Are there any other games which gate content behind RNG like PoE?

"

Derpey wrote:

Well, maps are in fact the "real thing" since the Acts are that fast to rush through. Not sure if anyone would pay for PoE just to play these 4 Acts 3 times, considering you don't even complete Merciless Act4, because there's no real point to it.
So no, you're mistaken in this assumption.

That's how you choose to play it.

You could also take your time there, read flavor texts, collect low-level items, farm cruel merveil or whatever. It's a free game with free zones, do whatever you want.

campaign = content
maps/rifts/endlessdungeon/PvP/... = bonus content for people who can't get enough

Extending the playtime, no more progression, an exponential level curve and diminishing xp return... Most ARPGs have this in common after the campaign.

P.S.: The last achievement is (suitably named) "dimishing returns" at lvl 90.
The Game doesn't even reward you for 100, it doesn't give a fuck.

In Maplestory certain Bosses required the players to form a party and well one of the more annoying ones which required doing a platform puzzle and sometimes Trivia Quizzes which usually require you to understand South Korean culture.

"

RestInPieces wrote:

First of all, if you were ALWAYS getting rewards after clearing a hard map then everyone would be running around with top gear being able to beat anything and that's it. Check the paragraph where I mention skill-gating. Skill-gating is not feasible and most people will consider it even more unfair unless it is gated for THEIR skill level. That's the truth...

Yes, not all content should not be available for everyone. The same things should not be available for someone who devoted 2 hours a day and someone else who devotes 12. How spoiled can one be to want such a thing? It's almost shocking!

And what does that have to do with how I feel about other people or how many friends I have for laughing out loud! If that was an attempt for insult, it was a rather failed one and only made you look bad mate.

Also you clearly misunderstood the paragraph you set in bold. I said that because you don't want to trade you use RNG gating as an excuse, but trading would get you out of your RNG predicament because you would be able to earn enough income to progress. I hate trading too but if a self-found character was able to "beat" the game then the game wouldn't even resemble an online game - there wouldn't be any need for economy, the crafting system would be redudant etc etc.

The discussion about the viable builds is obviously a different one and I already have shared my input on the Awakening builds. In a few words, imo, they have failed at making certain changes and build balancing and a lot of builds are not viable anymore as a result.

Also whether it's boring or not is a matter of VARIETY. I want more options for an endgame as well. But I don't want them to be more accessible than maps, which I am sure is what you had in mind. I just want more options for variety, not easier endgate accessibility.

It's actually unreal how stubborn you are.
What do you actually think I mean with "rewards"? You think I want a guaranteed Shav's or what..?
I just want to see perhaps a guaranteed rare item from a strongbox with pretty retarded mods, instead of the classic full white item and an armourer scrap.
Therenext nothing bad would happen if they DID increase droprates of build-enabling Uniques, all it would do is increase build diversity, so what if your Shav's isn't bloody 25-30 Ex, it's still around 15-20.

Also in term of map drops, I couldn't care less if I get -1 or -2, even -4, a map is a map, but when I rolled 78 Maps in Beyond with 120+ Quant and didn't see a single map drop, not even a bloody Tropical Island, then you get depressed, because you just used your hard earned currencies on said map, and you got technically only EXP out of it. Even though that's the whole idea, getting no improvement into your character is just lackluster.

How did it make me look bad? You're the one who obviously have some grudge against other players since you don't like them to see any part of the "endgame" which is maps, well surprise m8, maps are easily achieveable.
Also, I'm one of those players that plays like 6-10 hours a day, yet I'm one of the players who think this game really needs a giant tweak in term of awful RNG-gated content.

And no, I completely understood it, but your paragraph didn't solve it, it brought it back to the horrendous RNG this game suffers from. Fucking hell, the self-found 1month League was a PRIME example to how fucking trash self-found truly it.
I bet everybody who's been using a Loot Filter lately have noticed an insane change in term of noticeable drops, I've cleared maps and seen a total of 13 items once, not counting currencies.

I never said endgame should be easier accessed, I'm saying they should reduce the overall time span people spend on let's say CHAOS RECIPE SPAMMING as I've done for so many Leagues in row now because RNG truly hates me.

I've asked around, and all my friends are leaving 1 by 1, because this game just doesn't have a proper Risk vs. Reward system at the moment.
Once again, I would instantly drop PoE if there were another ARPG with good mechanics to work with and actually somewhat rewarded you for risking your life.
Sadly the only ARPG I've seen come out lately is Grim "Yawn" which is pretty dull.

You have not mastered all the features needed in this game. I can eliminate rng for you.

open trade chat. offer orbs for fragments.

but orbs are rng gated you say? Then you don't understand trade yet.

edit: Increasing drops of build enabling uniques wouldn't really increase diversity. It would end up similar to d3 (depending how much you increased them) every one would just find the best build for a given class (or perhaps skill gem in this case) and just hunt those and rape with them. Which is still essentially what happens in the top tiers it seems. Anyway, I am done with teh forum for now. I am off to play cruel mode. Just because I am in no hurry to get back to the wall of maps.

