[Suggestion] Class Restricted Active Skills, Supports, and Items

If we're going to have class restricted passive points, why not just have class restricted everything?

Class restricted uniques
Class restricted item bases and/or weapon categories and/or armour categories
Class restricted item affixes
Class restricted potions
Class restricted quests
Class restricted skill gems
Ascension class unlocked hideout decorations
Ascension class unlocked cosmetic MTX

MonopolyLegend had a suggestion: obtaining access to other ascension classes by traveling to their corresponding starting nodes, posted here https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1484512/page/1

All of the arguments against this suggestion are directly compatible with adding more class restrictions to the game. In many cases they can be pasted here verbatim.

Ultimately, the more GGG restricts the more casual friendly and easier to balance the game becomes. With respect to PoE's vast skill system, passive tree, and item selection? Slice and partition it all so the masses can select a cookie cutter class spec.

The more restrictions the better.

Ok i will bite.

Since this has to be one of the most obvious bait threads EVER, so congratz on that :)

Your confusing class flexibility with class identity. The former we have an overflow of now that infringes on the later.

The sub-class system will try to shift this current situation so that flexibility is still abundant but class identity is also relevant to the creation process. Thus emphasizing both factors more in the whole that is PoE.

As a result, a dead-eye fireball caster will very much still be possible post-ascendancy, but it will not ONLY look different it will actually also behave and play different to it's shadow or witch counterpart.

The class will mater but flexibility is still maintained at a very high degree.

Your proposal would shift the balance more in favor to class identity while limiting flexibility.
And moderation is key here i believe.
That is not to say it doesn't have merit, but given that PoE strives for a large degree of flexibility, to much of a thing might be a bad thing.

Hope that makes sense.

tl;dr the current proposed sub-class system elevates class identity greatly without having a severe impact on class flexibility. Your proposal would, since it cant function with over-arching mechanics, which the sub-class system can.

Peace,

-Boem-

"

Vhlad wrote:

Class restricted quests

Lore-wise I could actually agree with this one. If you could do a side quest that somehow related to the past, before "you" entered Wraeclast, it would give more depth to the character you're playing as. Considering how dramatically PoE is changing atm, it's not a thing that should happen anytime soon, but say, two to three years to the future perhaps? After PoE has (hopefully) stabilized a little more.

"

Your proposal would shift the balance more in favor to class identity while limiting flexibility.
And moderation is key here i believe.
That is not to say it doesn't have merit, but given that PoE strives for a large degree of flexibility, to much of a thing might be a bad thing.

So if they add only a few class restricted uniques and weapon/armour bases it's OK?

Of course, if a regular passive has 1% block or 2% spell block and an ascension class passive has 29% block + 28% spell block (or 100% of block chance applies to spells), then maybe the power differential between a regular item and an ascension class restricted item should be similar. Like a shadow restricted imperial skean that does 986-4002 base damage instead of 17-69.

^Your misinterpreting my post to suit your aim.

Understandable given the nature of this thread.

The flexibility remains because the new nodes provided by sub-classes can be interpreted differently to serve multiple arch-type builds.(= flexibility remains and is allowed)

The sub-class system works to provide identity and at the same time allow flexibility in that identity, while your suggestion would not.

Peace,

-Boem-

edit : to approach it from a different angle.

A summoner can be played "efficiently" from witch/templar and scion, i would argue the same will be true post-ascendancy, but they will play differently.(= hench => identity is provided and flexibility remains)

However, if we lock "summon zombie" as a skill gem behind the "necromancer" sub-class of witch you are not only infringing on templar and scion in flexibility but also the witch her other sub-classes. So yes, you increase identity (only a "necromancer" witch could run around with zombie's) but you detract from flexibility to achieve it.

As a min maxer I see absolutely no flexibility in class choice for a number of skill specs post ascendency whatsoever. The power differential is too high.

It's akin to adding a shadow restricted dagger that does 986-4002 base damage while saying weapon choice is still flexible, because shadows can still use the other weapons (or spells!) if they want to and if another class wants to use a dagger they have their choice of the regular ones.

"

Vhlad wrote:

As a min maxer I see absolutely no flexibility in class choice for a number of skill specs post ascendency whatsoever. The power differential is too high.

It's akin to adding a shadow restricted dagger that does 986-4002 base damage while saying weapon choice is still flexible, because they can still use the other weapons if they want to.

It's nice that we have SOMEONE here who can see four months in to the future, past TWO patches that have YET TO HIT.

Whether ascendancy will become one of the biggest factors to determine class choice is debatable, but your claim of not seeing any flexibility at this point in time is absolutely ludicrous.

"

mynameisonlyforthegods wrote:

Whether ascendancy will become one of the biggest factors to determine class choice is debatable.

Players already choose classes based on 2-5 points of efficiency. And you're suggesting Permanent Fortify, 100% Spell Block, Something to the tune of 260% Specter Damage, Pierce is Crit and a free extra projectile or chain, ect. ect. Will be anything other than the primary factor in class choice you're daft.

Not "one of the biggest" But literally THE biggest

Alternatively, equally flammable idea:

Replace all currently existing classes with the same character model. The same. Identical. Model. Make it a bland boring faceless nameless voiceless thing with no clear gender, as close as possible to an animated mannekin, and allow it to select Position 1 through Position 7 on the skill tree. They're not class starts, they're just Positions 1-7. All positions get access to all Ascendancies, because there's no classes anymore, just the same mannekin starting in different spots. Created characters get no names, either - they're just assigned a numeric string by server RNG to serve as an identifier so minmaxers can get into leagues faster.

Now, if you want to be a Ranger? Buiy the "Ranger 'Class'" MTX skin/voice pack in the store, and it applies a purely cosmetic effect to your nameless faceless voiceless mannekin that enables the Ranger's base appearance and voice pack. You want a name, instead of being 165T3g4? Buy the 'Unique Character Name' MTX and replace your numeric tag with choice of name. Existing characters are grandfathered in, but any future characters have to pay for class identifiers. That way 'minmaxers' can just avoid having to commit to anything at all, play a nameless faceless voiceless mannekin with whatever gaudy MTX armor effects they want, and PoE can dispense entirely with the notion of having characters instead of 'toons'.

Sound good to you, Vhlad?

No?

...we done with hyperbole, then? Good. Now try again please, this time without blatant ridiculousness like 4k damage daggers.

Was about to post sth, but then I realized that the post directly above this one was pretty well to the point already.

+1 to that post, -1 to the thread.