Donald Trump

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

You are trying to tell me that a choice of "Coke or Pepsi?" is important to a person who hates soda. The core of the problem isn't the 1-winner quality of the system, but the 2-choices quality, allowing the people who really control things to limit the American people to two great evils for a measuring contest.

I am telling you to think over your choice clearly if you hate soda. You are gonna have either Coke or Pepsi whether you like it or not. That is what America have to offer. If you have a better choice, you always welcome to try.

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Antnee wrote:

In any other election, I would agree with you Scrotie. Romney/McCain/Obama would realistically offer very little separation of policy, save for social issues. I wasn't the least bit afraid of them, I just saw them as yet another church-humping trickle-down-worshipping Winger in a long line of Wingers. BFD.

Trump is talking ridiculous shit like abandoning NATO, and allowing Russia to just roam around the European countryside.

He would factually, literally make my family in Europe less safe. This isn't coke vs Pepsi anymore, it's Coke vs room-temperature raw milk.

I really doubt that Trump said he (USA) abandons NATO.

If you think that NATO is reason that Russia is not "roaming" Europe than you are mistaken. In fact NATO is "roaming" not only Europe. Dont believe that countries are going to NATO willingly. They are forced to it. Its similar to Estonia: "do you want to be in EU? Than first you enter NATO." It works also like that. ...USA economy depends on military industry...

In fact actions of NATO makes not only Europe unsafe. For example USA nuclear weapons in Turkey, missiles in Romania, foreign army in Poland, subverting countries by military invasion or "revolutions" where leaders of countries became dictators etc.

I dont understand or feel your fear from possibility that if Trump is president that Europe or your family is going to be less safe. Its actually unsafe now? People of Europe are feeling unsafe from Islam as ideology and illegal immigrants who brings their problems to Europe. All that NATO (USA) propaganda massage that Russian people are "threat" to Everybody is emanation of paranoid mind of NATOs generals or their puppet masters. From fear and war are going to profit countries who are selling weapons.

And regards sentence "..allowing Russia..". Each country has right to self-determination. And history teaches that Russia will never be vassal as many other countries of Europe. Russian people wont in fact ALLOW nobody to do that. USA is not only one country who wish to take control of Russian territory. Just look at map all those resources Russia has. Its very easy to understand why NATO (political-military "formation" leaded by USA) want all people think Russia is threat - they want Russia territory and their resources. EU put sanctions on Russia and only loose while USA only profits to make dollar main currency by lowering value of Euro.

I hope Hillary wont win president elections as with her in chair there will be more blood. If she wins than you maybe should be troubled with safety not only of your family. Actually Trump and Putin are prepared to dialogue. Hillary is not. That makes people who follow leaders not only of USA weak and fearful. Besides elections in USA are not transparent any more due how votes are calculated..

Come to live to Europe for a year and change countries each two months. You will learn fast, that what you see in US newspapers is different than what is here. Your fear maybe is well-founded, but its based on politics of war mongers like Bush, Clinton, Obama. Trump for now is voting for dialogue and keeping law while Hillary and other puppets still talking bullshits about self-determined countries as "no soul and dangerous" countries and lawbreaking and breaking treaties and arrangements is ok.

ps: just saw recently that Trump said that all illegal immigrant going to be deported. He has no trouble with people who get to US legally.

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Antnee wrote:

Trump is talking ridiculous shit like abandoning NATO, and allowing Russia to just roam around the European countryside.

He would factually, literally make my family in Europe less safe. This isn't coke vs Pepsi anymore, it's Coke vs room-temperature raw milk.

In the context Trump used - an ultimatum of gradually reducing US participation if other countries don't pay their fair share - then I could go on a rant about how you're exaggerating. But at the end of the day, even if it's not by a large amount, you're right: less safe for you.

But more safe for me. Long-term, anyway; short-term, maybe not so much. Our foreign policy at the moment is an utterly ridiculous scheme of paying for all kinds of crap which isn't ours to keep everyone happy with us. Essentially, the US is the world's sugar daddy. It can't go on forever like this.

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

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Antnee wrote:

Trump is talking ridiculous shit like abandoning NATO, and allowing Russia to just roam around the European countryside.