Everyone keeps telling me that this game is all about end game (maps, atziri, whatever) but all that seems to happen when I get there is I 1-3 shot things for hours on end waiting for something worthwhile to drop, so I can 1-3 shot things faster to collect teh same shitteh loots. Have fun with that.

I would like to remind you guys, this is a GAME. Have fun with it. If your fun is dropping shiny things, go self found. Stop ruining your fun with skipping so many upgrades in between. If you are being competitive for ladder, you better have 12+ hours a day to dedicate... unless you are competing with friends of course. If you just want to be rich, stop playing the "game" and open poe.trade and sit in your hideout. Any time spent not looking for loot to flip you are wasting your time.

Find what makes the game fun for you, and enjoy it. Stop trying to make your characters as good as people that have 3x as much time as you. Stop blaming this game on gated content (the only thing you can really say is gated is atziri anyway) because the top of the ladder got there with gear you couldn't believe it could be done in. Not to mention there is literally zero difference between a 69 map and an 80 map if your goal is to explode monsters and get shitty loot. If you want to talk about t1 mods, I honestly believe you would have more success buying a few level 80 maps, looting the base items you want and wasting your 10-20 chaos that you waste on maps rerolling that item until you get better mods. This game isn't that hard, and a lot of people are playing the game "wrong." by "wrong" I mean they are trying to play this game for fun, but are taking their own enjoyment out of it.

p.s. I am having a blast. running my first wander, with less than 3 chaos on gear watching things go boom. Died twice. once to afk and once to a silly strongbox open on my part, because I was too stingy with my wisdom scrolls early on. find the fun.

"

Xavderion wrote:

Would you like time gating better? Like do Atziri just once a week? That's what most MMOs are doing to stretch their content :)

This isnt a MMO and running content too easy is poor design. Players get bored. It's like you spent all this time min maxing, playing trade house, leveling gems and forced to do face roll content. No game does that but this one. And not by choice, otherwise if you thought that was cool and a good idea you'd run through cruel again after you beat merciless.

No one does that by choice because it's stupid just like no one should be forced into 76 maps if they can handle 80s (or 74 if they can handle 78 - pick any spread you catch my meaning)

"

Aim_Deep wrote:

"

Xavderion wrote:

Would you like time gating better? Like do Atziri just once a week? That's what most MMOs are doing to stretch their content :)

This isnt a MMO and running content too easy is poor design. Players get bored. It's like you spent all this time min maxing, playing trade house, leveling gems and forced to do face roll content. No game does that but this one. And not by choice, otherwise if you thought that was cool and a good idea you'd run through cruel again after you beat merciless.

No one does that by choice because it's stupid just like no one should be forced into 76 maps if they can handle 80s

I don't know man, sure as hell feels like one. Alone the fact GGG keeps making content aimed towards the no-life community that they love for some weird reason, sort of points that reaction.

I just start new characters when maps dry up. I refuse to run face roll content low maps and rebuild. Sometimes its 85 sometimes the 90s, but it always happens even before this nerf. Most ppl just quit till next season.
ladders are dead about 2 month in. D3s are still kicking.
i wonder why.

"

morbo wrote:

"

Boem wrote:

To answer your question though, any random based item game gates content behind RNG, since you first have to acquire the gear threshold to complete the encounter.

Yep, gear should be enough of a gate. But here you can have the gear, but no content, cause RNGSatan said no maps for you.

While you are correct, the issue is not so one sided.

First of all gating is required in a game, it implements thresholds and challenges for a player to overcome.

It stimulates problem solving and creativity.(which is the true nature of "a game")

After completion, the player is rewarded with fulfillment or a joyful experience.

If this holds true, the question remains how do we gate and what are our goals?

To put it simple, would you rather not have the gear?
Would you rather have a deterministic model that requires you to farm 150 hours before attaining an 82 map?
(because there is no way GGG can provide the end-game content in less hours in a deterministic model)

Further more the notion of a deterministic model is taboo, since PoE involves a ladder and competition.
It would render this part of the game useless if ever implemented, since it would result into a "most time spend wins" by default.

Rng is and always will be the casuals best friend in a game like this, whether they realize this is irrelevant at best.

Peace,

-Boem-

There is one major flaw with the game, and until it is changed/fixed, game will be fucked up forever.

And that flaw is that maps are main currency sink in the game, when it should be crafting.

If this would be changed, game could improve in so many directions and fields.

"

BoondockSaint wrote:

There is one major flaw with the game, and until it is changed/fixed, game will be fucked up forever.

And that flaw is that maps are main currency sink in the game, when it should be crafting.

If this would be changed, game could improve in so many directions and fields.

Sad part is GGG rather listen to the no-lifers, who all claim the game to be "fine" in its current state.