Why does Added Cold Damage and Added Fire Damage Behave very differently?

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aggromagnet wrote:

In addition to what the psycho mentioned, restricting how Ignite is applied and scaled was also a likely factor in their reasoning for having Added Fire work the way it does. It's not nearly as relevant now as it was in the old days, but it still matters to some extent.

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cirerrek wrote:

Interesting.

"The base duration of ignite is 4 seconds. The burning damage over time is 50% of the base damage of the hit of fire damage (before increased and more multipliers and resistance calculations)"

So if Added Fire Damage Support gave flat damage it would increase the burning damage over time by increasing the base damage. But as "Physical Damage as Extra Fire Damage" it does not.

Oi, not wonder I struggle at times figuring out how to scale damage on characters. So many things to consider!

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Torguemada wrote:

Honestly theres nothing wierd about it other then your expectation that all the "added x damage" supports should work identically.

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DER_PSYCHOPATH wrote:

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cirerrek wrote:

Interesting.

"The base duration of ignite is 4 seconds. The burning damage over time is 50% of the base damage of the hit of fire damage (before increased and more multipliers and resistance calculations)"

So if Added Fire Damage Support gave flat damage it would increase the burning damage over time by increasing the base damage. But as "Physical Damage as Extra Fire Damage" it does not.

Oi, not wonder I struggle at times figuring out how to scale damage on characters. So many things to consider!

It looks like you are using the old wiki, which has mostly been abandoned due to Fandom taking over. I strongly recommend using the new one which is completely community-run, has no ads, and is actively maintained:

https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/Ignite

Ignite was buffed in 3.16 to instead deal 125% of the base damage of the hit per second but will be slightly nerfed again in 3.17 to deal 90% of it instead. However, since a bunch of ways to inflict damage were buffed in 3.17 as well (most notably the base damage and damage effectiveness of many spells), the overall ignite damage for most builds is not going to actually be lower than in 3.16.

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cirerrek wrote:

Point about using the old wiki. I forgot to type in -fandom when I looked up the Ignite entry.

This exercise all started when I was trying to figure out how to level Fire Trap. I plugged in Added Fire Damage in POB and it didn't change the DPS on the skill, which was mega weird to me.

Since then I think I've learned that since Added Fire Damage offers "gain (25-39)% of Physical Damage as Extra Fire Damage" and since Fire Trap does NO physical damage then Added Fire Damage offers nothing to Fire Trap other than increasing your mana multiplier (which is not good).

If it did work with Fire Trap it would scale the base damage because for whatever reason Phys Damage as Extra Fire Damage is considered part of the base damage, in which case it would scale the Ignite damage. But again since Fire Trap offers no physical damage there is no physical damage to be gained as extra.

So if I wanted to scale the Ignite damage of Fire Trap via a skill gem I would instead want to look at Anger if I am understanding correctly?

But if I were trying to scale the Ignite damage on a physical attack (double strike for instance) or a physical spell (Ethereal Knives as an example) then Added Fire Damage is a potential skill gem source of Fire damage? And Anger would also help?

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DER_PSYCHOPATH wrote:

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cirerrek wrote:

Point about using the old wiki. I forgot to type in -fandom when I looked up the Ignite entry.

This exercise all started when I was trying to figure out how to level Fire Trap. I plugged in Added Fire Damage in POB and it didn't change the DPS on the skill, which was mega weird to me.

Since then I think I've learned that since Added Fire Damage offers "gain (25-39)% of Physical Damage as Extra Fire Damage" and since Fire Trap does NO physical damage then Added Fire Damage offers nothing to Fire Trap other than increasing your mana multiplier (which is not good).

If it did work with Fire Trap it would scale the base damage because for whatever reason Phys Damage as Extra Fire Damage is considered part of the base damage, in which case it would scale the Ignite damage. But again since Fire Trap offers no physical damage there is no physical damage to be gained as extra.

So if I wanted to scale the Ignite damage of Fire Trap via a skill gem I would instead want to look at Anger if I am understanding correctly?

But if I were trying to scale the Ignite damage on a physical attack (double strike for instance) or a physical spell (Ethereal Knives as an example) then Added Fire Damage is a potential skill gem source of Fire damage? And Anger would also help?

That is more or less correct, but just because these options would scale the ignite damage in the situations you described does not necessarily mean that they are the best options to scale that damage.

I strongly recommend utilising Path of Building to test out all the available options and see which one actually grants you the most damage.

E.g. when considering auras, there is a reasonable chance that Malevolence is better for ignite than Anger.

Path of Building is not absolute and not all features of the game are supported, so a basic understanding of the mechanics helps in reaching numbers that are actually realistic. But in general, it does a lot of the legwork for you to optimise your builds.

However, if there is anything that seems strange, you can always try to read up on it again on the wiki or come back to this forum. I can also recommend the daily question thread on the subreddit for this game.