Player Traders - Online Hideout Trade Rack/NPC/Vending Machine

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Ajo wrote:

Working as intended. The leagues are what draws players back to the game. Without them, you would only have Standard & SSF players remaining, aka the plummet numbers, but even lower.

Well, that "working as intended" resulted in GGG having little enough cash that they had to resort to selling out to the devil. (aka Tencent)

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Ajo wrote:

But it's a free to play game after all and this was unavoidable in the end with so many developers. It's hardly something that they caused on their own by not milking enough money from the players.

It really can't be argued that it's "unavoidable;" Looking back (since hindsight is 20/20) there were a number of mistakes that GGG made. (one undeniable one was their ill-conceived contract with xsolla) Of course, no single factor alone was responsible, and as a general rule for any "disasters," it's a stack of mis-steps where just one having been corrected would've prevented the whole thing... And the increasing volatility of the game's playerbase (the initial new-league spikes are x3-4 what they were during 1.x, but the "lull" level is only around double) undoubtedly made things worse.

And although the numbers given by SteamCharts currently has some flaws, (for anything past 90 days old, it cuts down to only give one number every month, which doesn't reflect daily peaks) its prior data indicates that Bestiary was the second league in a row (can be confirmed looking at the LOWER of the two graphs) in a trend of having a smaller peak than the one before it. (81,781 was Bestiary's peak, with the respective ones for Harbinger and Abyss being approximately 120,000 and 95,000)

Basically, GGG had found themselves in a situation where their costs were rising, (they were spending more and more on developing each new league and expansion than the ones before; Bestiary was hands-down their most expensive league ever) but their income (between a non-growing playerbase, and xsolla) was declining.

Lastly... There's plenty of major F2P games that utterly avoid that sort of fate, mostly showing that they can, in fact, grow to huge scale just on that front alone. (TF2 comes to mind... And hell, Nexon basically built themselves into a titan more or less entirely on inventing the modern F2P formula across a lot of genres)

The required player interaction is less entertaining than I get at the drive through at burger king. I mean come on its a dude pasting a webpage sending it to me. I give him the item, then thx -thx,leave party, go back to maps. Yea fun!

I like it, a lot.

Anything to improve this horrible PITA current system is a good thing.

/signed

Yes pls trade NPC

Trade is biggest shit in POE currently I honestly don't understand how they expect us to go through this horrible piece of shit experience.

Whenever I want something I'm like fuck it... trade is a waste of time

90% of the time I want to buy something I just give up at the thought of it

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vio wrote:

same as "not being able to trade while you're mapping" is making you to deceide to either play undisturbed or sell alot of 1 alch junk to newbs to spoil their gratification to upgrade items themselves by playing the game.

WTF kind of logic is that?

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Cyzax wrote:

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ACGIFT wrote:

...if it makes players hate the game and quit...

It doesn't...

I don't ever get to level 100. Sometimes I'll kill Shaper within the league. Biggest reason I don't play longer is trade. I like to make builds. I like to theory craft. I hate trading for Uniques I need for such builds. And when the going price for an unique gets to high. I just don't try the build.

I have bought a ton of Shavronne's Wrappings over the years of playing POE. I have never ever had one drop for me!!! And some times the item is build enabling.

I really think that both of you can't see pass your own eago's with that kind of logic.

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ACGIFT wrote:

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Cyzax wrote:

Ahhh... The elitist defence. I know how to handle that one :-p
I've pushed into the endgame... As experienced by maybe 99% of the players! That matters. The 1% does not.

That's hilarious, because your attempt to call me out as an elitist is just you leaping into the territory of "it never bothered me, why should I care about people who aren't in my exact situation?"

The truth is... You don't actually play the endgame. You hit a wall, and rather than question why the wall is there, you just... Sit there.

Ok some of the stuff you say can be logical. But WTF are you doing here?!?!? I don't care for Challenges. I rarely complete more than 20 each league. I hardly ever level past lvl 90. But I kill Shaper from time to time. And sometimes even do Uber Elder a league before stopping. Your logic is stupid here.

I like most of your argument for trade though. But your stupid logic on (% of game played)/challenges almost ruins all the valid points you made. Especially when you also say why most people you know stop playing. Don't be one of those people!!! Seriously!!! Your not going to win any arguments by being a hypocritical dick.

