[3.5-3.8 HC] Pure Herald of Agony Jugg. All content. Videos. Dual wielding Cold Iron Variant added.

I have been asked by a few people now to do a proper write up of this one.

First, a disclaimer--this is not an sc build. While it will level, under good conditions, at 150-200m xp/hour there are much faster clearing builds out there. This one is by and for hardcore, and is designed to have the best sustain I could figure out while still having the damage to be able to take down T16 maps and endgame bosses. [I used a similar, but not identical, build to take down Uber Elder almost deathless in standard, video of that is also linked below] It was designed out of my frustration with a rough league start in betrayal and desire to take revenge on Catarina. So far it has been living up to my hopes for it.

[edit] Several folks from sc have now provided feedback that they have, in fact, tried and enjoyed this build for taking on the content in Betrayal. Just proves how little I understand sc after all :>

[3.7 edit] Did some post-nerf testing of the build at the end of Legion. Build not nerfed nearly as badly as I had feared. Still runs over T16s with any mods. Shaper and Guardians themselves a touch slower, but still perfectly solid. Succeeded with my first deathless Uber-Elder run with this build post-nerf (video 12 below). Planning to use as my starter for HC Blight. If any of the new gems or gear appear to provide upgrades, I plan to post as they are discovered.

[3.8 edit: throughout the guide I will now also present sections on the dual wield cold iron point cyclone variation using fortify and self-cast vaal molten shell instead of dodge. Because of the way IC was nerfed when the guard skills were changed, molten shell now provides stronger defense. Dual wielding cold iron point takes the crawler back to stronger than it was before the last nerf. It's the most fun I've had in quite a while]

Basic Overview:
Spoiler

Juggernaut using Quillrain-barrage to maintain Herald of Agony. At full build, most of the game is face-tankable, and all of the content can be completed with good play. [3.8 update: Dual wields cold iron point with cyclone and golden rule to maintain HOA, uses molten shell/vaal molten shell for excellent survivability]

Offense: Tops out at a bit over 600k dps with lvl 21 gem and lvl 4 empower. Not as sexy as blade flurry, but enough to get the job done all the way up through Shaper and Uber Elder.

Defenses:

Life pool: 9k+ late endgame

Evasion: minimal from gear, but enough on the tree to give around 40-50% chance to evade with jade and stibnite flasks up. The remaining chance to hit is cut in half again for blinded enemies, either by the stibnite cloud or the on hit chance to blind, once we have it via jewel or quiver.

Dodge:
40% base dodge
30% base spell dodge
vaal grace

Physical:
7 End charges alternating w 3 second CWDT-IC renders us virtually immune to any physical damage that doesn't one shot.

LGOH: Life gain at full build is approximately 8k/second against bosses. Significantly more against groups.

Travels via Blink Arrow & Phase run>Inc Duration [3.8 edit: Now prefer Flame dash post the 3.7 flame dash upgrade]


Videos
Spoiler


Cold Iron Variant
Spoiler

1.Deathless lvl 83 Catarina https://youtu.be/QoVvX8Rccpk
2.Shaper walkover https://youtu.be/SSwV4AjIgSI


Bow variant
Spoiler

Videos 1-6 were made with the current version of the character. 7-11 are from a -less tanky- version with similar damage output from last league, post death. 12 is post nerf.

1. Facetanking lvl 68 Catarina:https://youtu.be/F4EsTtr5Ubo
2. Defeating lvl 83 Catarina: https://youtu.be/rzuZs-IzgMc
3. Delve Abyss & Kurgal Facetank:https://youtu.be/215ec4Vl06M
4. Deathless Shaper: https://youtu.be/LdLJQDSZRzQ
5. Deathless Hall of GMs https://youtu.be/GTSOAJjXdtI
6. Lvl 76 version vs. Corr. T13 Colosseum https://youtu.be/o-auWc5qf3c
7. Uber Elder (Almost deathless):https://youtu.be/p5WCf1Y8Pfw
8. Uber Purifier:https://youtu.be/OxyEFqXDyXA
9. Uber Eradicator:https://youtu.be/TAvTdotz4go
10. Uber Constrictor:https://youtu.be/uOKZy1xeIf0
11. Uber Enslaver:https://youtu.be/6JXNb0yHBI0
12. Deathless Uber Elder run post-nerf https://youtu.be/AvvgogLdpdI



Explanation of links:
Spoiler

A. Your sole real damage source will be herald of agony with the following links, as you level:

1. Up to level 34: HOA>Minion Damage>Damage on full Life>Pierce

2. Level 34-53: same set up, but use Wraithlord helm for a free lvl 3 empower

3. Level 54-mid-endgame: Shift to any Helm with +2 level of minion gems and useful stats

4. Mid-endgame-late endgame (T12+): Elder helm with +2 to minion levels and supported by minion damage. Links are HOA>DOFL>Pierce>Vicious Proj or lvl 3 empower.

