Patient Reaper paired with Righteous Fire questions

I'm going to go ahead and assume the increased DoT damage does apply to your RF burn, and that mobs dying to your RF would trigger the increased recovery rates...but if it doesn't, please feel free to correct me. :)

My main questions is...even after reading forums and discussions on the following:

"60% increased Recovery Rate of Life, Mana and Energy Shield if you've Killed an Enemy affected by your Damage Over Time Recently"

I still don't really understand how it works...

Does the 60% increased recovery rate benefit life regen passive nodes? Vitality Aura? Stone Golem passive? Life regen on gear? I know it effects potions, but that's about the limit of my understanding. I'd appreciate any input if you can help clear it up for me.

Thanks for your time!

It affects every form of recovery. Potions, leech, regeneration, recharge, all of it. How it basically works is that you get 60% more life/es/mana per time unit. So 2% life regeneration per second turns into 3.2% life regeneration per second. Even works with instant leech. It can be very powerful.

...the problem is that you need to kill something in order to proc this ability, which makes it very strong for clearing, but somewhat useless against bosses. Also, it doesn't protect you from one-shots, so it doesn't replace other mitigation options.

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Bardharr wrote:

It affects every form of recovery. Potions, leech, regeneration, recharge, all of it. How it basically works is that you get 60% more life/es/mana per time unit. So 2% life regeneration per second turns into 3.2% life regeneration per second. Even works with instant leech. It can be very powerful.

I have to correct you. It says "recovery rate". Instant recovery (instant leech, instant flask, life/ES/Mana on hit/kill) does not have any rate, thus will not be affected.

"more" is not a good word to use in this case, because in PoE it means standalone multiplier. Patient reaper mod stacks with other sources of increased recovery rate.

It got buffed in the beta for 3.0 to 70%.

I leveled a Trickster to 82 in the beta for a MoM + SR-CWC-Firestorm + RF character and it's worked pretty well for me. I tried this same combo of skills with Berserker and Inquisitor too and I definitely prefer the Trickster variant, at least if you plan to do RF with MoM the mana side is much easier with Weave of the Arcane + Patient Reaper.

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Bardharr wrote:

...
...the problem is that you need to kill something in order to proc this ability, which makes it very strong for clearing, but somewhat useless against bosses. Also, it doesn't protect you from one-shots, so it doesn't replace other mitigation options.

You can do Writhing Jar for Righteous Fire Trickster builds; the worms should die damn near instantaneously when they pop, gives you for additional seconds of extra super-regen. My brother's been using Writhing Jar on his Earthquake Slayer recently to very excellent effect; get a Writhing Jar with high Reduced Charges roll and combine with belt mods or tree mods to reduce flask charges used and you can get three uses out of it (requires 13 charges or less per use). That's twelve seconds of Patient Reaper-ing for bosses. If your damage is sufficient, that should be enough for most typical map bosses.

It's never optimal to rely on on-kill effects, but it can be done, and otherwise Patient Reaper is outstanding for a lot of such builds.

The reason I asked in the first place was that I wanted to go for something a little different when 3.0 comes out. I haven't played an RF build yet, but didn't want to go Marauder, as most do. I was thinking about going Ascendant and choosing the Trickster and Pathfinder nodes. I understand the build might not be as faceroll as some, but hear out the process:

Most of my passives would be the same as a high life RF Marauder build (only starting from the Scion, which high life Marauder builds always pass by anyhow) so max life and regen should be similar without factoring in ascendancy.

Trickster

50% increased recovery for Health and Mana should make regen MORE than outpace the RF degen after managing to get into the +max fire resist territory to the point where regen should be, at least, on par with Marauder builds when clearning. I hadn't actually heard of the Writhing Jar before, 1453R, but I'd certainly keep one of those handy for a little help in boss fights.

20% more chance to evade while on full energy shield = worthless for this build.

20% increased damage while not on full energy shield = 100% uptime for this build.

15 Mana regen per second if you've used a movement skill recently = Pretty much 100% uptime for this build, as pretty much the only active attack you're using is Shield Charge.

(The bonuses to mana regen through this build make it tempting to try out the Mind over Matter nodes and split the RF damage between the two since in 3.0 it changes to all damage, instead of only "hits"...but I haven't really seen any math backing up this idea just yet...might be worth playing around with later on.)

