Herald of Agony is one of if not my favorite skill
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Herald of agony has always been strong but super clunky to play requiring you to run uncomfortable setups to reach a massive ammount of poisons per second. whether that be brands with swiftbrand support (terrible duration)/cyclone cast while channeling(that requires you to stand in melee range as a minion build)/stormburst(which requires you to stand still often)/Winter orb (which basically keeps you planted in place during boss fights unless you invest in duration)/self cast ball lightning(which is useless on bosses)/arcanist brand/ and my own patented tech which involves leashing golems with intuitive link so herald of agony is close to being automated becoming a "REAL" minion. So i thought of a solution which moves the clunkiness of the build from the gameplay to the actual building of the character which is a much better location for it to be a skill should not have the trade off of being frustrating to play because it's strong. So I propose an idea for a unique that solves that issue. that being said im sure this doesnt exactly fit the line of balance that you guys might want to achieve but it definitely gets the point across
https://imgur.com/a/czy8jLP -Professional Fish Last edited by GoldShark#5883 on Sep 29, 2023, 7:53:50 AM Last bumped on Oct 4, 2023, 11:28:26 AM
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I think you have severely misrepresented the number of ways to get Herald of Agony up and rolling.
Any 100% chance to poison, high attack speed build makes it work. That is...like 90% of ALL builds in this game. The only real clunkiness comes from the Herald itself, NOT the ramp up. Things you didn't mention: literally all bow skills. the classic (and probably most popular) blade vortex, cobra lash/venom gyre, etc. ALL of these skills are super super fast, easy to get going, and zero clunk. Plus they synergize SO well with HoA: 1 split arrow with pierce, chain, or fork gives you like 15 virulence per attack for NO investment. Get barrage on a swap and you have a boss-killer too, again with zero investment. Blade vortex can even give you a secondary high damage source beyond simply relying on the Crawler since it shares some tags and scales damage with gem level. Bow skills give you almost immediate max virulence, with the benefit of defensive playstyle and an extra 6L. Venom Gyre claws or daggers give you all the nodes that help with DoT, with the benefit of 40% poison chance, chaos conversion, great coverage, 20% MORE attack speed, and life/mana steal of the claw. Everything you mentioned is quite possibly the WORST way to play Herald of Agony haha now that I'm thinking deeper into it...I would NEVER do brands. I would NEVER do cast while channelling cyclone (what?!). Just do cyclone by itself lol. I would NEVER do winter orb...its basically a super inefficient, channeled version of a basic bow skill. Last edited by jsuslak313#7615 on Sep 28, 2023, 4:02:01 PM
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I also have to talk about the elephant in the room......how in the world do you have a Mageblood...when the rest of your gear on your Ancestor characters is essentially trash. You don't even have a farmer...
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" i was wondering the same thing.... |
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" this is obviously coming from someone who has never played herald of agony in their life as a minion build. "just do cyclone by itself" is the VERY obvious tell that you have NEVER played herald of agony and dont understand sustaining virulence. I have a LOT of experience with playing herald of agony as a minion build and those methods are the best. other than dropping multiple plus levels from either you body armour or weapons. to replace it with a bow which is the worst feeling herald of agony playstyle of them all. "just get 100% chance to poison" is another easy tell that you have no idea what you're talking about aswell since you have no idea that poison support gems had their poison chance nerfed a ton. poison support being removed and renamed to critical strike affliction losing its 60% chance to poison. leaving you with only chance to poison support which is 40% herald of agony which is 20% putting you at 60% and leaving the rest up to the skill tree which has chance to poison in terrible spots for a minion build. or gear which makes your build extremely suboptimal. all that not to mention I can 100% gaurentee you are only taking into account 40 virulence stacks just from the way you speak. -Professional Fish Last edited by GoldShark#5883 on Sep 29, 2023, 7:34:53 AM
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" I dont have a farmer? what are you on about my herald of agony build smashes t16 delirous maps without mageblood. as did my corrupting cry character Nice attempt. not that I owe you an explanation to your dumb allegations. but if you must know I farmed ritual in SSF and got 2 apothecary's from the shop I then harvest duped them up to 5 and turned in the cards. after I obtained the mageblood I got bored since that was my original goal of the league I then migrated the character to ancestor and sold all of the gear on my Corrupting cry character as well as all the valuable items i dropped in ssf and migrated to ancestor which resulted in the divines i used to reroll the belt + more. then I spent a bit on upgrading the character bought a 6 link coming calamity got it serviced for 1-6 white which took multiple tries to get it to overlap the colors i needed bought two cold iron points slapped on 2 essence worms for testing purposes. so yes my rare gear is bad its SSF gear. after i made a few upgrades I quit the charcter I didnt bother getting and crafting cluster jewels. also you do understand that mageblood can drop for anyone you dont have to buy it right? or are you just that unaware -Professional Fish Last edited by GoldShark#5883 on Sep 29, 2023, 7:47:44 AM
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I'll have to call you Goldsnark. :-) Although I do have to admit that the snarky response had been earned to a fair degree.
Thank you for explaining though. :-) Herald of Agony was one of my favorite builds but, that was way before it got nerfed to hell. Over 430 threads discussing labyrinth problems with over 1040 posters in support (thread # 1702621) Thank you all! GGG will implement a different method for ascension in PoE2. Retired!
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First of all...I have made tons of different HoAg builds. Not in the last few leagues, but I am well versed. It is the main reason why this thread caught my attention. Chance to poison + Gyre/Lash + HoAg = 100% poison...super fast...hitting tons of enemies at once. Cyclone + chance to poison + claw mod + HoAg/tree = 100% easy, super fast, hitting tons of enemies at once. Same with bows...The point is if you are ACTUALLY playing a HoAg build, the vehicle for stacking virulence needs no dps, only poison chance. So who the hell cares about the support gem change? Why would you be using it in the first place on your virulence stacking skill?
