Influenced monsters with % as extra damage effects are insane.

TLDR: Influenced monster +1 damage mod > other monsters +4 damage mods

So while the source of the numbers isn't official, there is clearly something up with certain base monsters in endgame and how they interact with all the new altar mods and atlas passives.

Watching streamers die to one-shots because they got greedy with additional mods can be amusing, but when you really look at the numbers, how do they stack up? How can players with thousands of hours of experience get blindsided by something like an auto attack from a magic monster?

Well these influenced monsters are meant to be scarier than normal monsters, and they are. They get a big damage increase and which gets mostly converted to elemental damage. On stat sheets this looks like 200-250% worth of more multipliers on their abilities and 75% converted to elemental(e). (For example, Molten Minotaurs)

A quick thought experiment assuming every monster does 100 physical damage(p) base, and that most players are assumed to have 75% elemental resistance and 0% phys reduction (Theoretically Evasion or ES builds should work without armor?)


Our influenced monster does;
100p + 200% more + 75% of P converted to E
= 300 damage (225e + 75p) or after reductions = 131.25


A normal monster with one damage mod on the map does;
100p + 100% of P as extra E
= 200 damage (100p + 100e) after reductions = 125


Looks normal so far! One added damage mod is hardly game breaking. But what happens when the influenced monster gets one?


Influenced monster + one map mod
100p + 200% more + 100% P as E + 75% converted
= 600 (525e + 75p) after reductions = 206.25 !!!!


This is a 65% increase in damage after reductions compared to our 1 mod example, for reference, this is what a normal monster looks like with FOUR damage mods added. (All 3 elements as added on map plus an altar?)

100p + 400% P as E = 500 (400e + 100p) -reductions = 200


Am I missing something here? Influence being worth slightly more than one mod makes sense, it multiplying an added damage effect to be worth 3x sounds way too hard of a spike. And explains a lot of 'random' one-shots people are experiencing.

This does not account for other increases, such as atlas passives, having less resistance, sentinel buffs, or anything else which can all be multiplied by the same factors.

OP you are better just highlighting monsters you think are overtuned and why you think so than digging into the maths, monsters are generally tethered to certain values and will get less or more mileage out of a particular mod.

The reason I say this is almost every monster already has more multipliers somewhere in its attack lines already it isn't unique to molten minotaurs they are just a hard fitting phys mob with a relatively simple swing animation (the worst kind)

Ziz didn't get blindsided he got greedy you can't make balance considerations on players that deliberately choose high risk its their choice, doubly so when they walk straight into the only glaring weakness their character has. This is as stupid as choosing all enemies ignore phys reduction on an expedition when you are an armour based melee character.

Altar balance is a separate problem, personally I think Altars were vastly superior last league and this leagues are either irrelevant and we choose them for free (blind, resist on ignore res builds, penalty/charge etc) or absolutely crushing (high phys as extra chaos, ones like 80% of random element and 25% pen which is INSANE) for the chance to get 3 shit uniques you don't want from clearing the entire map.

tldr, Ziz is an idiot, Minotaurs probably only slightly overtuned if that, Altars aren't worth to my eyes but they are optional regardless.

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Draegnarrr wrote:

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Fair assessment. I just think its a weird way to handle conversion attacks, and that some monsters are definitely over tuned.

Totally agree on Altars, also preferred them last league.

The scarab rewards and eater side passives may have been a bit too good, but they could have done either the reward pass or the downside pass on their own. Doing both pushed it way too far in the other direction.

Especially in combination with a monster-buffing league and Archnemesis pumping up monsters even higher.

Sometimes it feels like they lose track of different changes/systems interacting and the sum of it all swings things too far.