You need to rework your loot filters ASAP.

OK, I'm kind of already at the end of my rope and I've only been playing this game for a few days. I was fine until a level or two ago when my loot suddenly stopped appearing onscreen. I thought "OK, bug". Posted in the bug report forum only to be told it is not only not a bug, but that I should like playing the game like this.

I don't.

I get runs with drops that look like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIuHunyEHFI

and this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZlzVfsHm0c

Now, it not only feels bad to see less items drop in a loot hunt game, especially when you're a newcomer and you're still leveling up, but it ends up being bad because someone made the conscious decision to use someone's filters that force you to play "their way" and you get no say in it whatsoever. None.

Now, it took a fair bit of searching for me to finally find out that these filters were originally designed by a fellow that goes by the moniker "Neversink" (hence the "NS" in the filter names on the PS4's list). I've read that he's very well respected for the work he's done creating and updating filters, which are primarily based on the economy of the game. That's fine and dandy if I cared a whit about the economy. I'm primarily a solo player that might indulge in the occasional trade, but whom prefers to find his own items most of the time, i.e. I like to earn my keep when possible.

Now, the filters force me to hold L3 constantly just to see what dropped, but the fun doesn't end there. Oooh no. In the "Default" setting, I have to hold L3 to see items, and continue holding L3 while flicking the R stick to align the highlight. I got used to using the R stick for highlights fairly early on - it's a console limitation after all and I'm accustomed to those on games ported from the PC. But when using any of the "NS" filters, of which I chose "0" (Soft) to see the most loot, it was still hiding items, forcing me to press L3, and even when pressing L3 some items appears to be hidden as well as I found when switching immediately back to "Default" - I could then see all items using L3. But I still had to hold L3 anyway.

But then we have another problem - the NS filters apparently also screw with opacity of background block which surrounds the text and modifies the text to be super tiny. I'm literally sitting with my nose up against my 46" TV and having trouble reading the text with the NS filters engaged, let alone from several feet back. Not everyone has 20/10 vision you know. And this is at 1080p, not 1440p or 4k. I can't imagine trying to read the text at 4k with these filters active.

Example: https://imgur.com/4XtdB9p

So now I'm at a point in the game (barely into Act 3!) and a) I have missing loot I can't see unless I hold L3 and/or press it constantly as I move around the map, b) super tiny text with background opacity making it damn near impossible to see let alone read, and c) no control over any of the above.

I'm not sure how you expect players coming to the game to enjoy this. It isn't fun. It isn't even usable from a physical accessibility point of view.

You see, I happen to have multiple disabilities. I'm legally blind in my right eye (I see light, shadow, and a few colors, and can detect macro-size motion but not fine-grained motion). I'm deaf in my right ear thanks to Meniére's disease that finally took what little hearing I had in that ear when I was born. I have hearing loss in my left ear, am nearsighted in my good eye (monovision, 20/50 best corrected). And I have a lovely deformed right arm. The following quote is from a post I made on the World of Warcraft fora regarding my disabilities (their removal of exclusive fullscreen caused me to lose access to the game the software I used to create and maintain a proper mouse acceleration curve no longer worked due to windowed modes allowing focus to be stolen by literally anything outside of the game):

"

For reference, my right arm is as follows:

1) The Radius bone sticks out at elbow. It is also curved more than normal. I cannot change this.

2) The Ulna bone is rotated at a near 90 degree angle, necessitating my arm to be at an angle equivalant to 8 o'clock moving toward 12 o'clock from the elbow, while coming from the right side instead of straight up.

3) #1 and #2 force me to hold a controller at lap level to maintain playability without severe pain or risking RSI. Because both hands are taken, I can only use the keyboard superficially, occasionally hitting spacebar to jump, which requires me to move my hand from my leg to the keyboard (1.5-2 feet distance). This is while using my right hand to maneuver the mouse for clicking abilities and the occasional hard (fast) turns.

4) For general movement I'm typically combining the left analog stick with the mouse for fine grained turning. I can't click abilities when utilizing both for this purpose. It's a necessary tradeoff for my physical condition.

5) I'm blind in my right eye and nearsighted in my left. I'm also deaf in my right ear. The lack of right side sight means I cluster what I can outside of the base UI into as compact a space for each set of items as possible.

