The Plague that is GGG's "Trade" system. & the Predatory dance feeding its lowkey P2W mechanism.

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ajo wrote:

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Destructodave wrote:

Yep, the item bloat predatory practice is getting old. I remember a time when I bought into the stash page hype. "Premium tabs? Hell yea thanks GGG! Currency tab! Hell yea thanks GGG!"

But at this point I see every league coming and I'm like, oh new league? Lemme see....Oh 23 new currencies thats gonna need its own special stash tab for 20 bucks? F you GGG. I mean seriously.

Do they really not make enough money on MTX nowadays? That they have to continually item bloat the game for the sole purpose of selling stash tabs? Because if thats not the case, they would be finding ways to let you add said new stuff to existing tabs, instead of selling entire new tabs. They are incredibly predatory, like any p2w game. Even worse in some cases. I mean you have to spend money on premium tabs to even remotely enjoy trading. Which, for the longest time, is basically linked to a 3rd party site with RMT ads plastered all over it.

Yeah, and when you mention that, people will argue that poe is such a small game that can't keep their free-to-play model as pure as the bigger and better examples. I don't think that's true because in the past GGG have been able to thrive on the support and good will of a much smaller community alone. People have been happy to donate in the past without actually needing anything in return, and that's why cosmetics have so stupid prices compared to other games. It's was a sink for GGGold due to inflation caused from massive supporting.

Maybe people started voting with their wallets, or maybe that will of supporting was somewhat lost when the chineese overlords bought GGG. Who knows.

Spoiler

Or maybe they just got greedy.

Yeah, sadly it seems to be this way.

It appears to be the case that their main aim behind Item bloating and other mechanisms to make stash overflow, in combination with a trash, lazy trade system, is to make people who otherwise wouldn't spend money on vanity cosmetics, drop a fairly substantial sum of money for a F2P but P2W game.

And of course, there'll be many people here who pretend to "just genuinely like the current system", while having ulterior motives such as being price fixers, snipers, gougers, scammers, etc, and just trying to make sure their easily exploited system stays unchanged.

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warex2500 wrote:

I've enough experience with AH through MMOs and the result is pretty much the same as with the current system. In the current system you're alt tabing to get an answer and in the other one you're sitting there clicking away in the hopes that whatever you wanted wasn't already bought by someone else. Nothing has changed. You'll be back making another rant about changing to something else.

It's not a rant. That's a bad scarecrow.

And your past experience with other ingame marketplaces must be falsely memorized because they certainly did not work like this system does.

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iuiulitza wrote:

I read your essay . My game experience is nothing like you describe. I am from Europe and Russian players are the fastest to respond when i trade with them. I like the trade system . It allows me to visit other people's hideouts and sometimes see cool stuff in there. You say GGG want to force us to buy stash tabs ? I,m ok with that as long as , they not force me to pay to login in the game . I see complains but i don't solutions. What should they do to make the amount of money they make , without using the methods they are using now ?

Well you have the right like any other person to have a personal opinion on the game's system and how it works. But my case is not against people's preferences. But against the actual reality of how this system works.

Simple P2W mechanisms. And I'm not saying "GGG want to force us to buy stash tabs ?", i am making a statement that is reality. It has nothing to do with my opinions. Yes Russians do generally reply at an acceptable rate, but again, there are also Russians who never reply, and just sit there price fixing and sniping items. The point is to fix the problems, and not bask in some of the benefits that exist, and use those to overlook every negative aspect of it all.

Sure, they don't charge you to log into the game. That would be P2P. And I never called them p2p to begin with. Also, if they did try to pull that move, they'd get buried instantly. Which is why they only prod people for their money in a very sinister, calculated way.

When I see these folks write how evil or sinister or predatory a game company is, two thoughts come to mind - that these people have insane entitlement issues and that if they actually felt things were that bad they wouldn't even waste time on a forum talking about it.

creator send me your PayPal ill hook you poor human up with 100 Points

4000 Hours and complains about hideout mtx and premium stashes lmao.

Get some mule characters if you dont like it you greedy piece, also trade Chat is not premium stashtab restricted, you can trade there if you are 2 greedy to support a game with 20 bucks where u spend 4000 Hours.


dont even answer to me, how can u blame a Company for making Money, that is literally the whole Point of Opening a Business, holy shit.

I agree the trading system is cancer and Tencent, oups I mean GGG knows this, but they are too greedy and prideful to realize it.
You know a game is pretty shit when players need to run 4 different 3rd party programs to play the game with a little bit of QOL. And even with all those programs the trading is just really, really bad. It has been like that since the dawn of time. And nothing changed since then (mainly because of GGG and the sub iq fanbois - who we can clearly see all over in this thread). Instead of that we got powercreep, new purchasable MTX, fog, new purchasable MTX, one shot off screening monsters, new purchasable MTX, speed meta intestifies, new purchasable MTX,crappy bossfights, new purchasable MTX, and do you have no lootfilters?

it's not pay to win.

