Life/Mana leeching - few questions
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I cant find stright answer so im writing here.
1. I know that leeching with "% of physical attacks" or "on hit" always concerns physical damage. But what about leeching on kill? Witch for example have passive Soul Siphon. So this means that it should cover spell killing blows. Otherwise existing of such passive would be complete nonsense. 2. "% of physical dmg" counts for whole dmg made on many monsters or only one we actually hiting? 3. Leeching limit (20% of life) counts for all ways of leeching or each of way have this limit separately? |
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1. Mana/Life Gain on Kill and on Hit are not Leech.
It doesn't specify, so it's not specific. PoE is very strict and literal about its wording. If it doesn't say something, it doesn't do it. If it's not described as Leech, it's not Leech. 2. You Leech from each monster individually, based on how much Physical damage was dealt. 3. There is no limit to how much you can Leech. People really need to stop spreading that nonsense. Leech replenishes your Life at a rate of 20% Max Life per second. The exact amount of Life you Leech when you hit a monster does not matter: the Leech rate is always the same. The Leech rate can only be improved with a Quality Life Leech support. At max quality, Leech replenishes at 24% Max Life per second. The amount of Life you Leech dictates the duration of the replenishment. Leech more -> regenerate for a longer duration. Simple. What people like to incorrectly call the "cap" on Leech is the point where you Leech enough Life to obtain effectively constant replenishment. You can still Leech more just fine, it's just redundant because Leech replenishment stops when you hit Max Life anyways. Mana Leech replenishes at 12.5% per second, 20% Qual Support gets you 1.5%/sec. Life Gain on Hit/Kill is 1. completely unrelated, and 2. instant. Last edited by Vipermagi#0984 on Sep 8, 2013, 9:06:24 AM
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WOW! This is really informative and revolutionises my strategies. So far i was thinking that "%" is best for bosses, "hit" best for many tough mobs (blue) and "kill" for waves of normal monsters. Offcourse it depends on level of value too. But now i have to dive deeper in character builds and think over strategies i use.
So lets get it stright. "%" works ONLY with physical dmg, so it means that skills (attacks) which add elemental dmg and elemental dmg from items doesnt count here. Hit/kill are completely versatile and they work with spells as well. Am i right now? |
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Just one minor error :)
The description for Gain on Hit specifies it only works with Attacks ("+x Life gained for each enemy hit by your Attacks"). It's just easier to call it Gain on Hit :P Theoretically, Leech is superior for slower Attackers, whilst Life Gain on Hit wins out on high Attack Speed builds. However, there's two things in PoE that prevent that from being true: -There are no slow builds - Attack speed is king -The Leech Support gems are unspecified Leech Even for the most hitspammy builds, a Life Leech gem is just far superior to Life Gain on Hit late-game. Welp. |
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Leech from a skill Support Gem doesn't just leech from physical damage but all damage. Leech from gear or passives only leech from physical damage.
And to clarify about the comment about there being no leech cap, while that's technically true, it's not effectively true. If you're taking more than 20% of your life in damage each second, no amount of leech will overcome that. So, while the cap on leech isn't on the leech itself but on how fast you get that leech back, it's still effectively capped. I don't care if my life ball fills up after the fight is over. I need it to fill up while I'm taking damage. Guild Leader The Amazon Basin <BASIN> Play Nice and Show Some Class www.theamazonbasin.com Last edited by mark1030#3643 on Sep 10, 2013, 11:34:23 AM
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What, no. That's not what 'effective cap' means at all.
When you take more damage than you regenerate, your regen is still 100% effective: there is no effectiveness lost, there is no effective cap reached. It is not 100% sufficient, but that's a whole other case. The effective cap is reached when you Leech more than you need to fill back up. You can Leech more, but it has no effect (ie. is not effective) because you will hit 100% already. VP doesn't remove the effective cap (you can still Leech more than you need), it increases the rate of replenishment to instant. Last edited by Vipermagi#0984 on Sep 10, 2013, 12:01:02 PM
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I guess we have different definitions of cap and effective. If I get absolutely no benefit from leeching more than 20% of my max life per second, I'd call that an effective cap. The difference between 5% and 100000% leech is nothing if my life ball still fills up at 20% of my max life per second. Sounds like a cap to me. Maybe it makes a difference if you take damage for long periods of time without attacking to get more leech, but if I'm in a fight, I'm leeching.
Guild Leader The Amazon Basin <BASIN>
Play Nice and Show Some Class www.theamazonbasin.com |
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What you describe there is the duration 'capping' out, not the Life per Second :/ That's... What I've been saying.
You always regenerate at 20% Max Life per second. Your regeneration cannot hit any sort of cap, because it's a fixed amount. It's as simple as that. Last edited by Vipermagi#0984 on Sep 10, 2013, 3:35:43 PM
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"If that's what I'm saying that's not what I'm meaning to say. I'm trying to say that there is a point in which having more life leech doesn't help you. If I get my life leech up to infinity, I still get the same life per second return as I do if my life leech is 20% of my max life per second. Unless I plan on taking damage and not hitting back to get more leech. And now as I reread the part of your statement I quoted, I don't see how that makes any sense. Your life per second is indeed capped at 20% of your max life. It's the duration that is not capped. Which gets to the crux of my point. Duration doesn't gain you anything if you are attacking and leeching during a battle. About the only thing duration would help you with is refilling your life ball if you're not attacking. Guild Leader The Amazon Basin <BASIN>
Play Nice and Show Some Class www.theamazonbasin.com |
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"Your life per second is indeed capped at 20% of your max life."
Nnno, it's not. A fixed number cannot cap out, because a cap means there's a value below that point. There isn't for Leech. It's always the same amount of Life per Second. Hence, the replenishment cannot be capped, effectively or literally. "Duration doesn't gain you anything if you are attacking and leeching during a battle." Indeed! :) That's where the effective cap lies: when you Leech so much the additional duration doesn't get you anything more. The additional duration has no effect, it is not effective. |
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