5. Late Endgame: Same helm or +3 helm, lvl 4 empower and lvl 21 HOA

Notes: Getting the equivalent of a 6L in the helm is important, because it allows the build to use Kaom's for the late endgame, which boosts survivability. Vicious proj and lvl 3 empower are roughly equivalent damage output. Level 4 empower is significantly superior, but very expensive.

B. Your Herald of Agony will be powered by Barrage (lvl 1-3, no higher) used with Quill Rain, linked as follows:
1. Level 16-30 Barrage>LMP>Lesser poison>Life Gain on hit
2. Level 31-37 Barrage>LMP>Poison>Life Gain on hit
3. Level 38-53 Barrage>GMP>Poison>Life Gain on hit

4. Level 54-Late Endgame: Elder Gloves Supported by either Poison or faster attacks. Options for links are:
Better Defense Barrage>GMP>LGOH>whichever the gloves don't have.
Better Offense (supported by poison only) Barrage>GMP>LGOH>withering touch

5. Late Endgame: Elder Gloves supported by both Poison AND faster attacks. Link Barrage>GMP>LGOH>Withering Touch

[3.8 Edit] I recommend leveling to 62 using the above set ups. After 62, your HOA will be powered by cyclone dual wielding cold iron points. Links are Cyclone>LGOH>Poison>Faster attacks>Fortify>Withering touch, with faster attacks and poison ideally to come from gloves.




Notes: The set ups above are magnified defensively with a thief's torment ring and gluttony belt (More on these later). In the late endgame, you will have an attack rate of around 6/second firing 9 arrows per attack and gaining around 148 life per hit. As the build uses RT, every properly aimed arrow will hit. The result is life gain of around 8k/second, so long as you are hitting a valid target. Significantly more against groups once you have piercing on your quiver. As long as your life pool is adequate, this is sufficient to facetank 99% of the game. Specific exceptions are noted below. (Original variation had LMP in place of withering touch for over 10k/sec life gain. However it is not hard to maintain 15 stacks of withering touch via barrage, and this will boost damage against bosses by nearly 50% more--no brainer)

[3.8 edit: We drop gluttony in favor of maximizing armour for powering up molten shell/vaal molten shell] this no longer allows a completely facetank style (though this is still possible for most of the game) but requires some judgment re: where to step out of a fight until molten shell refreshes.

C. You will also have the following auxiliary gem setups in boots, armour and weapon:

Pre-Kaom's heart/6L helm/6soc Quill rain
1. Phase run>Vaal grace>Frost Wall>Increased duration
2. (Unlinked) War Banner, Arctic Armour, Convocation, Blink Arrow/Flame Dash
3. CWDT (lvl 1)>IC (lvl 3)>Desecrate (lvl 7)>Spirit Offering (lvl 8)


Post-Kaom's heart/6L helm/6 soc Quill rain (with kaoms heart we lose the space for the banner and with the top end helm we don't have enough mana to reserve for the banner and still have smooth play):
1. Now is the time to take the minion nodes to replace the accuracy from war banner with the minion accuracy on the tree. If you upgrade your gear and drop war banner without taking the minion accuracy nodes, you will see a significant drop in performance, even though your technical dps goes up.
2. 6 socket Quill rain, 5 linked: Phase Run>Vaal Grace>Blink Arrow>Increased duration>Convocation, Arctic Armour
3. 4L boots:CWDT>IC>Desecrate>Spirit offering

Notes:
a. CWDT/IC: With the jugg ascendancies and gluttony belt, you will maintain 7 endurance charges effortlessly. When IC procs, it will last slightly over 3 seconds, which is almost always enough time to be back up to 7 endurance charges by the time it is complete. [3.8 edit IC has been nerfed to no longer provide perfect uptime. Still playable, but there will be brief defensive gaps. For this reason, now prefer molten shell]

b. Desecrate/Spirit Offering: 23% more damage with good uptime, given our largely face tank playstyle.