The above quote was in reference to another player saying this to me:

"

You use a Playstation controller instead of a keyboard? There's your problem. Those things are meant for two hands. If you learn how to use a keyboard, all of your problems are solved. I never even look at my keyboard because I know where the keys are.

I do what I can to work around disabilities. I could probably fairly easily set up PoE on my hackintosh's Windows 10 partition (once I reinstall the SSD I removed to put in my PS4 before I got a Samsung 2 TB 860 EVO SSD to put into the PS4), but I wanted to try PoE on the console first. At first it went well. It felt like the game Diablo 3 should have been and even had quests that felt more integrated and less tacked on like D3's did. I liked the loot system and I really liked the possibilities of the extended crafting system. Sure there is more micromanagement, but that I could eventually become accustomed to.

I liked it all. And then I ran into this bloody loot filter situation and the enjoyment came to a grinding halt

Not only do I have to go through excessive tedium to view and then pick up loot items now, but if I try using the filters provided, I still have the tedium, only now I can't even read the damned item text. Instant fun killer right there. BOOM. Headshot.

People keep telling me I don't want a "no filters" option. Yes, I do. I'm smart enough to have been doing tech support for thirty years spanning OSes from as far back as Mac OS System 6 (4, technically if you count my junior high days and my summer internship at the San Diego Consortium and Private Industry Coucil), Windows 1.0 (eewwwwww) on an IBM Model 60 tower PC in the school lab, and Yellow Dog Linux for 68k/PPC Macs. I've built my own PCs for years, and currently run a hackintosh I built so I could maintain using my favorite OS (OS X). I like details. I love details. Details are great. Loss of control is not.

I'm sure Neversink is akin to a god to many players and even the devs there at GGG. But his implementations are ruining the game for quite a few players like myself, and the implementation period on the consoles (PS4 Pro in my case) are extremely anti-disability to boot.

So here I sit being depressed that I'm essentially going to have to shelve a game that was looking to be my answer to the Diablo 2 itch. I was ready to go grab some stash spaces to help support the game. Hell, I'd even have shelled out $20-$30 just for an offline mode that still had access to the MTX store because loot filters aside, I think you have a pretty badass game here. I even liked that the base UI's positioning is primarily left-side oriented, which aligns nicely with having sight only in my left eye. Saves me a ton of head turning. But those loot filters...I can't get past them. I can't disable them. I'm stuck in a position where they actually introduce unwanted tedium into a game I was really starting to warm up to.

You're losing customers because you aren't giving us the control we need to adapt the game to our needs. Your design decision not to give us the options we need (desparately so in some cases like mine) is alienating a lot of us.

Look, I understand you can't please everyone, but this is a pretty core aspect to a loot hunt game. I've never had problems in games that didn't filter loot, but I'm sure as hell having problems in your game because it's filtering things I don't want it to filter and attempting to use any of the preset filters to overcome that are both unsuccessful and destructive to being able to even read the item text.

I shouldn't have to be writing something like this to you, but apparently I need to, because it isn't sinking in that this aspect of the game is destroying it for many of us. You don't need to remove the filters - they help a great many players. You just need to give us the option of not having them active at all. Is that really so much to ask?

P.S. - Do something about the obnoxiously short "security token" duration. It expires before I can even get through typing three or four paragraphs, if that.

You appear to be out-leveled for the zones you are getting loot in. Your videos are a level 33 zone while you are level 40. More items will be hidden because they are not good for you and not part of a vendor recipe. There should be 0 reason you want to grab a blue or white item past level 20 if it is not a good crafting base, hence why it is also hidden.

Not sure about PS4, but on Xbox you can suspend a game if your console is in stand-by mode. After resuming you may get odd issues like loot filters not using the one you have chosen correctly. You can switch to a different one and back or you may have to force close and re-launch the game to fix.

You should honestly be using NS 2 until you get to yellow (T6-T10) maps. It will hide most useless items (which there are a ton of).

A side note on your build, not to say anything is wrong just an opinion that may help. You appear to be using the agony crawler but are not stacking poison very fast and losing DPS, have you considered using a different skill to do so? There are a few bow skills that should work better for this like: rain of arrows, barrage, toxic rain, etc.

Edit - Some more info about custom filters that was posted in the Q&A.

"

Will we ever get custom item filters on console platforms?

