When trying to build for maximum DPS...

Tell me if I got this general concept right.

So I'm in my skill tree planner, and there's all these different ways to increase my damage output. Also just in general.

The way I'm looking at it is... I feel like I want to balance out all of my different types of damage increasers. Much like how "increased damage" and "more damage" are two different multipliers, I also imagine cast speed is the same way. It's a 3rd multiplier, that I feel often gets overlooked.

So, let's say on one hand I could increase my spell damage by 50%. But on the other hand, I could increase my cast speed by 24%. Wouldn't the cast speed generally be the bigger DPS increase, because it's a separate multiplicative and most likely has the current lower value?

I feel like I might want to make sure that I grab these cast speed nodes so as to round everything out evenly, and maximize my DPS. I understand at that point, one must consider whether or not their mana can handle an increase to that multiplier - but I believe mine can, so why not make use of it, right?

You have the general concept right. Suppose for instance that you currently have 300% increased damage and 25% increased cast speed. In this situation +1% increased damage would give you 0.25% more DPS and +1% increased cast speed would give 0.8% more DPS. Damage comes in 3-4 times larger increments (both in tree and on items), so these numbers are fairly balanced.

Flat damage is another thing you really shouldn't overlook. It can be really powerful, to the point that a good flat damage roll is often the best single mod you can get on a weapon to increase your DPS.

Also consider what tactics you use in a boss fight. If you like glass cannon builds, you may end up doing a lot of running around. If your cast speed is sufficient to not get locked in a casting animation while the boss swings at you, higher single-hit damage may be the better choice.

Yes sir! I have considered all these things. I made the thread with my skill tree on mind, however.

I utilized my free respec, and popped 20 Regrets on my Merciless Bandit reward to be +1 Power Charge. Now I'm looking at 8129 ES, overcapped Light & Cold res's by 29% each (66% fire res, will have to adjust it at some point, but it's a non-emergency), and all the while, slightly increased damage numbers (and a decimal difference in cast speed, forget which direction).

I didn't end up putting skills into the 12% (edit, oops, not 9%) cast circles because I had to put a few points into mana & mana reserve that I didn't anticipate. But I believe fitting Wrath into my auras is more than worth it! (Pun!)

In fact, I'm debating if I should put my next 2 points into 6% / 14% aura effectiveness, but maybe not.

I also wanted to go down to that jewel socket near the life/ES nodes and do an Energy from Within (any version), but that was too many points to invest into, and is slightly less efficient than the Witch starting area ES. It would be my very next ES nodes, though.

Here, lemme show ya rather than talk about it.



It's almost exactly the build I showed previously, but there's some tweaks here and there that I made one step at a time, to make sure my crit was exactly where I wanted it, my mana as well, and etc.

I believe the +80% defenses that I ventured out to get on the far right is way worth it, and will only become even more worth it if I continue to get ES nodes (which I'm 50/50 on between that, or maybe the 54% crit mult area since I have 95% crit, kekekeke). But if I feel satisfied with my offensive power, I'll probably start going for the Energy from Within spot. And then if I get really leveled, I'll continue with ES and head towards Foresight (right under Witch's starting zone, you know the one).

So yeah!

But bleh, I still wonder... Maybe I should have went for the cast speed... But what would I even take out for it???

Edit:
I wonder if cast speed has a sort of diminishing return to it. Perhaps if I did grab the double 12% cast speed circles, maybe then I would be able to replace my Faster Casting gems with something else. Something like Added Lightning Damage, or Increased Critical Damage, would be sure to shoot the damage way up, right? Unless cast speed doesn't diminish [enough] to make that the case...

Food for thought!

Hmm...

My build says I should be level 80 (including the lack of +1 skills from Merc Bandits), but I am level 83 and holding 1 skill point. So I'm down 2 skill points somehow?

Are there skill points to be had that I'm unaware of?

I apparently have two open quests in both Normal and Cruel. Fairgraves, and Dominus. Could these be it? (Nope. It's the Normal & Cruel Act 5 reward, ugh.)

Don't go into too much detail with balancing the tree. Your gear and support gems also give damage and cast speed increases, which alter that balance. Increases from all sources are added together before being applied to the stat in question. So if you have 200% increased damage but no cast speed from gear and gems, you'll want to emphasize cast speed in the tree to compensate.

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ShadyC wrote:

I wonder if cast speed has a sort of diminishing return to it. Perhaps if I did grab the double 12% cast speed circles, maybe then I would be able to replace my Faster Casting gems with something else. Something like Added Lightning Damage, or Increased Critical Damage, would be sure to shoot the damage way up, right? Unless cast speed doesn't diminish [enough] to make that the case...

Not as such. It's a direct multiplier to your DPS. However as with all linear multipliers, the marginal returns do diminish the higher it goes. At 25% increased cast speed adding 1% will give 0.8% more DPS, but at 150% increased cast speed it's only 0.4% more, even if the absolute increase is the same.

For a crit build an increased critical strikes support might be worth considering, if you don't have one already.

Note that it gives base crit chance - +2% at level 20 - in addition to the hefty increase. That could help you release some crit nodes from the tree (and potentially pathing nodes leading to them) for other uses. On the other hand a 20/20 faster casting support gives 49% increased cast speed, which isn't to be scoffed at either.

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ShadyC wrote:

My build says I should be level 80 (including the lack of +1 skills from Merc Bandits), but I am level 83 and holding 1 skill point. So I'm down 2 skill points somehow?

Are there skill points to be had that I'm unaware of?

You don't have any bandit rewards selected in your poeplanner link. Maybe that's it? Or did you take passives from all of them before the respec?

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ShadyC wrote:

I apparently have two open quests in both Normal and Cruel. Fairgraves, and Dominus.

I assume that's the act 3 fairgraves? That one gives a ring, not a passive point.

Nah, I got 95% crit chance already ;)
7 max Power Charges as an Assassin.

My mult isn't that high, though. I grab it wherever I can, but I dunno, it's only like 270% before Power Charges. That's one reason I'm considering grabbing the 54% set of skill nodes.

There's also not really much cast speed to be had from gear, either. Especially when compared to all the spell damage, ele damage, etc that you rack up. Or even crit mult, or any other stat. Cast speed feels like the lowest number that you get.

But you also gain it in small increments. Someone would have to do some moderate levels of math to know roughly what areas one should get cast speed at.

Act 5 isn't out yet. I presume you mean Act 4 The Mines level 2 passive point?

At any rate, you can check the accounting for which passive points you do have by putting /passives into the in game chat