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And the whole player interaction argument blows my mind. The game seems to punish you for being in parties. And only leaving parties to support/(buff bots). What player interaction are they trying to keep? There isn't any. Trading isn't interacting with others. It's just a necessary evil needed to get specific build related item for the most part. Well for me it is anyways. And it needs a ton of improvement!!!

Hell I interact more with players who make mistakes trading than people who know what they are doing! Only to tell them how they F'ed something up. And even that doesn't take to long.

Their is more player interaction in the forums than in game. And that's a fact.

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I don't like the public stash idea. Sounds like it would be laggie as hell. But a trade rack sounds awesome to me. But I don't really get how it word work. Maybe you would copy a instance ID to join instead of a whisper from poe.trade.

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TheLockedGuy wrote:

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vio wrote:

same as "not being able to trade while you're mapping" is making you to deceide to either play undisturbed or sell alot of 1 alch junk to newbs to spoil their gratification to upgrade items themselves by playing the game.

WTF kind of logic is that?

having to leave your map makes you decide to either sell alot of items OR go mapping undisturbed.

if all midgame to early endgame items are available for a wisdom scroll, there isn't much "game" there cause you get all your upgrades from trade rather than the game.

better?

Who needs to trade alchs 'constantly'? I mean if you start your fairytale with an actual real problem I might have read the whole thing.

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vio wrote:

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TheLockedGuy wrote:

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vio wrote:

same as "not being able to trade while you're mapping" is making you to deceide to either play undisturbed or sell alot of 1 alch junk to newbs to spoil their gratification to upgrade items themselves by playing the game.

WTF kind of logic is that?

having to leave your map makes you decide to either sell alot of items OR go mapping undisturbed.

if all midgame to early endgame items are available for a wisdom scroll, there isn't much "game" there cause you get all your upgrades from trade rather than the game.

better?

Not really. So, What your saying is: A person is a noob if... They know an item that sells for an alc is better than what they got. And they thought trading for it was a valid option to get it? Might as well make everything SSF if that's your logic.

Just because there is so much cheep crap. The problem isn't selling it, it's buying it. Being in a map shouldn't be a deciding factor of weather you do a trade or not. The fact that mapping limits your ability to trade is a problem.

You can try and argue that it is a trade off... But I just don't see it. The reason I believe each league has a huge player base at the start. And drops so hard later is because of this. It is way easier to trade for cheap crap early in the league. It isn't worth the time to sell crap later in the league. Not unless it's worth an exalt or more. Hence the reason a lot of people don't bother with a second char within a single league. It's not worth the time spamming for cheep crap for your next char.

Builds shouldn't be limited by trade. But they are. If you want a specific item for a build. For example shav's. It is build limiting. It doesn't matter the price tag here. After the first few weeks if it's a cheep item. Well good fucking luck getting it.

Map's hinder trade by their nature. I do not believe this was intended. Trade hinders build creativity. And the huge amount of random crap limits the viability of league starting builds. All these problems add to each-other. One leads to the other and so on.

If playing the game didn't hinder your ability to trade. The other two problems would go away. If shit tons of random crap didn't exist, was even cut down to a reasonable amount, or if there was a guarantee way to farm build specific uniques. It wouldn't limit build diversity as much. If trade didn't require you to spend hours getting the item you know you want. Especially when you earned the currency to buy it. Than I believe you wouldn't see the massive amount of players drop after the first two weeks of the league.

Having to leave your map doesn't make you decide weather you have to sell a lot of items or not. It makes you decide if you want to help others or not. I can get way more alcs faster just vendoring most of that junk. That might otherwise just sit in my stash all league. Which will save on inventory space, and will yield way more alcs over all. And it discourages player interaction.

If everything is worth a garbage amount such as an alc. There is no worth in trading it. Hence why buying anything for an alc after the first two weeks only gets exponentially harder as the league goes on. It doesn't make getting upgrades easier. Being dirt cheap makes it harder. As it is a waist of time to sell at that point. Your logic is 100% backwards to me.

And any improvement to trade would be welcomed by me. And at least I think the vast majority of players. I'm confident my opinion is in the majority here weather people realize it or not. Why else is it so much easier to trade at the start of the league? All these factors add to the problem. And your kind of logic is just a denial of the problems that currently exist. In fear of problems not proven to exist.

No thank you for a trader NPC, unless it takes a huge cut out of your profit.

If you are "annoyed" by having to sell what you yourself put up for sale, then you are the most annoying type of player to trade with.

Instead of complaining about a "solution" to your laziness, start respecting other players more and don't offer items you can't be bothered to sell.