Now that we have added support for console players to be able to log into the website, this is something we can work on.

Source - https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2498351/page/1

Regarding the build advice: I appreciate it. It's a matter of finding the right items and gems. If I could link more than two support gems to a skill gem I'd just plop it onto the main ice skill setup I have going (I like the theme). I'll eventually get it sorted out for better DPS. I'm sure I'll be far from optimal even into my high 90s as this is my first character. But that's the fun of the game - learning as you go. :)

As for the filters, I cannot use them. Because they are non-customizeable/defeatable, the way they change opacity and text size alone makes them unusable to people like myself with visual impairments. And while I know it isn't "efficient" to be showered in trash, did not one person ever consider I might also be thinking ahead about twinking another character? The choice should be mine, not someone else's.

And Neversink's filters, while obviously very good for a majority of the multiplayer playerbase/league players, are worthless to me as a solo player. I mean no offense to him or anyone else that benefits from his work. But my needs are not necessarily the same as his needs or anyone else's needs. As such, I need choices to adapt the game to what I need, not what someone else dictates I should "like" or "want".

For the short term, a simple "no filters" options would get me back into the game and enjoying myself. I'd actually love a "simple filters" configuration system that's an alternative to the default Neversink filters. Things like simple "hide normal items" with a sub-option to "show items with tri-colored sockets". That kind of stuff. I'm pretty good at figuring out what I need at certain points in games.

But right now, I have no choices, and as a result, the gameplay is miserable, and when attempting to use the "advised" filters, becomes unplayable entirely because of how those filters alter text background and size.

Now, as I've said, the simplest option, and one fairly often requested, would be to add a "no filters" option. I'm not an idiot. I don't need idiot proofing. But I especially don't need idiot proofing when it also causes issues with disabilities. I understand the developers at GGG to be fairly good with their players, at least on the PC side. I can't say they're bad with the console players because there just isn't enough info to read over so far as console PoE is relatively new, especially the PS4 version. And I'm well aware console players in general can tend to be total asshats to each other and to newer players, so I take negativity on the console side with a grain or two of salt (I really should own stock in Morton's at this point...).

I want the devs here to understand without any doubts that the current setup that's forced upon us is detrimental to us in more than a few ways. In my case, it essentially makes the game unplayable when using filters, and tedius as hell when using "Default", whatever that actually means since there is no useful human readable description for any of those options whatsoever.

Since I just made this thread and there almost certainly hasn't been time for a dev to review it, let alone do anything about it, I'm in "wait and see" mode. Unfortunately, that means I have to stop playing because, well, there's no other option for me currently. The forced settings with no customization at all has seen to that. It's also resulted in me holding off on any MTX purchases for PoE on either paltform (PC or PS4). Why should I buy into a game that scoffs at disabled players like the current iteration does? Doesn't make much sense, does it?

So I get to wait. But I won't wait forever. I'll allow for a reasonable amount of time, and at that point if there is no progress so players like myself can play and enjoy the game as everyone else gets to, I'll file a CVAA complaint with the FCC. With any luck, it won't get to that stage. It shouldn't even have gotten to this stage to be honest though, with a game as mature as this one. But you're going to find more and more players like myself asserting our right to have accessibility as time goes on.

I used to play World of Warcraft, but can't anymore. It was my favorite game for fifteen years (I started in the early friends and family alpha in late 2003). Removal of key features required to work around my disabilities and Blizzard's refusal to even open up a dialogue killed that for me. I mention that because I really don't want to see players like myself have to fight with the devs to have a game we can play and enjoy. But I'm to the point I won't take lack of accessibility lying down anymore either. Not after having put up with over four decades of such already.

I really want to get back into this game ASAP. Games are one of the only means I have of combating depression (from a lifetime of being disfigured and having one eye shut out in public, thus relegating me to a relatively solitary lifestyle). And PoE offers challenges and great endgame options for me. But such a simple roadblock keeps me from doing so, and it shouldn't be like this for anyone.

I think you have a fundamental mis-understanding of the loot of PoE and the filters. Stuff that is hidden by the most basic filter is total junk and if your pressing l3 to view loot skipped by the lowest filter your wasting your time.

Looking at your video, your struggling to kill stuff in a lv33 zone at lv40, which tells me your using l3 to get loot off the ground and maybe even equiping it.

