Bosses difficulty vs average exploration difficulty balance
" So instead of trying to ask yourself why you died and how you can avoid it, you would rather think that the game is bad ? People need to stop with "I find this part in the game frustrating, hencefort it's bad, it's a game so it should not be frustrating !!!" because unless you are playing candycrush, this is a terrible way of thinking that would do the game more harm than good, really. The first tiers of maps are easy, and the bosses spice it up a bit. If you get to higher tiers, thing will start hitting much harder, not only the bosses. The thing is, among all the monster types, only couple of them can reach high / dangerous damage, most of the mob's types are like no threat. Some of those could use a buff, imho. (And a buff that would penalize ranges ideally, would be good ). Decrease the monster density, and buff many of the trash mobs, I would like that. PS : some archetypes have it easier against some particular encounters, and that is a good thing for the game. If you have troubles against haast, either dodge his projectiles or get a bit closer, ice spears has a huge crit change increase at long range. You have other examples of what is killing you with "heavy" spells ? " You don't, but if you suck at it, you can ease the pain by picking a setup that will do it more easily though. That, you can do yes. But any well built character should be able to run it, if the player knows what he is doing. " Damage scaling potential is too high imho, crit makes it too crazy, double dipping is still making it too crazy until 3.0.0. Those are the 2 biggest examples of things that should be tuned down that comes to mind right now. SSF is not and will never be a standard for balance, it is not for people entitled to getting more without trading.
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Ok, time to make some summary according to all opinions. So here is the list of most general, most crucial stuff that would improve the game greatly:
1) Make mobs a little bit more difficult, but also more predictive. So on average you can die more often in mobs fights (especially with rare monsters, some special mobs), but you quickly see what was wrong and learn how to avoid it. Currently is indeed the case that e.g. one can die by accidental discharge, were just a rare monster with elemental damage reflection happened to enter the range. 2) Bosses should give much higher drop and much more experience. E.g. first kill of a given boss with one character should give vast amount of experience. Perhaps that gain could be lowered if e.g. using portal during the fight to escape/recharge flasks. So there could be a pool of experience for one boss that would be transfered to a player in few same boss fights depending on player's performance. E.g. single uninterrupted fight should provide the whole pool at one fight. 3) Improve the playability for non-uber-optimized builds in late game. By late game I mean starting from Merciless ACT III (with Merciless lab ascendancy) and later. It seems that there is a switch in game progression, where suddenly from super easy build construction, things get really serious. That happens about in 3rd act of merciless difficulty, with Cruel Lab being added to that. After that the game gets unplayable with non optimized builds. And that is very frustrating for beginners and also defeats the purporse of such complex passive skill tree. With such approach it should be more difficult to actualy make a bad build and it seems it isn't. My first idea of how to make a game more playable for less optimized builds would be to introduce something like "handicap possibility" as an opposite e.g. to map mods. So that would be negative map mods. That would naturally come by the penalty of lower drop. Naturally the lab couldn't be handicapped, but that wouldn't matter, because if your build and skill is too weak yet or you simply find the lab boring, you could play on handicaped maps from higher tiers :). Last edited by Fnts7#2833 on May 6, 2017, 9:40:37 AM
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" Well the big issue here mainly is map mods. How they stack and interact with each other can make enemies insanely difficult or total pushovers. A good example for this is the blue colossal skeleton that might oneshot you if it spawns with extra damage and a bunch of nasty mods on your map. Another good example is core. A white core map has really easy bosses, Malachai in there isn't too hard and very predictable. Now try a double boss, inc. AoE, multi projectiles core... it is a whole other story despite not having any more oneshots, it is just so much harder to avoid most of the damage. Trashmobs are called like that for a reason, the thing is should a map only have one strong mob? Shouldn't exiles be a bit more sturdy or shouldn't there be potentially a few more uniques in maps? " Bosses should just get some of the loot trash mobs drop right now. They should also have more HP, at least some of them, some are decent, but there are a few bosses that just die too fast. Although 3.0 might change damage output a lot anyway, so maybe that is not necessary. And of course some of the bosses that have unfair mechanics should be looked up, but a few of those will always exist. " The big issues is that you can outplay bad resistances very easily in Act I and II of Merc. If you have low Lightning Res in Act III you might get toasted. Act III has a lot more unavoidable damage than the other two acts before and most of it is lightning. Act IV adds Fire and Cold to that as well, but there is not much reason to do it before mapping (which does have the same issue though). Normal Lab does feel a bit out of place in difficulty still (not as bad as it used to be), because normal anything else is so easy. Cruel feels better, but still not like Act III material. I usually am able to do it when I go to Merc (iE after finishing Cruel). Merc lab fits the best usually, I normally do it after getting the Skillpoint from Act IV, which is as far as I go there before leveling a bit in maps. But of course your build has a lot of influence on that, which is also true for the layout of the lab (or better the Izaro fight). |
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" Honestly this should be their priority |
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i'll just leave this here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pm8rKtv33Yg (know boss mechanics... and you wouldn't have a hard time) |
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" I disagree with that, making "bad" builds perform means make the game much less forgiving, it means that people's choices won't matter as much, and it also means less satisfaction when reaching a nice "performance threshold" on a build. Having "negative" map mods would basically pollute the map mods for those who build "properly" and don't need it, unless a new kind of rolling is implemented .... and honestly, I don't think iti's going to happen. Pretty much agree on 1) though. " Some do, the new exiles can be a bit more interesting than the old ones. For example, I don't have great gear, but I was in a vuln wasteland with my LL RF build the other day, and that chaos exile poped ..... well it wasn't a trivial encounter. SSF is not and will never be a standard for balance, it is not for people entitled to getting more without trading.
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" Thta was just one idea. The negative mods could be well separated. E.g. there is some kind of orb that makes the map 'handicapped'. That would mean lower drop, so people with better builds won't get any penalty, because at the same time they would play stronger maps faster, thus much better drop. It is about making game more fun - you want make a crazy, ridiculous build - no problem, just remember that you will have poor drop. It is also kind of making difficulty more scalable. That is one of few things that Diablo III has better to some extent - you can scale difficulty and thus drop of every area. |
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I feel like you just play maps white if u want crap drops for an easy time. If a build cant handle white maps then mistakes were obviously made, the player has failed part of the challenge set forth by the game and cant progress. In simple old games u have whatever, 3 lives lets say, you get to a boss, if u die 3 times u get a game over screen and you start again. you can succeed and you can fail, if you fail then you need to learn why, try again and hopefully succeed. Thats what gives meaning to success, without the potential to fail theres nothing great about winning.
I love all you people on the forums, we can disagree but still be friends and respect each other :)
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Thankyou for a great game, I've been playing about 4 months and would have agreed about the bosses until my latest char where I find some bosses that were damn hard before are now easy but others are hard (life vs es build, range etc). Some take some experience in how best to handle them but feel now most are good.
But have to agree about the mobs, the only time I think about the mobs is poorjoys where they have around 150% more life and damage. Scaling them up a bit would be a good thing. I also wonder why maps start at 67 rather than 71 (1 higher the harvest), bumping them all up would provide a slight difficultly boost and make the higher ones more rewarding experience wise for the 90+ players (why is there a hard level cap?). Last edited by WildWombat#5967 on May 14, 2017, 8:38:27 PM
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Bosses are fine
regular mobs need a serious buff. I remeber when elites (rares here) took like 5 min in D3 (im talking orginal inferno) they'd enrage and shit those were the days. Anyway somewhere between that and one shotting them like here would be good Git R Dun! Last edited by Aim_Deep#3474 on May 14, 2017, 8:24:03 PM
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