YOU feel that it is because YOU have been playing with the wrong mindset and that is forcing you into things that you claim you don't want to do (pay for things or feel you miss out)

But then there is solo self found, no trading and people play ALL the way through the game, there is even private league mods that disable stashes and people play ALL the way through the game...so what exactly is pay to win if anyone can do without.

(also the only problem with the trade system are the idiots misusing it)

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ThIsIsToXiN wrote:

I agree the trading system is cancer and Tencent, oups I mean GGG knows this, but they are too greedy and prideful to realize it.
You know a game is pretty shit when players need to run 4 different 3rd party programs to play the game with a little bit of QOL. And even with all those programs the trading is just really, really bad. It has been like that since the dawn of time. And nothing changed since then (mainly because of GGG and the sub iq fanbois - who we can clearly see all over in this thread). Instead of that we got powercreep, new purchasable MTX, fog, new purchasable MTX, one shot off screening monsters, new purchasable MTX, speed meta intestifies, new purchasable MTX,crappy bossfights, new purchasable MTX, and do you have no lootfilters?

This is a prime example - most players that fed up wouldn't play at all, regardless of the game.

PoE is far from perfect, but it better embodied the spirit of D2 than even D3 did.

Just imagine having to deal with a binding system locking items to characters or account. Or Hell, a general reduced drop rate to prevent market flooding... lots of ways for things to go bad with AH.

Also, the people clamoring the most about an AH would be whining about how crappy shit is now that they have it.

I honestly have no words regarding this dogshit "discussion".

You are critizing a business that OBVIOUSLY intended to make SOME money at SOME point in time.

If I were to create a video game as in depth as this one, make it free of charge but give players the ability to get vanity items and some extra stashtabs then heck yea why not? For about the full price of a regular game you get the stashtabs you need really.

If you've played the game for 8 years @ OP and still haven't spend a single cent (which by the looks of your profile, you have not ever bought a single supporter pack or maybe you hide it on purpose, Idk) then in my humble opinion you have ZERO right to complain.

Then I do not even know why you complain at all or make random accusations?

I, by no means!, am trying to randomly defend this game or maybe I am just getting to mature for such trivial discussions by I WANT to support this game as this company is one of the last in the entire friggin industry that isn't purely driven by greed.

Sure TenCent as a majority shareholder does get a say in it now and surely expects black numbers under the bottom line BUT this is still nowhere bad.

You blatantly lack the economical understanding and "insight" into the industry itself. This goes beyond: Let me google and read a few articles...POW thank you internet I am now a professor....

There is SO much more involved.

GGG actually has decent moral practices in play my friend.

In a perfect world, sure, it wouldn't look overly good but in our current world? Heck yea. GGG are pretty high up there.

It seems that a lot of you expect no incentives for the game to make any money.

This is the only game I know of that has gotten continuous updates, patches, addons expansions etc FOR FREE.

Once you spend 60 bucks (approx) you are essentially set and do not need more tabs.

If you are ofc obsessed and want to make the most currency of everyone and "rule" the world then yea...well...yea. But that would imply you having to get your priorities straight.

Well anyhow. Do not agree on the "predatory" part but sure there are incentives and there should be as it is, overall, a damn fine product and I, if I owned it, would want to make money too.

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SeCKSEgai wrote:

When I see these folks write how evil or sinister or predatory a game company is, two thoughts come to mind - that these people have insane entitlement issues and that if they actually felt things were that bad they wouldn't even waste time on a forum talking about it.

You clearly some learning to do. So let me fill you in on something. F2P games with 10-20$ MTX and lottboxes earn much more money than the old-timey model of pay 40-60$ and play your damn game with no additional charges. To be more specific, it makes A LOT MORE money.

GGG could have easily made a single-player enabled game and let us have our merry time with it (i.e. be able to mod stash space and/or drop rates), but they explicitly decided to go the Always-Online Game-As-A-Service Lootbox-bonanza way and churn out one unfinished league after another every 3 months in order to rake in as much cash as possible.

Knowing this, it is really sad that there exist people like you who love the game, pay for it willingly and afterwards go on the forums free of charge to label legitimate complaints as "entitlement issues" for whatever company and/or game. It is not yor fault that those legitimate complaints exist, no game or company is truly perfect.

You must learn that corporations are never your friend. GGG are a prime example of that rule - they started off with a romantic idea of "creating a game that the creators would love to play, which will be F2P with only ethical MTX" which enticed thousands of us back in the day. But quickly and quietly they scrapped that vision only a couple of years later in order to cater to a bigger audience and capture a bigger paycheck.