With Vaal orb in-game, it's valid to ease 6L and shift the burden of investment on it

Every other item in the game is being recycled quite fast, due to the ease of having them replaced. Even at that rate, rare vaals are worth tons of currency. (for example couple days ago in global we had a guy get minion damage on his 3-off Alpha's Howl - that thing is easily worth 7-8 exalts in rampage.)

What item do you never see being vaaled? Chests. (and 2H, but close to no one uses them. If we assume that 2H weren't in a bad position, they would be in the same group)

Why? Due to the heavy investment required in them to have a 6L.

Before this little, awesome and devastating at the same time orb made it into the game, it was true that 6L was the final frontier in terms of power, but that no longer holds true and I feel like the economy can now handle moving on from that.

In fact, there are 2 uniques in the game that demonstrate perfectly how the game is perfectly in position to handle that change. And those are Khaom's and Tabula. Each of them for different reasons, yet so similar at the same time.

Neither of them has to worry about the 6L process, although obviously from different perspectives. And what do you have for them? People trying to get +1 gem level on their Tabula and +1 all max res in Khaom's almost all the time.

That is also an investment that doesn't burn people out, because most of the time, it will be done in a second version of the unique they are trying to corrupt. They might invest a lot of currency until they get it right and destroy many versions of that unique in the process, but they won't feel like they are being limited from reaching their pinnacle in the same way a 6L does. (you can clearly see that juicy 6th socket) Corrupting is about going OVER your pinnacle and it's a much bigger cause for someone to pursue, where people have clear knowledge of the potential reward and potential danger.

Meanwhile, 6L doesn't offer that interaction. It doesn't have a real danger, it's only a limiter and you are always clearly aware of that.

I'm leaving the average of fusings needed up to debate, but I support that with vaal orb in the game, making 6L require as low as an average of 750 or even 500 would not only not damage the game or its economy, but revitalize both.

I don't know about you, but I personally want to start seeing chests being sacrificed in the name of Atziri as well.

And before any elitists try to say that it's a bad idea.

Yes,your shav's will still be worth 30-40 exalts.
No, your 6L shav's will not be worth 60 exalts. More like 35-45.
Yes, your 6L+1 gems or 6L+1 max res shav's will be worth 100+ exalts.

Do you feel lucky to earn them or have you got too used to just flipping for currency by now?

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Apos91 wrote:

Before this little, awesome and devastating at the same time orb made it into the game, it was true that 6L was the final frontier in terms of power, but that no longer holds true and I feel like the economy can now handle moving on from that.

Honestly, i dont think it can. Even if 6links were twice as common, people would still never use vaal orbs on chests, because even at twice the droprate they are still too rare for a vaal attempt to make sense.
All you would accomplish is to make 6links more common, while it would have close to no effect on the amount of vaals used on 6L chests. I am quite certain that most people would not even dare to vaal 5L chests.

You even say yourself that good 6L items will still be worth the exact same amount even after your suggestion is implemented. This already implies that the investment of vaaling such a chest would still be as risky as before, completely contradicting what you are trying to achieve.

Vaaling chests is just the ultimate gamble.
You would have to increase the droprates of 6L tenfold to make it less of an ultimate gamble.
A tenfold increase in droprate is not going to happen. Even doubling the droprate will never happen.
Ergo, your suggestion has no foothold tbh.

You honestly cannot make an argument on the basis that Vaal Orbs allowed you to fuck items up.

Vaal orbs are bad. Their effects are bad. Noone wants to buy them even 3:1.
Remove from the game pls.

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Chundadragon wrote:

You honestly cannot make an argument on the basis that Vaal Orbs allowed you to fuck items up.

In fact, I'm fairly certain I can and I did.

Fucking items up means long term investment in the long term on getting it right, which creates a goal for the individual. The individual then either chooses to pursue that goal based on the potential risk compared to the potential reward. If the risk is losing an item that required extremelly huge amounts of investment, then the potential risk will never outweight the reward.

That is a fact. Whether you like the effects of a vaal orb is an opinion. If anything, you are the one who can't make an argument based on whether you like that vaal orb destroys items or not.

I'd rather you didn't present opinions as facts. My opinion on the matter is that it is plausible to shift from fusings to vaals as the stretch goal. THAT is something you can disagree with and present counter arguments. (although I doubt you have any on whether items should take an average of 1500 fusings to 6L) The basis that Vaal orb has the potential and ability to present a stretch goal to the player is a fact. That means you can't base a counterargument to it, it just works like that.

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gh0un wrote:

Honestly, i dont think it can. Even if 6links were twice as common, people would still never use vaal orbs on chests, because even at twice the droprate they are still too rare for a vaal attempt to make sense.
All you would accomplish is to make 6links more common, while it would have close to no effect on the amount of vaals used on 6L chests. I am quite certain that most people would not even dare to vaal 5L chests.

I would gladly vaal 5L chests if 6L wasn't part of the picture. The only reason why people don't vaal 5L chests is because 5L is always inferior to 6L and thus there is close to no point to invest on that. (6L is still superior to 5L+1 gems for example.)

So if 6L were more common, yes,in fact, I would vaal them. And if 5L was the ultimate possibility for links in chest, with the same chance, then yes, I would vaal those just as much.

"

gh0un wrote:

You even say yourself that good 6L items will still be worth the exact same amount even after your suggestion is implemented. This already implies that the investment of vaaling such a chest would still be as risky as before, completely contradicting what you are trying to achieve.

Actually I didn't. Read up again.

"

Yes,your shav's will still be worth 30-40 exalts.
No, your 6L shav's will not be worth 60 exalts. More like 35-45.
Yes, your 6L+1 gems or 6L+1 max res shav's will be worth 100+ exalts.

"

gh0un wrote:

Vaaling chests is just the ultimate gamble.
You would have to increase the droprates of 6L tenfold to make it less of an ultimate gamble.
A tenfold increase in droprate is not going to happen. Even doubling the droprate will never happen.
Ergo, your suggestion has no foothold tbh.

Actually,it has, and you have resurted in a logical fallacy and in a twisting of my own words to prove otherwise.

You said that 5L are never vaaled, but you didn't present the reason why, which is that a 6L far outnumbers a 5L in power, thus noone has the will to invest in a 5L+vaal, because it will always be weaker than just a 6L.

You tried to quote me of something that I didn't say.

If there is someone who has no foothold here. That's you.