Pathfinder

10% increased movement speed while using a flask. (Pretty much always if you're doing it right.)

50% chance to gain a flask charge when you deal a critical hit. (Certainly not a crit build by any means, but generally increased crit % support gem is attached to Shield Charge to proc Elemental Overload for RF damage, so should be of some benefit)

30% increased damage while using a flask (Again, pretty much always when it comes to flasks in this game.)

10% chance for your flasks to not consume charges (snazzy.)

Again, I'm sure this isn't the best build concept in the history of mankind...but do you see any glaring issues for why it won't work?

p.s. Also 3 additional passives when 8/8 Ascendancy points...More likely 2 for me, after 6/8 Ascendancy points...because I'm not awesome at this game. :)

I appreciate the feedback!

if you mean to try Ascendant, you'll want Trickster/Inquisitor, not Trickster/Pathfinder. Inquisitor comes with "Take 8% Reduced Elemental Damage when on Consecrated Ground" (as well as increased elemental damage). Pop a Sulfur flask, get 8% reduced Righteous Fire recoil. Make Righteous Fire much easier to work with, and also get a bunch of extra damage.

Also the math on MoM is that it needs intense mana regeneration but is otherwise phenomenal if you can sustain it. Yoji did some math in this video, here: Yoji on RF MoM.

Might want to look into it. For straight Trickster, though - straight Trickster can easily generate Frenzy charges, which you can turn into MOAR REGEN via Blood Dance boots. That's a route I've been plotting out, just to see how it goes.

Am I understanding you correctly, that the 8% Reduced Elemental Damage when on Consecrated Ground would cause 8% less damage to me from Righteous Fire? I didn't think there was any real way to diminish that other than Max Fire resist?

And this is probably a dumb question, but that 25% increased elemental damage does apply to RF, yeah?

I'm assuming the burn from RF doesn't count as an Elemental Ailment, since it's not ignite?

Thanks again for all the info...so much to learn.

Ignore part of that...didn't know Consecrated Ground had a 4% max life regen per second effect until I just looked it up. That certainly would help with survivability. :)

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niytstryke wrote:

Am I understanding you correctly, that the 8% Reduced Elemental Damage when on Consecrated Ground would cause 8% less damage to me from Righteous Fire? I didn't think there was any real way to diminish that other than Max Fire resist?

And this is probably a dumb question, but that 25% increased elemental damage does apply to RF, yeah?

I'm assuming the burn from RF doesn't count as an Elemental Ailment, since it's not ignite?

Thanks again for all the info...so much to learn.

You are correct on all of those assumptions.

I still think you are better off going pure Trickster than some Ascendant variant for RF + MoM. Go with Patient Reaper + Weave of the Arcane + Swift Killer + Walk the Aether. You can still use Sulfur flask for consecrated ground for other ascendancies than Inquisitor, you'll want to use that on any class you pick for RF.

With pure Trickster you'll get 41% inc. max mana and 50% mana regen which is a large boost. You'll have 40% inc. DOT damage, 70% inc. recovery rate of life and mana (20% better than the ascendant version), you can have free mana movement skill which is SUPER handy if MoM damage drains your supply. You'll have a bunch more attack and cast speed, again useful for movements skills and for any other spells you may use like scorching ray perhaps for the debuff. And you get free frenzy charges which open up a lot of cool gearing options to gain extra benefits (Blood Dance for example).

I leveled this up to 82 and it worked really well, I just had some crappy gear - not nearly enough flat life on it so I died a lot, but I had plenty of life and mana regen (something like 500+ life and 300+ mana regen). Atziri's Foible is very useful for a MoM build. Don't forget things like the pantheon too, you can get 5% reduced damage over time and also 5% fire damage taken while moving. And though it was nerfed, there is still the Leo mod you can craft.

EDIT: If my argument wasn't good enough, Trickster's Swift Killer node just got a massive buff in the most recent wave of 3.0 beta changes - you gain extra DOT damage from frenzy and power charges and the node now give yous both free frenzy and free power charges too. You also get +1 to max for both frenzy and power charges. HUGE buff for all Trickster builds no matter what skill you use.