How to scale Ignite on Explosive Arrow (totems)?

I am playing a Fireball ignite build and want to try it with Explosive Arrow on a Hierophant totems build. I generally understand how ignite works and that it scales with elemental/fire damage and flat damatge, but not area, projectile, spell damage. I thought it did not scale with crit multi either but before I took EO I saw a higher DPS for crit ignitesa than normal ignites, so I'm not sure why that was the case.

I'm not sure about how ignite works with explosive arrow because based on the wiki description there are two separate parts of the attack - the initial hit, and the explosion, which both deal damage separately.

Suppose for the sake of simplicity that I fire 20 arrows into a mob each second and they each deal 300 base damage. And let's say each arrow deals an average of 700 base added fire damage to the explosion. Does that mean that every 1 second my 20 arrows wil explode, dealing a total of (300*20 + 700*20) = 20,000 damage? Or is it calculated differently?

The next part of my question is about calculating the ignite damage. Usually if I use a support like GMP or Vicious Projectiles it does not affect the ignite damage because that is calculated before area or projectile damage scaling. However, I'm questioning whether that applies with Explosive Arrow because I'm not sure if these support gems would change the base damage of the explosion, given that the explosion is calculated by adding up the total damage of the attached arrows.

Complicating things further still is tha cap of 20 arrows per explosion. With mtulple totems and projectiles per totem it's very easy to reach the cap in faster than one second, which is not that helpful since I'm planning to scale the ignite damage rather than the hit damage, and I definitely don't to sacrifice base damage from the explosion that is used to calculate the ignite.

So my ultimate goal is to figure out how many totems to use and more importantly what support gems to use in my 6L bow, and also whether I want a crafted +3 bow with dot multi or a high phys damage bow like Arborix? I'm not sure because I'm not sure how much of EO's scaling comes from the added fire damage per level vs the base damage from the attack.

My initial thoughts for a 6L are:

Explosive Arrow
GMP (IF this does not lower ignite DPS, otherwise maybe LMP or Volley?)
Deadly Ailments
Swift Affliction
Added Fire Damage
Combustion (assuming it's better than Burning Damage because it's debuffs stack with each ignite? Not really sure how that works.)

I also considered Ignite Prolif, wondering if this will actually help clear speed, I suspect not much.

I was thinking to skip Multiple Totems Support as without that I can still get 5 totems (AB, Ascendancy, Panopticon, and Watchtowers anointment). Could get 6 totems if I use the Skirmish Quiver but not sure that's necessary.

I know this is a lengthy read so thanks to anyone who can share some tips on how to make this build. I briefly tried EA totems once before but the on-hit damage seemed to fall off in higher maps so I'd like to try it again but with Ignite.

P.S. Also wondering about replacing Added Fire Damage with Added Cold/Lightning Damage and taking Elemental Equilibrium.

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Legendary_Wealth wrote:

it scales with elemental/fire damage and flat damatge, but not area, projectile, spell damage. I thought it did not scale with crit multi either but before I took EO I saw a higher DPS for crit ignitesa than normal ignites, so I'm not sure why that was the case.

I believe ignites from crits have the inherent +50% multi, but are otherwise unaffected by crit multi unless you take the Perfect Agony keystone.

"

Legendary_Wealth wrote:

The next part of my question is about calculating the ignite damage. Usually if I use a support like GMP or Vicious Projectiles it does not affect the ignite damage because that is calculated before area or projectile damage scaling. However, I'm questioning whether that applies with Explosive Arrow because I'm not sure if these support gems would change the base damage of the explosion, given that the explosion is calculated by adding up the total damage of the attached arrows.

Skills calculate their Ignite, Poison or Bleed values as a separate damage value, taken straight from the base and added damage of the skill.

Explosive arrow will have 50% of the base damage of your bow + the X-X added fire damage from the gem for the explosion + whatever other added damage you have. The ignite damage will be calculated based on this damage and then all valid modifiers applied. GMP and Vicious Projectiles will still not affect this.