I have almost zero idea what you are talking about when you say "minion build"...are you saying you want MINIONS stacking the virulence specifically? Because technically ALL HoAg builds are minion builds since the crawler....is a minion. The only question is: is it a POISON build supplemented by HoAg, or is it an AGONY build where your only goal is to stack as many poisons as fast as possible. And if you are specifically talking about minions being the ones to stack virulence, then: yes, I do not have experience doing that because that is a pretty stupid way to do it...it is slow, clunky, and takes a heck of a lot more investment. Yes...mageblood can drop for anyone. And yes, perhaps everything you said is 100% true and I'm wrong....but it is just so supremely unlikely, compounded with your initial post that doesn't make a whole lot of practical sense which points to a more amateurish player. And then you talk about being SSF all the way up to the belt. Maybe you ARE the luckiest person in the world, and you got 2 apothecary cards from Ritual (astronomically and ridiculously low odds), hit the jackpot and duped them (also, astronomically and ridiculously low odds). I mean, that pattern could potentially be even RARER than just dropping the belt straight up. But that's just my opinion...again, I don't really have a concrete reason to distrust your explanation. But there you go...my suspicions. We are talking hundreds of divines, in card increments, while you are running around with most of your gear worth less than a chaos orb. Go buy yourself a lottery ticket right now! Not that its a great indicator to use...but your Ancestor characters are also only level 90. Which means you did ALL this, SSF, without even at least leveling to 95? THAT is seriously impressive. But back to the main post: you seem to think YOU know all the ins and outs of HoAg; but either you have been playing in the most impractical way for the entire time without realizing or comprehending...or I don't fundamentally understand what you are asking for. I have personally made HoAg builds in every way that I described: the only issue being positioning the crawler = clunkiness. In fact, one of my all time favorite ways to level (if I have a 6 link available) is HoAg poison with bows or claws. Never have I used ANY of the methods you spoke about in the OP. They are just so so so inferior and don't make sense.... Last edited by jsuslak313#7615 on Sep 29, 2023, 2:18:35 PM
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" did all of what exactly? farmed harvest/ritual? literally any character can do that. Whether you believe me or not means very little. GGG can easily do their own research and find everything I said accurate. when I said minion build I was implying that you were not playing around the crawler and using it as a side product minions cannot even stack virulence for you other than by proxy with intuitive link or another very niche method which involves at minions causing proliferating poison which then get attributed to the player which is worthless for single target and barely passible for clearing. so yes I am referring to poisons coming from the player. when referring to nerfed poison chance on supports I am not referring to the damage like what? no you dont think its obvious the damage of the skill applying the poisons doesnt matter. the issue at hand is that you cannot min max a herald of agony build without a jank delivery for poisons. if you want to play your suboptimal bow/crafted claw builds more power to you I am not interested in doing so when i play trade I want to run a level 40 hoag with 70+ virulence or more if you want to super invest with 3 stat voices + medium virulence clusters and not have have the build feel like shit because I chose to min max. take for example this build https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CXPr_PTb2Lc. he's literally using multiple skills to generate virulence because sustaining high levels of virulence while min maxing is garbage. -Professional Fish Last edited by GoldShark#5883 on Sep 29, 2023, 4:11:45 PM
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Dude...do what you want. I personally think you have an over-inflated and misunderstood confidence in your Agony "knowledge" that is seriously hampering you into these, as you said, "janky" setups. You are consistently misunderstanding what I am saying, which leads me to believe you are ALSO misunderstanding what OTHER players are saying in their HoAg builds that you likely copied in the beginning. And frankly, if you aren't interested in even changing the way you play in the first place...then no one in the world can help you overcome your issues with the build you love so much.
It's YOU who said your "patented technique" using golems...so you really have no interest in actually optimizing the HoAg build: that's about as far away from optimization as you can get. Cyclone CWC AGAIN hampering your own generation by creating a totally unnecessary and artificial "wall" in your own cast time/generation of virulence. It's also YOU who brought up "critical strike affliction" as some sort of loss of the "chance to poison" support, which still exists. Yes its 20% less, but you MORE than make up for that with the oodles of new nodes and options for poison chance in the tree since that change was made. And look: if you want an EASY way to totally maximize ridiculous stacks of virulence BEYOND the initial cap, I disagree with that premise...it SHOULD be hard. Especially to sustain it. Every extra 5 virulence you add should make it exponentially harder to sustain. But if you are already STARTING your build with a main virulence generator that kinda sucks...you are fighting a losing battle from the get-go. And you keep throwing around the "minion build" title like its something unique: ALL HoAg builds are minion builds if you are relying on the crawler as your main damage dealer. It's really odd that you focused on making the crawler a "real minion" multiple times....when it already is. It just happens to be a minion that requires a style of upkeep, the tradeoff being that it's totally immortal. If you don't rely on the crawler, then it's a poison build with HoAg support. It seems like all you truly want with all this is: I want a minion I don't have to think about. Well...there are builds for that! And I gotta point out...the video you linked is of a pinnacle boss fight. Everyone that has ever built a HoAg build KNOWS that the way to generate high virulence against a BOSS is completely different from building virulence while mapping. But that is not at ALL what you said was your problem in the OP. You spoke of jankiness IN GENERAL which is simply not true. It's not some great secret that if I'm generating virulence using Cobra Lash and GMP in maps...I'm not gonna change that GMP to a single target option for bosses. That's just common sense. Last edited by jsuslak313#7615 on Sep 30, 2023, 4:17:47 PM
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