Not impressed with Master Alchemist

Making my first Pathfinder as I saw that they changed Master Alchemist ascendancy. I am trying out Explosive Concoction and this skill has little synergy with Master Alchemist. Yes, I carry Ruby, Topaz and Sapphire but the charge usage is very fast during tough fights. I can barely keep them recharged let alone using the actual flask.

It seems to be Master Alchemist is a buff for Mageblood user?


The patch video said they want people to use more top part of Ascendancy tree. Has the new change persuaded you? They nerfed Nature's Boon. It actually sounds like a nerf on Pathfind in general because 90% of pathfinders I see are Poison-based. Master Surgeon is very important ascendancy so that's 4 passives gone. Before people may skip master surgeon and take Nature's Boon for 6% elemental reduction.


Are you more likely to make a non-Poison Pathfinder? Veteran Bowyer has weak synergy with Explosive Concoction as it has no Physical damage to get that 15% conversion. Most people carry 1-2 Unique flasks and Master Alchemist does nothing for it.


They should have just made it All Flasks have 15% MORE effect on you and not just Magical. Yeah, it sounds like a mageblood fix. :(

you're right and that's exactly why I think EC pathfinder is kind of pointless because of the ascendancies. I'm playing EC ascendant instead, still getting the benefits of free flask charges and it works better imo. on a side note, you shouldn't be using ruby flask if you're not playing ignite EC, it doesn't really do much for non-ignite builds.

other options would be balbala brutal restraint and survival secrets for an EC build, I personally like balbala brutal restraint shaper of flames EC elementalist a lot because the ignites are huge

EC's fire base damage isn't that high. What do I sacrifice to use EC?
1. I lose 3 sockets
2. I lose weapon mods
3. I lose 2-3 flask usage


EC's aoe coverage is very small. Its best damage is from shotgunning at closer range. Shotgun means you need several projectiles which reduce your fire base damage for Ignite. Overall, EC has a lot of design flaws. I can't imagine other classes using Explosive Concoction. There are way better Ignite options out there that doesn't force you to lose a weapon and stacking too many flask-related passives.


Poison Concoction works great. You can stack poison with multiple projectiles, you can easily refill Life flasks (many options available in comparison to utility flasks) and you have two nice ascendancy passives to boost poison.

EC gets none of it. Veteran Bowyer is kind of trash for elemental build. EC has no physical and neither does Elemental Hit. The 15% Physical conversion is pointless. Veteran Bowyer also has little synergy with Ignite. Elemental penetration doesn't affect Ignite.

yeah, as I said you're not really supposed to play EC as a pathfinder, doesn't really matter if you're going for ignite or flat damage, pathfinder fits neither of them. it's either ascendant or something else with balbala/survival secrets (balbala generates more flasks then nature's boon). EC ascendant seems very powerful but you need a lot of items to make it work, EO skin of the lords, empower 4, unnatural instinct, thread of hope, cluster jewels, forbidden flesh and flame, etc. with these investments I'm pretty sure that the damage becomes pretty insane.

EC needs at least 37% increased aoe to become efficient with GMP and GV so if you can't hit that breakpoint, the damage won't be high since EC hits won't overlap properly on small sized bosses. this is why poison conc pathfinder feels very good to play, you get 30% aoe for free and 10% from the gem so you hit the important breakpoint with no investment and the build feels great at that point. otherwise PC and EC have the same aoe coverage.

this isn't true for ignite builds, since shotgunning is useless for ignite. flat EC and ignite EC play very differently in this regard but it's possible to scale both of them with the available options

I took out Ruby flask and I am happier.

The dev wants more people using the top portion of Pathfinder. I just don't feel the buff to Master Alchemist is amazing.


I chose EC as I want to see how well Veteran Bowyer fits the build. Kinda meh.

veteran bowyer is nothing more than 10% penetration for EC pathfinder since you're already at full flask charges while you're clearing maps. you usually run out of flasks during boss fights and veteran bowyer doesn't do anything in that case. if I was playing EC pathfinder I'd just take master alchemist and master surgeon

But do you guys think Master Alchemist is a good buff?

20% Magical flask effect increase on you seems very weak buff. Why not just regular flask effect incase? Why limit to only Magical? For a tier 2 passive, it's very weak

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chinesefoodverygood wrote:

Before people may skip master surgeon and take Nature's Boon for 6% elemental reduction.

that isn't why people took Nature's Boon, they took it for the infinite flask sustain for 0 effort.

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chinesefoodverygood wrote:

But do you guys think Master Alchemist is a good buff?

20% Magical flask effect increase on you seems very weak buff. Why not just regular flask effect incase? Why limit to only Magical? For a tier 2 passive, it's very weak

it's not very good, yeah. as I mentioned earlier you shouldn't really be doing pathfinder EC, ascendant offers way more damage since you go pf+zerk. also helps with the bossing as you get to use berserk, it's important as this build's bossing isn't spectacular

I am just testing out EC. I will change build for sure. I wanted to make my first pathfinder because of the Master Alchemist change. They actually nerfed Pathfinder by taking away 6% elemental reduction in Nature's boon. LOL

The dev wants people to take the north path and looks like they have failed completely. As an alchemist, it fails to offer more to Elemental path or makes Flask more interesting / unique.

20% just for Magical flask is S!@#$ I guess it's okay if you have Mageblood but a passive for one item seems unnecessary. Most people don't have Mageblood.


Some ways to make it a true Master Alchemist:
1. Increase the effect of Alchemist Genius by 50%
2. Gain Alchemist Genius permanently, much like Raider gets Onslaught
3. If they want more people to choose north path, it needs to increase AoE for elemental skills
4. All flask effect improves 20-30% and not just Magical ones.