c. Frost Wall: Required for fighting Shaper (protect Zana phase) and Elder (Protect Shaper phase) otherwise left unused. After you equip Kaom's Heart, save your leveled frost wall and sub it in for convocation during the necessary fights. This is the only reason for a 5L quill rain-so frost wall will link to increased duration when you sub it in for convocation.

d. War Banner: Accuracy is a big deal for HOA. War Banner allows us to leave the minion wheel accuracy nodes until late endgame, after we have a 6L helmet. Just leave it turned on and never plant it.

e. Convocation: important QOL for placing the crawler where you need it.

f. Blink Arrow, Arctic Armour, Vaal Grace: should be self explanatory. [Post 3.7 edit--since the upgrade to the cast time on flame dash, I have a definite personal preference for flame dash over blink arrow. This is a matter of taste and ymmv, since flame dash provides no decoy]



Explanation of Gear
Spoiler

Gear List:



1. Quill Rain: BIS for keeping Virulence at 40 and defensively for life gain. Nothing else comes close

2. Thief's torment: BIS for Life gain while also solving mana problems, solid for rezzes and useful in cutting harm done by curses. Item quant is icing.

3. Gluttony: lvl 30 poachers mark provides a non trivial 34 life gain and 15 mana gain per hit, and applies to hexproof enemies. Belt also adds to effective accuracy of the crawler and provides cull. Downside of the belt is well mitigated by Jugg ascendancies/CWDT>IC setup. Damage from belt allows us to self proc jugg endurance charge gain by using blink arrow or phase run so that all boss fights begin with 7 charges. This also makes it trivial to maintain 7 charges at almost all times.

4. Gloves: Level with Ondar's until your first pair of elder gloves

5. Helm: Level from 34 with wraithlord (Earliest available +2 minion gems helm by 20 levels) for easy clear

6. Quiver: Level from 10 with Hyrri's bite until you don't need it for stats. A piercing quiver is a buff offensively since poacher's mark will apply one extra row deep, and defensively as it allows LGOH to hit one extra row deep. Bonus points if it has a chance to blind on hit mod, but you can get this on an abyss jewel.

7. Armour: Ambu's charge is a good budget option until you can afford something with a solid life roll. Late endgame goal is a Kaom's.

8. Ammy, boots: Life & Res.

9. Flasks:
a. 1 Hybrid flask is good QOL for those moments where you missed with barrage and are OOM without readily available enemies. I keep staunching here.

b. Forbidden Taste is important, and provides back up for those moments when you are out of enemies or fighting a boss that has become untargetable and suffer a severe hit or DOT.

c. Stibnite and Jade together with a fair bit of evasion on the tree provide a solid base defense against attacks. I prefer warding on the stib because it almost never runs out. Grounding or dousing on the Jade.

d. Quicksilver for QOL Dousing or Grounding kept here, whichever isn't on Jade.

10. Jewels (not pictured) Prioritize Life and filling out resists. I use 8% anatomical knowledge in the upper left slot. Also recommend one abyss jewel with flat life and any chance to blind. Secondarily Bow attack speed is useful.


[3.8 Edit] New Gear List:


Not pictured is Golden Rule unique jewel


Additional notes
1. Cold Iron Points: The extreme power up from the Cold Iron Points makes them BIS now.

2. Golden Rule: Makes it possible to maintain 40 stacks of virulence easily when using melee weapons, since the reflected poisons also count toward those stacks. Make sure you have enough chaos res/regen to mitigate the effects. Use great caution is you are going to use this while leveling, before taking regen nodes and ascendancy. Recommend for this purpose a pair of fidelitas's spikes (no physical damage) and a jewel with a little added phys or chaos.

3. Use vicious proj until you can afford an empower.




Skill Tree:
Spoiler

POB Pastebin to lvl 89 version: https://pastebin.com/AbYwPifA
POB Pastebin to lvl 95 version: https://pastebin.com/1V1runuy

Notes: Between lvl 89 and 95, I was pushing delve hard. Around level 350-375, things began to become a bit more dangerous. I tried a respec in which I gave up around 500 max life (from ~9600 to ~9100) for more attack speed and a little more minion accuracy and I was pleased with the resulting feel and continued on down. As of this writing, I am at depth 401 and in second place on the solo delve ladder for HC betrayal. My sense is that beyond a certain point, attack speed is more important for survivability than raw life, at least in certain types of encounters. My guess/feeling is that the breakpoint is in the neighborhood of 9k life, but that is far from scientific.

