Update on Deterministic Lockstep

100 ms stable and below.

"

AgnosiousD wrote:

The key thing to consider here: what does 100 ms mean?

100ms is 1 tenth of a second.

are you all proposing that you can react faster than ten times
a second? I must assure you that biologically you can not.

back in the day counterstrike was playable at 200-300 ms.
though we would notice this was inadequate at some instances.

the moment cable internet showed up, offering sub 100ms,
it was 100% player skill. you lost because you were slow,
not your internet.

100ms is blindingly fast, you can not react that fast at all.

I have to disagree partially. As someone who's used to playing at 50ms and below, I can totally feel the difference when the ms jumps to 100 because Im on a russian server or whatever reason. Can I biologically react 10 times a second? Probably not. Can I tell the difference between 50ms? Definitely yes.

"

rinleezwins wrote:

"

AgnosiousD wrote:

The key thing to consider here: what does 100 ms mean?

100ms is 1 tenth of a second.

are you all proposing that you can react faster than ten times
a second? I must assure you that biologically you can not.

back in the day counterstrike was playable at 200-300 ms.
though we would notice this was inadequate at some instances.

the moment cable internet showed up, offering sub 100ms,
it was 100% player skill. you lost because you were slow,
not your internet.

100ms is blindingly fast, you can not react that fast at all.

I have to disagree partially. As someone who's used to playing at 50ms and below, I can totally feel the difference when the ms jumps to 100 because Im on a russian server or whatever reason. Can I biologically react 10 times a second? Probably not. Can I tell the difference between 50ms? Definitely yes.

Oh for sure, there's a huge difference in feel and reg between 15 - 20ms and 50ms in CS, and 100ms isn't even worth playing IMO.

I sit at 30ms in PoE so this new system will be great for me, I honestly can't wait to test it out. Desync was one of the reasons I quit in the first place (just recently came back).

40-60 ms here DL will be the way to go for me .

"

The key thing to consider here: what does 100 ms mean?

100ms is 1 tenth of a second.

are you all proposing that you can react faster than ten times
a second? I must assure you that biologically you can not.

back in the day counterstrike was playable at 200-300 ms.
though we would notice this was inadequate at some instances.

the moment cable internet showed up, offering sub 100ms,
it was 100% player skill. you lost because you were slow,
not your internet.

100ms is blindingly fast, you can not react that fast at all.

According to a quick Google search:

"Here it is! The average reaction time for humans is 0.25 seconds to a visual stimulus, 0.17 for an audio stimulus, and 0.15 seconds for a touch stimulus. Dec 1, 2012"

You can find additional statistics here: http://www.humanbenchmark.com/tests/reactiontime/leaderboard

Hello ,

Can anyone tell me server ip adress so i can check my latency and packet loss.

I am runing some test with 173.192.44.20(the server that host's the website) ,but i wonder is the website hosted on same machine like server host (or are they in the same country at least)


1408 bytes from 173.192.44.20: icmp_req=1 ttl=57 time=156 ms
1408 bytes from 173.192.44.20: icmp_req=2 ttl=57 time=156 ms
1408 bytes from 173.192.44.20: icmp_req=3 ttl=57 time=156 ms
1408 bytes from 173.192.44.20: icmp_req=4 ttl=57 time=156 ms
1408 bytes from 173.192.44.20: icmp_req=5 ttl=57 time=156 ms
1408 bytes from 173.192.44.20: icmp_req=6 ttl=57 time=156 ms
1408 bytes from 173.192.44.20: icmp_req=7 ttl=57 time=156 ms
1408 bytes from 173.192.44.20: icmp_req=8 ttl=57 time=156 ms
1408 bytes from 173.192.44.20: icmp_req=9 ttl=57 time=156 ms
1408 bytes from 173.192.44.20: icmp_req=10 ttl=57 time=156 ms
1408 bytes from 173.192.44.20: icmp_req=11 ttl=57 time=157 ms

--- 173.192.44.20 ping statistics ---
11 packets transmitted, 11 received, 0% packet loss, time 10003ms
rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 156.692/156.776/157.050/0.389 ms

My opinion is that everything less than 200-250 ms should be ok ( maybe with small lag if you have more than 170-180ms,but still better than desync that we have now )

P.S

I think its more important to dont have jitter (jitter is the variation in the time between packets arriving)

"

AgnosiousD wrote:

The key thing to consider here: what does 100 ms mean?

100ms is 1 tenth of a second.

are you all proposing that you can react faster than ten times
a second? I must assure you that biologically you can not.

back in the day counterstrike was playable at 200-300 ms.
though we would notice this was inadequate at some instances.

the moment cable internet showed up, offering sub 100ms,
it was 100% player skill. you lost because you were slow,
not your internet.

100ms is blindingly fast, you can not react that fast at all.

Like others have said, it doesn't come down to just reflexes. You're very right that 1/10th of a second is a very quick time to do anything but when it comes to perception it's actually not. If you take human vision for example, we start to see fluid motion around 20-24 frames per second and increases in quality until around 60 fps where it starts to become imperceptible. What that means is that at minimum, 1 frame should update every 41 milliseconds for you to see fluid motion at minimum. That's part of the challenge when you're playing at 60ms lag and higher. You want the servers to sync, but you don't want your players to perceive a choppiness when there doesn't have to be. Animation design helps with this and predictive systems greatly help improve visual smoothness if you're experiencing more than 100ms lag where your eyes are getting less than half what it needs to perceive motion properly. I think this lockstep mode is potentially very very good but the challenges for those tempted to get rid of desync is to risk very VERY noticeable lag spikes.

Consciously, 100ms is not sufficient time to perform a reaction and in this case you're absolutely correct. Typically conscious reaction that involves intention and not reflex typically requires somewhere between 350 and 500ms to perform a reaction that we're consciously aware of. But when it comes to sensory systems, it's far faster.

"

Radjehuty wrote:

...If you take human vision for example, we start to see fluid motion around 20-24 frames per second and increases in quality until around 60 fps where it starts to become imperceptible...

i can't find my bookmark, there's a site explaining finely how the human eye doesn't work with a fps scale of measurement.
i can't believe this urban legend still exists.

oh my god take my money please GGG

just what i need!! thanks!