Endgame XP loss [GGG Please Hear me out!]

The Problem (The frustration): I know that GGG wants there to be a cost to failing... and I believe it was Jonathan on the stream that said something like: is the person that got to level 100 without dying the same as the person who didn't get to level 100 without dying? I had two immediate thoughts when he said that:

(1) That is the delta between a Hardcore character and a trade league character. Right? This leads to my second thought/point.

(2) I have played PoE1 for 6058hr (so not a lot)... and I only have one level 100 character and I traded (in game currency) for an XP carry. The majority of characters that are level 100 got carried (not all but most). So there really isn't a delta between the character that is 100 from playing and the player that got the carry... the real difference is with Hardcore, where everyone with a level 100 character got their by playing.

Oddly enough this isn't even my argument against XP loss at endgame. I think my arguments would rather be this:

(1) The amount of XP to get to 100 from playing, is so incredibly high, getting to 100 is more of an "investment of time" rather than a "cost of failure." You are effectively punishing someone for playing a lot... THAT is never fun.

(2) There is a ton of value and power in the last 4-5 skill points... you should allow someone to earn them with an investment of time as a reward. THAT is always fun.

(3) In PoE1, one of the grinding challenges is getting to level 100. That shouldn't change (if you add challenges in PoE2)... it is STILL a grind to get to 100 even without XP loss for most players that aren't content creators and playing all day long every day.

(4) So what would the cost of failure be? In PoE2 I have been spending a lot of time juicing my maps via towers. I get them all setup and have a finite number of juiced maps as a result... if I fail the map, I lose all of that investment of time and resources rolling Tablets and picking the optimum path, etc. THAT loss hurts in PoE2... the classic meme of "At that moment... he knew... he screwed up" (morgan freeman voice). That hurts way more than the XP loss, the XP loss isn't a cost of failure... it is just annoying and an eyeroll. Especially since sometimes the solution to not failing is to level up and get more passive skill points (at level 96+ you will have the best gear you can afford).

(5) Timing content based on current XP. So, basically I get over 30% of a level in XP and I won't do anything risky... and the risky stuff is WHERE THE FUN IS at endgame. This is literally the best argument against XP loss in my humble opinion. I won't do bosses, or juiced maps, or expeditions, or rituals, or ascendancy runs... on and on. AND what I will do are boring low XP maps with little to no risk which is NOT fun. Yesterday I needed my last ascendancy and I was at 80% of a level.. but I was just logging in and was thinking I need my last 2 ascendancy points let's do it now.. so I jumped in (the temple of chaos) and I just had a bad random mix of ultimatum debuffs and got killed and said out loud "You are an idiot for doing that and losing that XP" I was working on level 91. I shouldn't be mad at myself for doing the content of the game because I am going to lose XP if I do it and just RNG bad luck die. (Meaning, it wasn't fun, it wasn't a skill check or a dmg check... it was just bad luck) Doing boring stuff that isn't fun until I level should not be "by design". Interestingly enough, those are all skill checks and a valid mechanics for Hardcore... because perma-death is the ultimate cost of failure.

Ultimately, the point is that "cost of failure" for trade league should be associated with the thing that trade league values (the loss of the juiced map... that gives you currency for trade. The currency is where the value is, and where the cost of failure should meet it... so it actually hurts). In Hardcore, the cost of failure is, well, the loss of all of your XP -- perma-death, lol.

The Solution (what I want): Given that gamers often ask for things they think they want, but if they got it they might hate it... My want is this: The beauty here is that the solution is already implemented. You would really just have to "turn off" XP loss.

The Actual Solution (what we need): I think the point of discussion for the GGG Devs is simply this: In the next content update... I believe you said every two months or so you would be adding big updates to the game... anyway, at the next big update SAY that you are going to do an experiment and disable XP loss to see how it feels, and to have the cost of failure just be the impact of failing a map on the atlas map. And ask for feedback about it. This would be great timing if you add druid and huntress and people come back to play those new classes. You would be able to see if more or less people hit 100 and how much time it takes. The devs playing would also be able to see if they think it feels better or not and if how they play changes.

+1

They removed flasks because people hated pianoing them (and in poe1 added the things that can automate them?.

I do the same thing I don't do new content until I level so I remove the XP loss from my calculation.

If I have to do an annoying workaround to negate this and make it nonexistent why have it?

I will parrot another thread saying, why not have the map XP be tied to that map. You die you lose what that map netted you so far, but nothing from previous maps.

+1

+1

+1

Like the idea of removing XP loss, but tying it to the content instance i.e. MAP

+1

Please give me a free headhunter as well, it's too rare, and spawn me right before the arbiter of ash as well. Can't be bothered to get there.

I think that is the bare minimum, removing XP loss.

I would prefer to go further myself though. I play games with my friend normally. The one life/portal thing makes it just feel bad the whole time. He is melee so dies a lot to random invisible ground/on-death stuff (we check recordings each time). He dies, he has to sit out while I finish the map. For that reason alone I want them to scrap the whole portal thing. Either give us 6 portals again or remove them entirely and let us keep respawning like in acts.

I would be fine with the xp loss being removed if they buffed the needed xp to level from 90-100 by 10% per level to make up for it.

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KodaVoss#7189 wrote:

(1) That is the delta between a Hardcore character and a trade league character. Right? This leads to my second thought/point.

No, hardcore means your character is GONE, done, finished, deleted. Not that you lost a little experience, it's OVER. One try, start over from the gallows.

The fact that you think that's even remotely close to experience loss (that can NEVER result in a lost level) is just mind boggling.