He would factually, literally make my family in Europe less safe. This isn't coke vs Pepsi anymore, it's Coke vs room-temperature raw milk.

In the context Trump used - an ultimatum of gradually reducing US participation if other countries don't pay their fair share - then I could go on a rant about how you're exaggerating. But at the end of the day, even if it's not by a large amount, you're right: less safe for you.

But more safe for me. Long-term, anyway; short-term, maybe not so much. Our foreign policy at the moment is an utterly ridiculous scheme of paying for all kinds of crap which isn't ours to keep everyone happy with us. Essentially, the US is the world's sugar daddy. It can't go on forever like this.

"I'd have to think about it" if a NATO member is attacked is in and of itself damaging.

American Adventurism is what you fear; NATO is not the problem.

Apparently you don't speak Trumpese. "I'd have to think about it" is an evasive non-answer. The reason it's a non-answer is because Trump is trying to win an election appealing to those with similar but much more extreme positions. We're talking about the same guy hesitant to denounce David Duke for fucks sake. I think it's unwise to read any more into his non-answers beyond "I don't want to alienate my base by answering."

He is more concerned about alienating his base by answering, than alienating you by not answering. And why wouldn't he be?

And yes, significant numbers of Trump supporters are racist and/or isolationist assholes. I totally get why Trump reacted as he did to the David Duke question - mostly, he was pissed off, thinking something like "motherfucker just made me lose the crazy white supremacist vote." Which he knew he had. (Video here. Notice how he starts his reply with "Just so you understand, I don't..." If you play poker at all you should be getting a read.) You might say his reaction to anger in that moment wasn't ideal, and it wasn't, but unwillingness to comment when enraged is probably a positive trait, even if being an easily angered hothead isn't.

If you're thinking "what about principles, who cares about their votes?" then you're obviously not cut out for politics.

So, in a nutshell, you're saying "don't pay attention to what he says".

...alright.

So what do I judge him on as a candidate?

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

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solwitch wrote:

I wonder how many scholars, doctors, engineers or anyone with a doctorate degree is actually voting for trump... None because they're mostly foreigners. When is the last time you've seen an pure bred American Caucasian Doctor at a hospital? I rest my case...

http://kff.org/other/state-indicator/distribution-by-race-ethnicity/

Even has a statistic for non-US citizen. 1.9%.

Still resting?

Yes... I thought you were smarter than those that post graphs and charts that have no idea what their looking at. It's obvious you do not know how America runs. I hate when people Google shit and copy/paste. :P

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Antnee wrote:

So, in a nutshell, you're saying "don't pay attention to what he says".

Not what I said. I was saying to consider the audience in interpreting remarks.

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Schmodderhengst wrote:

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Antnee wrote:

"I voted third party, in a heavily contested county that went to Bush, in 2000. To this day, I can't help but feel that 2000 was a little bit my fault"

Antnee quoting someone else here...

This. If someone is willing to vote for Stein e.g. , he/she will very likely support Trump by doing so. I would not want to risk that. If you have proportional representation (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proportional_representation) in a country, it´s different, parties have to form coalitions. So unless any party has an absolute majority, no vote is really lost.

"my vote doesn´t count anyway"

I once saw a comedian making his whole audience say: " I alone can´t do anything " :-).

I'm not sure if you're aware what an electoral college is. as someone residing in California, I ask you to tell me how does my vote for either major candidate matter ? thanks

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Antnee wrote:

Trump is talking ridiculous shit like abandoning NATO, and allowing Russia to just roam around the European countryside.

He would factually, literally make my family in Europe less safe. This isn't coke vs Pepsi anymore, it's Coke vs room-temperature raw milk.

Youre over-exaggerating the impact of america being more isolationist and also over-exaggerating the 'big evil' of Russia. Russia is the US, only on other coast.
And, Russia hasnt roamed the countryside of Europe since Peter the Great, and it has no interest in territories other than its soviet historic territories that its people have lived in. So apart from Finland and few Russia-bounded former soviet republics, there is literally nothing to worry about even if Russia suddenly gets imperialistic fever.

Foreign policy is in fact one concrete reason I could find to vote FOR Trump. Im also trying to read in about his trade policies, but those are a bit more complicated so it will take some time for me to figure out.