[3.8 edit] New POB at lvl 92: https://pastebin.com/50tef2sz
Notes: Prioritize Dex/int, rezzes, life, charges (after cruel ascendancy), armour. Exception is Adamant, which I would take as soon as you feel comfortable with enough life, as the QOL from the cooldown in front of it is excellent.


Bandits: Kill all

Ascendancies in order:
Unstoppable (stun avoidance key to maximizing value of LGOH)
Unflinching
Unrelenting
Unbreakable

[3.8 edit]: Since we now stack armour, swap the last two

Pantheon: Solaris, Tukohama
[3.8 edit]: Solaris, Ralakesh

Leveling Advice:
Spoiler

1. Early Leveling:
Use whatever you find easy. At league start I use smite>Ancestral call. Once I have gear, I like Ice shot>Pierce>Volley>Mirage archer. On tree, your first stop is the dodge cluster. It is a ways off, but provides a massive survivability boost.

2. Next Steps:
Don't be tempted by the minion nodes. You don't need them as long as you are running war banner. Grab life and then grab Endurance charges when you do your cruel ascendancy. You will also grab Resolute technique around this time. Then more life until you are ready to take your final helm/kaom's upgrades.

3. Late Game: When you upgrade to a 6L helm, grab the minion accuracy nodes and drop war banner (since you wont be able to afford the mana anymore). Then keep improving your life pool


Notable Non-Facetankables:
Spoiler


1. Atziri / Uber Atziri trio/Vaal Temple: Do -not- leave the dual striker for last. With this build, actually, a'alai is safest left for last. When the dual striker is last and enrages he has a virtually unique effect that does flat damage to anyone who attacks him, even at range, on a per hit basis. This may still be ok for regular trio, but against the Uber trio or Vaal Temple trio, you will kill yourself, as the damage, after mitigation, per a GGG representative (because i thought it might have been a bug) is around 900 per hit. At 54 hits a second . . . . As a sidenote, don't stand in the empowered flame blasts or empowered lightning circles, as these can do sufficient overlapping damage to one-shot.

2. Hall of GMs: There are GMs with enough dodge/block to reduce your number of hits per second, and hence life gain, sufficiently for them to kill you. Particularly some that use scorching ray can be extremely dangerous. There are GMs with tempest shield that will damage you with every hit from barrage. There are also GMs with sufficient regen that you won't be able to kill them with your normal set up. To get past these last two, kill all the other gms around, and then have a weapon swap ready to balefire and and a shield that replaces the resists on your quiver. For my run I used Prism Guardian, but any shield with enough res will do.
You will be able to burn the GM down with balefire, then swap back to the normal set up. Hall of GMs is completable, but it is definitely not trivial content, even for this build.

3. Shaper:
a. Shaper critting on a slam can still one shot us, though a 9k life pool with 7 end charges up will tank an ordinary slam.
b. Facetanking the slow orbs is dubious as they come quickly with significant cold pen. It is also unnecessary.
c. During his teleporting orb phase, there is nothing to attack, so we can die.
d. With practice, you can use strategically placed frost walls to protect Zana long enough for the crawler to kill all the adds. I did not find this to be trivially easy, but I have managed it successfully. Without frost wall, the crawler is too slow. If Zana dies, abort the run or you will too.

4. Uber-Elder (Elder):
a. Either Elder or Shaper Slam can one-shot on a crit. Likewise Elder's slow expanding circle. Also, there is enough chaotic damage coming from various sources that you may not be at full health when the slam comes in. (this is how I died during the uber-elder video posted above)
b. Shaper's balls as above.
c. Honorable mention to the Enslaver. He can inflict a sufficiently powerful ignite that if he happens to crit with it just as you kill him, you will see your health plummet. If you are out of dousing flask charges/forbidden taste charges at such a moment, it is possible to die.

5. Any Red Map/deep delve/syndicate mob that crits hard enough with a sufficient number of added damage mods. This one is an assumption.

