at this lvl then yeah ur build sucks and ur atlas tree is setup wrong.
- lost content/juice . Well this is probably gonna change at some point in some way but honestly i dont think i care too much. problem here is people can abuse running the same content over and over by not killing the last rare mob and complete the map
- lost currency/items unlooted. Well if u pick up loot along the way im pretty sure u only lost what the last mob that killed u dropped. Its not like ur entire inventory is gone.
- lost time investment. Well thats on u. If u consider all the loot u gathered before u died a waste of time then u probably should not play arpg's

- potential knowledge of why you failed. Well probably not quite true, but yes in some rare instances u are left with a ???? but thats why we have EA so we can find these issues.
- potential to improve character. This is definitely not true, almost any char can be improved but atm some chars and defence types are just way better than others which will see some changes in the near future, untill then all u have to do is a bit of research and adapt the char, this is unfortunately how it is atm untill it gets patched

"

arknath#4740 wrote:

average 500h to get to 100? In a PoE league?
Source: Trust me bro?

I have a 100 in the settlers league. Played solo 99% of the time. I have reached about 250h-ish and was 100 for a long while. I spent at least half that time in hideout and or messing around with the town. Oh and I played as melee, I consider myself a slow player since I cannot play for too too long at a time due to my migraines. Due to the illness I die quite a lot since my concentration is rather "off". Oh, and I am old AF. So there is that xD

Most of my playtime has been normal mapping. I just stayed away from T17s/bosses while levling then when I ding a new level I do all the rippy maps, harder content. It is pretty basic really. Of people actually reaching 100 I bet I am in the lower 25% skill wise and that is not counting all those getting boosted by services(which I never do).

Also have 2 100s in other leagues(I dunno why it is relevant but you asked for it) but by now I bet you don't really care to read what others say.

Snarky way to start the conversation, but okay - I'll try to match that energy I guess,

Sources as I said in an earlier post;

Personal experience, years of playing, years of playing with people who hit 100 regularly & Google search engine - also keep in mind I said approximate; if you can hold a thought that long, anyways;

The XP of Level 100 is 4,250,334,444. You need 300+ maps just to get from 99 to 100. When we are going 100 million XP/hour at level 99, it takes about 42.5 hours.

It took you less than 250 hours of play time to reach 100? That still equates to almost 3 hours a day for 90 days if you're being genuine about it.

Do you work? Do you have other priorities or is 3 hours a day on a video game just something that fits your situation?

The relevancy is clearly implied - what allows someone to achieve something that on average takes more time than most players will even have to commit to it in a league?

Thanks for your feedback

Thanks for replying,

Edit: https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/Experience#Experience_table

Unfortunately that math is very off. I did lvl 99 -> 100 average about 20m xp/h in SSF. It definitely wasn't 42 hours. Maybe 10. You will never ever get 100m xp/h at level 99, maybe if you do something insane like party play legion 5 way carries.

I believe the issue is you've equated 4,250,334,444 as the xp between 99 and 100. But that's the xp between 0 and 100. The xp between 99 and 100 is only about 250m.