[3.2] Scionic Flametank "16k ES ed." (ES-CI-ZO-GR, SR-CWC-FS, extensive guide)

How is this build in 2.3 ? Loved the build when i played it ;)

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arisnaub wrote:

How is this build in 2.3 ? Loved the build when i played it ;)

I wanna know the same

Any thoughts about viability of this build in 2.6?

How about in 3.0?

We, the people, need an update for this beloved build!

I haven't played it in 3.0, and to be honest, the murder of ES in 3.0 pretty much eliminates the major selling point of "tank just about everything without moving". Combined with the long-awaited slaughter of chaos poisoning which I took advantage of to offset the triple-nerf of Incinerate in 2.1, I thought I'd be looking at something different in 3.0.


That said, I did try statting out how it would work in 3.0 with BIS T2 items - i.e. something close to what most people would be able to acquire over a considerable time via trading without having to acquire extremely expensive multiple-T1 affix or mirror quality gear.

It looks like OCC is still obligatory as one of the ascendancies, and the other should either be JUG for the stun and chill immunity or DEA for the extra projectile, projectile speed, etc.

For pantheon:
Minor: Tukohama with upgrade for the regen
Major: Brine King (if DEA ascendancy) for the partial stun immunity, Lunaris or Solaris (if JUG) for physical damage reduction

Here is the hypothetical level 100 version of such (pastebin => path of building), taking advantage of Witch alternate start to trade 3 skill nodes (6% ES + 2x10 INT) that will be used until Lab#4 was completed for 1 skill node (25% mana regen, 14 max ES).

JUG-OCC, L90
https://pastebin.com/N6tmgXFm

JUG-OCC, L100
https://pastebin.com/rBmav7B3

Before flasks, it ends up with 11.8k ES, 2.3k ES regen (before pantheon bonus), and 2364 ES leech cap (only against enemies cursed by the CWDT curses), 11% evasion, 7.8k armour.

(Note that I haven't bothered adding resists, extra dexterity, spelldamage except on the nice T2 weapons or stuff like that to the equipment so it'll show up with negligible resistances - the point was finding out just what sort of ES and ES regen would be acquired, and whether the damage would be sufficient given a 6L and a very good but nowhere near BIS T1 weapon)

Which admittedly is sort of respectable, but we are no longer in "grin as you eat Atziri's empowered flameblasts" or "grin as you facetank red map bosses" territory - the player will have to move.


The really sad thing is that it is possible the build will deal more damage using a SR-CWC setup as it uses so little mana that the mana leech can be omitted given some +mana on gear, you don't need the LMP, and SR strips those in the ray of resistances to help the Firestorm, i.e.

Scorching Ray - Cast While Channeling - Fire Penetration - Firestorm - Elemental Focus (5) - Controlled Destruction (6), rather than

Incinerate - Mana Leech - Lesser Multiple Projectiles - Fire Penetration - Faster Casting (5) - Elemental Focus (6)


Heck, it might even be worth it going LIFE, for a 15-25% smaller health pool but gaining the ability to use life flasks and going JUG-DEA without losing out on anything significant from the Witch baby ascendancy. :-D

Ha, ha, and triple ha!

I was wrong. Well, I was right that I wouldn't be able to make something as defensively strong as when I last played in 2.3, but I was wrong in that something as sad as those path of building examples from the last post was the best that could be done.

The reason is the introduction of two uniques since I last played, that allowed me to overhaul the flametank concept, accepting somewhat lower ES (a necessity due to 3.0 changes) in favour of greatly increased offensive potential. Not enough to make it a high damage build, obviously, but something that it should be comfortably powerful for a tank build.

I did have to replace Incinerate with Scorching Ray-CWC-Firestorm, so it isn't quite as pleasant to use without that crispy crackling incinerate sound, and it does have to occasionally move rather than facetank everything, and there's no way to play this solo self found, but sacrifices had to be made and on the positive side it now plays quite pleasantly on a 5L, where the old flametank felt clumsy until you hit got 6L.

It was Geofri's Sanctuary and the Shaper's Touch that did the trick due to how well they combined with Doon Cuebeyari and Alberon's Warpath. The new and improved flametank is all about abusing strength in creative ways.



I have played it until 71 so far and am tweaking the configuration as I go. I am confident it will be able to deal with anything in the game introduced up to 2.3, but cannot speak to how or whether it is capable of dealing with anything new to the game since then (including the Atlas of Worlds' bosses).


I'll get working on an updated guide once I've gone CI in a few levels.

Until then, here is the current state of my ascendant at 71 to give an idea of how it works.

https://pastebin.com/QmH7RhxA

I am currently pathing towards Whispers of Doom for dual-cursing, to be followed by Unnatural Calm and getting myself a decent shield, belt, and amulet, while fixing resistances. Then going CI and swapping in an Energy From Within in the socket in the Duelist area. Which sounds like going CI at 81 and never looking back - something like that, at any rate

I'm looking forward to your new guide. What skill do you suggest for leveling? Which quality gems do you find the most important, planning to buy them asap.

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g4zu wrote:

I'm looking forward to your new guide. What skill do you suggest for leveling? Which quality gems do you find the most important, planning to buy them asap.

I leveled using firestorm which felt a bit clumsy at start and realistically going with some melee skill might have been more efficient since I started pathing through a lot of STR nodes (sunder or molten strike, probably). Or perhaps just going fire totems. But I was in no particular hurry and had picked up a quality firestorm knowing that I would use it, so starting out using it felt natural.

No quality gems are necessary or of ultra-high priority, but everything does add up and in order of priority I would suggest:

1. Firestorm: up to 20% increased fire damage on the main damage skill FS is nothing to sneeze at
2. Cast While Channeling, Controlled Destruction: up to 10% increased to both SR and FS i provided by each and they are used in a 4L
3. Iron Will: up to 10% increased to both SR and FS and it is the 5th link.
4. Enfeeble - the build uses Enfeeble for tough bosses/maps where the player prefers ultra safety over the added damage of flammability, and a bit less accuracy and critical strike chance for enemies is nice.
5. Ice Spear: IS is used to help proc elemental overload, so having one with high projectile speed makes it more likely it'll hit if you are taking damage from moving ranged targets.



I hope to have the guide - as a work in progress, since I've only leveled to 81 so far - published latest by EOD tomorrow, Thursday.

The guide in post #1 has now been updated. It still needs a bit of work with regards to leveling, but it ought to be enough to go on and I have tried to explain the interactions that makes it run like clockwork while abusing several game mechanics to the utmost.

Feel free to ask questions if there's anything that is unclear or needs to be explained better.


The essence of the build should be clear to anybody from one screenshot alone - the level 86 in-combat defensive stats with 2 flasks popped:



And if that looks somewhat sick for a character that isn't into end-game maps yet and uses items worth 1-10c each in Harbinger*, realize that the flametank was also ES leeching at the same time with Firestorm and gaining 100% increased ES recovery, so doubling the amount of regeneration and leeching received.


*With the obvious exceptions of the 30-40c 5L Geofri's Sanctuary and Energy From Within jewel.

Thanks for the guide. One question tho, why no more ice spear + ICS?