6. Anything that gets you with a rapid succession of hits when you are repositioning and not attacking, though dodge will help mitigate this.



FAQ
Spoiler


1. Wouldn't rain of Arrows be Better?
Spoiler

No. ROA is great when you have packs and on bosses with adds. It is not so great when there is a single high end boss to fight. Barrage is your friend.


2. Um . . . there isn't enough mana to run grace and Herald of Agony . . .?
Spoiler
You are correct. You are not meant to actually run grace. The gem is only slotted for the use of vaal grace, which when linked with inc duration gives you nearly ten seconds of being extremely tanky to help with sticky situations.

3. My spirit offering isn't proccing all the time, wtf?
Spoiler

CWDT linked skills proc in clockwise order from the CWDT. Make sure your desecrate is before your spirit offering in the order and this should fix the problem.

4. I met something that I can't seem to poison, is this a bug?
Spoiler
There are rare enemies that have enough physical/chaos damage reduction that you may not be able to poison them with your normal setup. This can usually be fixed by simply removing your GMP gem and finishing the fight. For those very few enemies for which this does not work, replace Poison with Lesser Poison and then finish the fight. A leveled Lesser Poison gem has enough flat chaos damage to fix this problem in every case I have encountered.

Notable places this situation may occur are the empowered version of Shavronne/Brutus in Act VI and the fully enraged Rhoa/Skeletal Rhoa in maps. Also, when partying with someone of lower level with level downscaling enabled, just switch to lesser poison. The downscaling can nerf your damage to the point where the ordinary set up will be unable to poison anything.

5. Could I use a wand and shield instead? I like block.
Spoiler

You can, but you sacrifice a dramatic amount of the LGOH that makes the build feel so tanky. Dodge is better than block in this build anyway. Quill Rain FTW.


6. Can I ssf with this build?
Spoiler

Challenging, but yes. Quill rain is really non-negotiable for late game, but you can do the rest of the build via crafting/fossil crafting and quill rain is not hard to chance. Someone did an experiment and estimated it's about 1 in 175. You can do this on every short bow you can find or buy from vendors--save your chance orbs. Since you don't need a 6L, just a 6soc, you can add the extra sockets via jews later. Early leveling will be fine even without QR--just look for the best attack speed bow you have access to without worrying too much about other stats.

Thief's torment and gluttony are significant upgrades, but the build can function without them. Farm for elder rings when you get to maps and craft with Pristine fossils to get life gain on hit. Spend your first 20 GCPs to quality your LGOH gem. For the mana, you will need to take revelry early, and then craft jewels using alts to get the +mana on hit affix. You will know when you have slotted enough of those by feel. Until then, you will need a mana flask.

For the helm and glove fossil crafting, you won't have the leveling uniques, but I can confirm that the build will work fine without them up through low-mid maps, since i have done something similar as a league start. Once you get to maps, you will farm for elder helms and gloves and you will farm for sulphite to delve for the fossils you need. The craft for the gloves is a corroded/aberrant & or shuddering fossil. The craft for the helm is a bound fossil. Last league I was able to self craft both the 6 link gloves and helm using this method.


7. What changes do I make for SC with infinite currency?
Spoiler

a. Drop Kaoms in favor of a 6L Coming Calamity. Slot HOA there with these links: HOA>Minion Damage>DOFL>Pierce>Vicious Proj>Empower.
b.. Drop Arctic Armour in favor of hatred+Generosity. This will require all of the aura reservation reduction nodes we are already next to (4 nodes) or a lvl 3-4 enlighten (expensive).

Per POB, the overall result will boost your damage by approximately 60%--you will hit close to 1M dps, 750k Shaper dps. It will drop your maximum life pool from +/-9500 at lvl 95 to +/- 7500 at lvl 95. This version is more likely to find places it can be one shot, but you might enjoy it more in SC.



8. Is Dodge really that important? It seems like a lot of travel nodes.
Spoiler
(3.8 edit: Dodge version is still possible, but molten shell version is preferred post 3.7 nerfs to IC) Here is the math on why we take dodge: Let's say you have 9k life and lets leave aside the possibility of one shots which, though they can happen, are actually very rare. Let's also leave aside your life gain for the moment and just assume that you die when you suffer that total damage Without dodge, you die when the mobs hit you for 9k.

