As it currently stands, Demon Form will eventually be a waste of ascendancy points.

Demon Form has been great to me early game, but while planning out my build into the future I think shapeshifts completely ignoring weapons and being their own set kinda sucks. Maybe for druid it'll work better with bear form and the others supposedly having their own skills. But with Demon Form, the more I consider it the more it's souring me on my choice to go this route for the ascendancy.

As a straight buff skill with a life loss catch, it's pretty nice early on, but looking at potential drops for wands one could find at endgame it seems it will be more of a burden for having picked that you'll never use at a certain point. The modifier to cast speed will be worse, the +level to spells will most likely be surmounted by a great main-hand/off-hand (or two-hand?), alongside some of the spell damage too (Maybe all if you cap the demonflame to 10). All of this ignores the rest of the stats which a perfect pairing of main-hand/off-hand could benefit the player with as well, without the penalty of life loss. Of course the probability of getting items to beat a capped Demon Form is most likely low, but the potential being there means that eventually with enough time the form will be completely obsolete and a wasted ascendancy allocation, with its only 'benefit' being a better dodge which is outweighed by the life loss. Which would be OK if we could refund ascendancy points through some means to take advantage of our progressing character, but we can't.

Also on top of a great main-hand/off-hand combo being able to outperform Demon Form (and having additional ascendancy allocation), the shapeshift being its own weapon set allocation means that if you wanted to for some ungodly reason spend additional points to cap demonflame to 10 and stay eternally in Demon Form then you'll never be able to take advantage of weapon swapping to optimize different allocations for different spellcasts. Unless you wanted to just use Demon Form as a way to allocate for a third type of spell and switch back once it's cast, then there's again no reason to take Demon Form. But even then it doesn't seem like you're able to overlap with weapon skills. So even if you wanted to allocate one set to cursing or whatnot you'll have to allocate the main damage boosting skills to Demon Form and I guess whatever else to your primary set.

Like I said at the beginning, maybe there'll be a unique reason to take up the bear or wolf form as the druid, but as it stands with Demon Form I just don't see it being worth the ascendancy points in the long run unless it's changed so you're able to benefit from your weapons and potentially weapon swapping mid-form.

+1 it’s too underwhelming right now

Aw man, I was gonna go full Demon for my second character.

I insisted on Demon Form so long. Then i bought a Staff that gives 40ish% cast speed - +6 phy skill and total 100ish% phy spell damage for 3 ex. In return i get to keep my 5% life per second to myself. Only downside is losing the Demon Form dash.

Either Demon Form needs a big buff or we need weapon stats in the form. It's a shapeshift but it's not like a Druid shapeshift. We only get buffs from it and those buffs are on par with 1-5 ex weapon/off-hand setup.

It's one of the most useless ascendancy in the game atm. No upside and big downside.

What about instead of life drain it added cold or chaos vulnerability/reduced resistance. IE you max in fire res since you're a fire demon but at a bit of a cost in other resistances rather than putting yourself in a clock?

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Phototoxin#0222 wrote:

What about instead of life drain it added cold or chaos vulnerability/reduced resistance. IE you max in fire res since you're a fire demon but at a bit of a cost in other resistances rather than putting yourself in a clock?

That wouldn't work because then you'd just infinitely stack regular Demon Form to 1shot everything. Which is what I'm trying to see if it's possible to do right now with a combination of recoup and Infernal Flame since that'd mean there's at least one viable way to utilize it. Otherwise if that doesn't work then yeah it's pretty useless once you outgear it. The 10 demonflame cap is for sure absolutely worthless because not only do you waste a further 2 ascendancy points, but you nerf the only thing that could possibly make a demon form build viable.

+1

At least it does something.
Monk of Chayula "Instant" Leech = does nothing.

Leech is ONLY on Physical damage
Monks do near 100% elemental damage.
Literally my ascendancy gives me 2.5 mana for every 1000 damage I do.
Oh sorry no I get that without the ascendancy. The Ascendancy makes that Instant instead of over 1s. What GARBAGE. No one tested this stuff.

If this is inspired by the Lich from in Last Epopch (transform and keep losing life), at least make it like Last Epoch and revert to full life when reverting to Human form. Otherwise, it is too much risk for no reward.

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Drvi34#7062 wrote:

I insisted on Demon Form so long. Then i bought a Staff that gives 40ish% cast speed - +6 phy skill and total 100ish% phy spell damage for 3 ex. In return i get to keep my 5% life per second to myself. Only downside is losing the Demon Form dash.

Either Demon Form needs a big buff or we need weapon stats in the form. It's a shapeshift but it's not like a Druid shapeshift. We only get buffs from it and those buffs are on par with 1-5 ex weapon/off-hand setup.

It's one of the most useless ascendancy in the game atm. No upside and big downside.

You can even get a better dodge by using blink+second wind+cd support in an unset ring.

Everything about demon form gets power crept endgame.

There's no reason to pick it right now aside from style points.