Item base (its name) determines that requirements to equip, item level (based on mob level that drops item; need to turn on advanced options and press l3 to view) determines the prefixes/suffixes that can be on the item. Both are important, and as you increase the NS filter more low tier bases will be hidden (good for actual loot pickup, but hiding low-tier base rares that can be vendored for chaos later can be bad too).

if this is happening to you when in a level-appropriate zone, then its an issue in your game as none of the issues you talk about have ever happened to anyone I know playing on ps4, but we also dont even look at loot if running low tier zones because it will not be useful.

NS1 for leveling, NS2 for early endgame (and doing chaos recipe to get currency to get endgame gear off market), NS3+ when at end game and just want high end items that may have value on market. Customization of filters would be better (like PC) but without a full understanding of loot that wont help anyone who struggles with the default ones.

OK, let me get this through peoples' heads, since they've obviously not getting it through their thick skulls:

For my purposes, which is playing almost entirely solo, the loot filters don't suit me. I don't care what you say I should want or like. You don't have any freaking clue how I desire to play the game. If you like the filters, great. Neversink put a lot of work into them from what I understand and many players benefit from his/their work. He/they get two thumbs and toes up for helping the community.

But for my needs, the filters are a nuiscance and make the gameplay feel crappy. But more than that, they aren't configurable, and because they change the background of the text and the size of the text (even for items that do appear), I can't read them. Visual impairments are a real thing among gamers. NS' filters don't take anything like that into account. Nor does PoE in general. So even if the filters worked for me, I can't use them from a physical accessibility standpoint.

PoE would be my loot hunt holy grail if it:

1) Allowed me to determine what I want to see, not someone else. It should be my choice, not someone else's, and certainly not a non-dev's.

2) Through customiization made the item drops not become unreadable with the filters that are in place.

3) Offered me an alternative of simple filters that I could activate on my own. The algorithms for Neversink's filters are based on the economy of the multiplayer aspect of the game. They are not necessarily well suited for solo play, and I wouldn't be saying anything if I found them to my liking. Personal choice does matter and we're not in the 90s anymore and this isn't Diablo 2 with static everything.

The physical accessibility point is non-negotiable. That's kind of required to be able to play the game properly (or in some cases, at all). But I should be the one determining when something feels right to me, not you, not someone else in the community, and not even necessarily a developer.

It isn't like what players such as myself are asking for is out of line. It's a pretty basic set of options, and it doesn't remove the game's built in filters from use for any of the rest of you. I'm not you. I have different wants and more importantly, different needs. I'm no less entitled to have a functional game than you are.

You ever consider, oh I don't know.. Turning the loot filter off?

As others have said. The items that the loot filter hides are JUNK. They are literally no good for ANYBODY, including yourself. Why would you want to pick up a level 5 mace with no properties on it? Or a level 24 chest with 2 extra life?

You're causing yourself problems.

"

Cidna wrote:

You ever consider, oh I don't know.. Turning the loot filter off?

As others have said. The items that the loot filter hides are JUNK. They are literally no good for ANYBODY, including yourself. Why would you want to pick up a level 5 mace with no properties on it? Or a level 24 chest with 2 extra life?

You're causing yourself problems.

Um, you can't turn the loot filter off. That's why we're asking for a no filters option. It's always on.

"

SquishyTia wrote:

"

Cidna wrote:

You ever consider, oh I don't know.. Turning the loot filter off?

As others have said. The items that the loot filter hides are JUNK. They are literally no good for ANYBODY, including yourself. Why would you want to pick up a level 5 mace with no properties on it? Or a level 24 chest with 2 extra life?

You're causing yourself problems.

Um, you can't turn the loot filter off. That's why we're asking for a no filters option. It's always on.

The point nobody ever answers is *why* do you need/want to see the auto-hidden stuff? The only things the game auto-hides are very low level obsolete bases which no build should have any use for. They're only hidden once you significantly out-level them. Why not use more level appropriate gear: it's the exact same but stronger.

If it were currency I could understand it, but we're talking driftwood clubs here.

"

UnclePobatti wrote:

The point nobody ever answers is *why* do you need/want to see the auto-hidden stuff? The only things the game auto-hides are very low level obsolete bases which no build should have any use for. They're only hidden once you significantly out-level them. Why not use more level appropriate gear: it's the exact same but stronger.