Attack dodge Math: If you have 40% dodge, then when the mobs have normally done 9k damage, you have on average sustained only 60% of that, or 5.4k. in order to kill you, on average they now must do 15k damage (15k, reduced by 40%=9k). It gets more ridiculous when you add in vaal grace. While that is up and running, you have 74% dodge. For the mobs to do 9k damage while vaal grace is up, they now have to do on average a little over 34.5k. This is true whether they are doing physical, elemental, or chaos damage as long as it is attack based.

Spell dodge math: If they are using spells, they have it a little easier, since you start with only 30% spell dodge. Still, they have to do, on average. 12.8k damage without vaal grace and 25k with vaal grace.

There are no other nodes on the tree that provide this kind of extra magical survivability (unless you are playing a block/spell block champion). And while they are trying to do that much damage, you get to heal at a rate of 8k/sec as long as you are attacking.


9. Why sacrfice all that armour to use gluttony? Are you an idiot?
Spoiler
(3.8 edit: Dodge/Gluttony version is still possible, but Molten shell defense is now preferred after 3.7 nerfs to IC.) Answering the second part first, I hope not. But if that was your reaction, go check out the POE wiki on how armour actually works. Here's the short recap on why we use gluttony in this build:

a. The phys damage reduction from armour is not absolute. Armour becomes less effective against bigger hits. Armour works best mitigating against many smaller hits. See the wiki for more details.

b. We could care less about many smaller hits, because we become immune to phys damage from hits for about 3 seconds after the first 500 or so damage when CWDT procs IC.

c. The phys damage mitigation from endurance charges _is_ absolute. It is much more effective against the large hits we are concerned about than armour.

d. For phys, we are only concerned about enough damage to one-shot us. With a 9k life pool, full ascendancies, and 7 endurance charges up (leaving aside arctic armour and the tukohama ascendancy, since they are both conditional) this would require a single physical hit of 15k damage. Outside of avoidable wind up boss mechanics with crit, nothing hits that hard. (edit-I finally found a mob that could one shot through this down on lvl 537 of delve. It had 100%+added fire, 100%+added lightning, several other mods and the mob itself had powerful crits)

e. Gluttony is not just another 34 life/15 mana per hit, it is also:
i. a roughly 10% more damage multiplier via cull which eliminates the most difficult moments of many boss fights.
ii. a guarantee of being able to get back to full endurance charges without requiring an enemy to hit us (via the damage we take when using a move skill proccing the jugg ascendancy.
iii. a significant accuracy boost to the crawler (since Poacher's mark debuffs mob's evasion)



10. Are there any map mods we can't run?
Spoiler
No. If you start adding more than 2-damage mods to red maps you may need to be slightly more cautious, but this build can run every mod and combination of mods. Alc and go your T16s, ignore reflect, etc.


11. Post 3.8: Which version is stronger, Quill rain or Cold Iron Points?
Spoiler


"Stronger" is a tough adjective to decide, as each has pros and cons. But I would rate them this way on the things that are important to us:

Raw survivability goes to the QR version. The QR version is the one I have been able to to do uber-elder with deathless multiple times now. I could not manage it with the CIP version because (for me) the life gain just wasn't there. At peak, it's the difference between a bit over 8k life gain/sec with QR (without fortify) and around 1800 life gain/sec on the CIP version (with fortify). Fortify just doesnt make up the difference. That said, 1800/sec plus your regen of +/- 1k/sec at full build is plenty for most purposes in the game. As a side note, the QR version gets an extra 90+ flat life (which will translate into over 300 life at full build) and other stats from the quiver slot that the CIP version gives up.

Manuverability goes to the CIP version. The fact that you generate stacks while moving can make some fights feel easier, even though the raw survivability is less.

Clear Speed goes to the CIP version, for both general map clear and for every-boss-except-uber-elder, but not by as much as you might think. The difference between a lvl 22-24 HOA (QR) and a lvl 31-33 HOA (CIP) is significant, but not as much as is implied by the level numbers. This is because the CIP version both gives up vicious proj and also maintains only +/- 7.5 stacks of wither vs. the full 15 stacks maintained by the bow version. The CIP version also achieves 40 stacks slower and spends less time, overall at a full 40 stacks, usually hovering 30-35. According to my back-of-a-napkin rough calculations, I would expect the CIP version, at full build, to average roughly 60% more damage, depending on the circumstances.