"

Legendary_Wealth wrote:

Complicating things further still is tha cap of 20 arrows per explosion. With mtulple totems and projectiles per totem it's very easy to reach the cap in faster than one second, which is not that helpful since I'm planning to scale the ignite damage rather than the hit damage, and I definitely don't to sacrifice base damage from the explosion that is used to calculate the ignite.

So my ultimate goal is to figure out how many totems to use and more importantly what support gems to use in my 6L bow, and also whether I want a crafted +3 bow with dot multi or a high phys damage bow like Arborix? I'm not sure because I'm not sure how much of EO's scaling comes from the added fire damage per level vs the base damage from the attack.

Keep in mind Ballista Totems have a "% less attack speed," it may not be as easy as you think. Also keep in mind the "% less damage" on the ballista totem support WILL affect the ignite damage.

It's been a hot minute since I've played an Explosive Arrow build, but IMHO you will want a +3 bow with DOT multi. Remember the explosion has 50% less base damage, and you would have to convert the phys to fire damage for it to be useful for ignite (which, given the mastery update to the passive tree may be a lot easier now!).

"

Legendary_Wealth wrote:

My initial thoughts for a 6L are:

Explosive Arrow
GMP (IF this does not lower ignite DPS, otherwise maybe LMP or Volley?)
Deadly Ailments
Swift Affliction
Added Fire Damage
Combustion (assuming it's better than Burning Damage because it's debuffs stack with each ignite? Not really sure how that works.)

I also considered Ignite Prolif, wondering if this will actually help clear speed, I suspect not much.

I was thinking to skip Multiple Totems Support as without that I can still get 5 totems (AB, Ascendancy, Panopticon, and Watchtowers anointment). Could get 6 totems if I use the Skirmish Quiver but not sure that's necessary.

If you are set on totems, skip GMP and use Sire of Shards unique Jewel (Totems fire +2 projectiles). Slot another damage in (Inspiration).

Ignite Prolif IMHO is rarely worth it, and remember you are dealing explosion damage that also ignites the enemies behind enemies. If your clearspeed sucks, increase AoE.

It's a bit of a toss-up with Multiple Totems... It means survivability for you (less standing around summoning) but does decrease your damage; but it also allows your damage to come out faster. Try with and without is all I can say.

Thanks for the detailed explanations.

"

It's been a hot minute since I've played an Explosive Arrow build, but IMHO you will want a +3 bow with DOT multi. Remember the explosion has 50% less base damage, and you would have to convert the phys to fire damage for it to be useful for ignite (which, given the mastery update to the passive tree may be a lot easier now!).

I'm a bit confused on this. I was under the impression that the explosions always deal 100% fire damage. So then it wouldn't matter what was the damage type of the arrow when it first hits the target.

You also mentioned that the arrow damages at 50% of base value for the explosion. Is it also dealing some amount of damage when it first hits the target? I assumed this was the case as that would make Explosive Arrow able to work with EE without needing another skill to proc it.

"

Legendary_Wealth wrote:

Thanks for the detailed explanations.

"

It's been a hot minute since I've played an Explosive Arrow build, but IMHO you will want a +3 bow with DOT multi. Remember the explosion has 50% less base damage, and you would have to convert the phys to fire damage for it to be useful for ignite (which, given the mastery update to the passive tree may be a lot easier now!).

I'm a bit confused on this. I was under the impression that the explosions always deal 100% fire damage. So then it wouldn't matter what was the damage type of the arrow when it first hits the target.

You also mentioned that the arrow damages at 50% of base value for the explosion. Is it also dealing some amount of damage when it first hits the target? I assumed this was the case as that would make Explosive Arrow able to work with EE without needing another skill to proc it.

The arrow hit will deal normal, 100% base damage on the bow (+ added damage). If you have cold/lightning damage and EE, it will give the exposure for fire.

The fuse charges will have 100% added fire damage from skill gem and 50% base damage on the bow. The only part I am not sure about is whether you get 50% added damage from other sources, or 100%, since it is technically not base damage.

There is no modifier stating that the base damage is converted to fire. If you want your own proof (and just to double check my dated info), go link Brutality with Explosive Arrow; the explosion should still deal damage.

EE will still work in this manner, so long as you don't use Added Fire Damage support and don't have any fire damage in the main hit.