If it were currency I could understand it, but we're talking driftwood clubs here.

Part of it is the weapon slot, which in my case means bows. Getting bows with at least the correct/minimum number of sockets in the right colors doesn't happen that often, and as a solo player, blowing through the currency to change socket colors often ends up with no good result (trust me, I know well how fickle RNGesus can be coming from Diablo 3). The other part is that maybe we're also prepping for twinking other characters? I haven't done Hardcore on PoE (and I doubt I ever will with the current issues the PS4 version is seeing with regard to connections), but if it works like Diablo 3 and the stash is shared among all Hardcore characters outside of an SSF league, players may often prep all of starter, mid level, and endgame gear in case they die.

There are legitimate reasons for asking for no loot filters even if you can't think of them yourself and/or don't care to have them off. For me, in a loot hunt game, it's a combination of the above (depending on the mode I play) and having choice. Sometimes a slightly lower level base ends up being better than a current level base that has the wrong sockets/colors/links. I'm still learning my way through the whole gem and support system, and being on console for my first go-around that also means learning the limitations of aiming AoE effects, etc. But I like learning. I like details. And I don't mind seeing all of my loot.

But there's another problem, if you'd read up on all of my posts: Aside from lack of choice (seriously, I'd kill for a simple filters option where I can manually select which items I want filtered and which I want to see), the NS filters also reduce item text size and item background opacity to the point I can't read them. The "Default" setting does not, but presumably I'd get most of what I want in the short term with a no filters option because I'd see the loot I want to see (whether you say I should or not, which isn't a decision anyone but myself should be making) and I'd see the loot at normal text size and completely solid backgrounds for the item text.

Either way, I deserve the ability to play the game how I want to play, not how any of you tell me to play. By now it should be trivial to implement both a no filters option and a simplistic filters option where players can choose which items they want to be shown. Obviously it wouldn't be complex like Neversink's algorithm based filters, but that's the point. Nobody's filter choices/options are a one-size-fits-all solution. Obviously they don't work for me or I wouldn't be saying anything about them. I may graduate to using them (if and when they stop making item text unreadable for me), but for now, I want to explore the game my way. Not your way. Not Billy Joe Bob's way. MY way.

Is that on point enough for you? ^_^

"

SquishyTia wrote:

Is that on point enough for you? ^_^

Yes, you have a point.

But we do need to ask and answer the question of why GGG incorporated that hiding feature in the first place. The reason is pretty simple: having too many small things visible in the game creates problems with performance; the game hides enough that item-overload isn't a problem.

GGG don't stop you from being able to see the hidden items. You're always able to push a button which reveals all drops on the floor. On the PS4, clicking the left-stick does this: it's a smart binding because it makes it hard to you move around much while displaying all the items on the ground which masks the performance problems somewhat.

Unfortunately the reality is that the game really does drop far too much loot. Not every instance of hidden loot would have pulled framerates all the way down if not hidden, but as a catchment system it works pretty well despite being maybe a little overtuned.

Some things just have to be hidden to keep performance fluid. That's unfortunate but true. 99% of the time players don't need those especially low-level niche items so by default they're the ones which get the chop.

The purpose of loot-filters is to alter that behavior.

Anything which a loot filter is told to display is *always* displayed and never hidden automatically by the game. With a fully customizable filter you could in theory set-up a filter where nothing is ever hidden and everything is always shown. But then you'd run into performance problems in situations where an absolute ton of loot drops at once (like Delve).

GGG will be looking into website-based filter customization eventually, so you'll be able to make a filter that shows low-level items when that arrives. To alleviate the inevitable performance problems you would have to specify other types of commonly dropped items to hide in exchange. There must be some type of items you literally never need according to your builds, so you'd hide those, be able to see the things you want to see and performance should be OK.

We know GGG plan to do that, but we don't know when. Until then, all we have are the generic every-build filters provided by Neversink. Since showing low-levelled gear that is normally hidden would need a trade-off of hiding other categories of gear, and what gear you don't mind being hidden is very build-dependant, Neversink would need to make hundreds of different filters to make something which would satisfy everyone, and GGG consider the performance risk to be too high to allow us to just show everything unfiltered so they won't specifically add-in the feature themselves.