Overall At the end, like so many things, it's really a matter of taste. Having played both multiple times through the game now I think for me it would really be a matter of what mood I was in. Though I will say that even if I were using the CIP version, I would probably switch over to a QR setup to do uber-elder.


12. Can I try to change it in some way?
Spoiler
YES. No matter what it is. These guides are only ever meant to be a jumping off point. Go and experiment and learn something new about the build and come back here and post it for the rest of us. If it sounds like fun try it.



Hope some of you who have found Betrayal frustrating in hc (like I did) have a chance to enjoy it more with this build.

[3.8 edit] The Cold iron points provide a new, fun alternative. The cyclone style does want more play skill to use and takes a bit of practice, but i have found it very enjoyable. Good Luck!


-Orion
Last edited by Orion72 on Oct 2, 2019, 10:45:58 AM
Last bumped on Oct 25, 2019, 5:02:16 AM
Wow I'm playing a nearly identical build.
I can fully vouch for this build works brilliantly.

Last edited by Kurzonate on Dec 19, 2018, 5:27:13 AM
Updated Gear at lvl 90:



Updated Tree in pastebin
https://pastebin.com/sFjLYTSb

Not pictured is one unique jewel, an 8% anatomical knowledge slotted in the upper left jewel slot.

-O
Last edited by Orion72 on Dec 19, 2018, 8:45:26 AM
In the barrage set up, I am currently experimenting with withering touch
instead of LMP as the 6th link. Improves dps significantly at the expense of some life gain.

-O

Edit: Can confirm from lvl 93 that 8k/sec life gain appears to still be more than enough. Withering touch for the 6th link is a definite. Guide has been updated.

-O
Last edited by Orion72 on Dec 21, 2018, 6:35:21 PM
THERE IS ONLY ONE WORD FOR THİS BUİLD

AAWWWSOOOMMEEEEEE

ım curently leveling event after 20 level its starting to show :)
easy for leveling ..
crawler is beatifull with herald effect :P


And @Orion72 .. this guy just perfect.. always answering to me and helping for understand the build ..

p.s:( sorry for my english not main leanguage.. )
Extra Tech: An Abyss jewel with even 3% chance to blind enemies on hit will give you, on average, slightly over 1 blinding hit per second with barrage. Just equipped one with flat life and 6% blind and every enemy that doesn't die instantly is blinded. Guide has been updated. This is a buff. :>

-O
Last edited by Orion72 on Dec 20, 2018, 3:45:58 PM
Yeah dude, i have a champion using a very similar setup. This build very effective. I'm loving it so much that i'll probably make this Jugg version as well now.
Whats better for HC on this build Jugg or champ? which one is better at surviving? and why?

Great build idea btw, feels way smoother than glad cyclone/hoa
Re: Jugg vs. champ in HC

Assuming as a champ we would take unstoppable hero, fortitude, inspirational, and first to strike, I would say it is a fair question.

Both have the necessary stun avoidance, and the endgame trees could be very similar. Champion will have slightly better offense since enemies will be intimidated and he could potentially keep war banner into the endgame by giving up the increased duration slot. Perma fortify even puts the champion in a slightly better place vs. elemental hits, since he will get 20% reduction vs. the Jugg's 5%-13% (depending on whether the Jugg is at full end charges that moment) at full build.

But, for hc, there is no comparison between how the two handle incoming physical damage, and most of the big knockout hits are at least part phys. The champion has fortify. The jugg, because of the ascendancy that gains back endurance charges when damage is taken, and the use of a lvl 1 CWDT>IC, is functionally immune to any physical damage except for a one shot, even after we eliminate all the "armour" by using gluttony. And you have to go a long way to find a one shot that can do over 9k damage after it's been reduced by 40% (which is the Jugg's phys reduction at full build, full end charges) or 53-61% if stationary due to arctic armour and Tukohama ascendancy.

So for HC, I choose and recommend the Jugg. (And glad you like the build idea)

-O
Last edited by Orion72 on Dec 21, 2018, 6:39:55 PM
I am playing it right now and love it, i played full block glad hoa last league but couldnt keep full stacks with cyclone, but with this i keep em on bosses i meant
Another question, is barrage better than rain of arrows? which gives more loh and gets stacks faster?

Ty

Report Forum Post

Report Account:

Report Type

Additional Info