Soooo... elemental/physical thorns damage isn't even based on the amount of damage dealt?

Really?

I shield charge at an elemental thorns rare with my (near) pure phys gladiator, whose only source of elemental damage is a flat lightning roll from my amulet. My shield charge deals 2-34 lightning damage. And it procs the mortar from elemental thorns... fine, i did do elemental damage, it makes sense that it sends *something* my way...


...and then the mortar does 1.5k damage back to me (including cold damage apparently, because i was chilled by it. Despite me dealing zero cold damage to the mob). Are you serious?

As if it's not bad enough that reflect was replaced by this steaming pile of garbage mechanic that punishes the exact opposite of what reflect was meant to, on top of that you're telling me that dealing even a tiny sliver of the matching damage type causes you to still take the same heavy damage from the mortar? And the returned elemental damage doesn't even mirror the TYPE of damage you did?

On the flip side, if you had gotten a physical mortar reflect then it'd mean you didn't get hit as hard as you might have with reflect mechanics before. The overall effect seems to be you can go bonkers on your damage and it won't kill you, at the expense of if you have a little bit of that damage type then you need to keep your health up or at least pay better attention.

elemental thorn is ridiculous
why does it always hit for 33%+ of life and chill/ignite/shock you

Who the fuck dies to this? LOL Fucking joke mechanic.

I've just been attacking them and not even noticing the damage they deal, and its not like I run amazing builds. They seem pretty weak to me.

Play melee, Apathy.
It's easier to dodge the thing from 2 screens away.

@Jackalope_Gaming agree.
My char is a Frost Blades glass cannon, and these are less scary than the reflect map mod, which instantly kills me, and is hard to deal with even if I switch to Blade Flurry with a leech gem + Vaal Pact.

current 'reflect' implementation wins Talent Competition 2018 in the category 'How to implement game mechanic, not'

this entire mechanic makes ZERO SENSE, it got rushed - because GGG wrongly assumed that removal of VP == removal of reflect - and here we are with a joke of a creation that noone respects, noone admires, noone fears and noone cares about. just remove this damn thing. more people died to CI + BM combo than to current Thorns

list of 'wrongs' is so long that it might be best to sort them alphabethicaly at some point but some rough ones:

- damage 'reflected' (type) does not match damage type dealt. previous reflect tested char defences vs self. right now it tests your defences vs random ele blob.
- attack damage is reflected as a SPELL. this SCREWS melee players royaly - spell block and spells in general are melee's weakest point.
- all intricacies of RT vs Evasion vs Accuracy vs reflect are gone. this makes wanders (that are insanely idiotic currently), Lycosidae, Lioneyes etc accuracy-skipping concepts completely stupid
- the mortar hits melee players. had it ever killed any ranged player? ever? the 'fixed travel time' is nonsensical - ranged players are inherently quicker
- the mortar PUNISHES players with tanky, low-dps builds. i know there are other dps-checks in the game but why kick already dead horse?

the game would have been better without this abomination at all. reflect is gone, power-crazy kids are happy, skill has been removed. why pretend this is something more than a ego-boosting clicker game?

btw - abyss integration.. that explains a lot

Pretty sure Elemental Thorns is also AoE.

So I guess you guys miss of reflect, no? I mean, yeah, I suppose running VP and hitting as fast as possible to make your DPS high enough without one-shotting yourself was fun (and diverse!).

And please, don't say that nobody likes new reflect - it might not be perfect (especially the amount of damage dealt doesn't scale in any way with the damage done - dealing 3 lightning damage shouldn't unleash hell on your face, uh), but I'll take it over old implementation, any day.

That said, I loyally hate the fact you absolutely have to go nuts with DPS these days. You can't quite play tanky builds, as you're not only hindering your clear speed and boss killing potential (Shaper which is a DPS race) but also not gain a lot of actual tankyness because of the one-shot fiesta that is in turn caused by instant logout...
In other words - GGG had to gut reflect because they themselves caused people to go nuts with DPS, to the point reflect wasn't feasible anymore. I'd personally much prefer them removing instant logout, redesigning the DPS-race fights to be actual fights and re-tunning the reflect to match without gutting it the way they did.

But hey, it is what it is. The step they've taken is matching to the game we're playing today. You can complain about the rest of the reasons, but the decision was right for state that the game is in.

Reasons were good. If you can call 'the game is dumb make it dumber' can be called that.

But the execution is beyond terrible. It makes no sense and with all new chaseOPmeta mechanics they will introduce next league (just like any f2p p2w game that has to give power away to bribe people.to play) there is little hope they will at least design it properly

I didnt know one can actually implement thorns in such bland and nonsensical way..