Magic Find: Why fix something if it isn't broken?

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lososthefish wrote:

That bonus is multiplicative because it's "more".

You mean pain attunement? Could you explain the difference between the spell damage nodes and PA?

tl;dr argument against removing MF: "If you don't want to run a MF character, regardless of your reasons for that, you are just a silly casual, l2p. Us hardcore folks are going to run MFers because that's what hardcore folks do, and this is a hardcore game. Did I say L2MF yet?"

Back in the real world, some of us don't want to play one of the specialized builds that gets affected less by the need to drop item quality in exchange for magic find.

Dropping a pair of totems then playing "dodge the enemies" does not appeal to me as a playing style. Conjuring a horde of summons then playing "hide from the enemies" does not appeal to me as a playing style.

I could go down the MF-build list further, but that pretty well sums it up.

The real question is actually this: what does magic find actually add to the game?

All it does, to my eyes, is force every player to choose: (1) start with a build whose playing style might not appeal to the player, or (2) get mocked for being poor by people who declare themselves more "hardcore" for having picked the MF character first.

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DestroTheGod wrote:

Please go find me boots, gloves, and a helmet sporting double iir (40+) with iiq (15+), and decent es.

I was referring to how my MF character had for a long time been functioning with a cruddy 5L ES chest that didn't have a lot of ES. I could have invested currency to buy a much better chest to drastically increase my survivability and would not have lost any magic find. A better helm than mine also wouldn't have been too hard to get. I was not referring to perfect gear.

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Saying "without a lot of effort" is a lie. Gear with good iir, iiq, and high es sells for 50+ exalts easy. Saying that it's easy to buy gear that can fill the mf void that items like wondertrap, sadimas, aurasieze have AND provide survivability is a total lie.

You read into what I said. I was not talking about each piece of gear, just making my character better in general when he was already pretty good. Point is that its easy to survive with a summoner if you want to and still have a ton of MF, the same can not be said of melee.

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Again you're wrong. I've met many a person who run mf builds as melee and do just fine. Sure, they aren't pushing 500/100 mf, but they can still hit 300/50 which is pretty reasonable for the ability to solo clear any map. You're welcome to talk to my friend baksal about his 400/100 cyclone build that he uses which is capable of clearing most maps. :)

Tell him to post his gear. Its probably worth a ton more than my summoners who has been running that much magic find when I was very poor. Again, the point isn't that melee can't do it, its that it takes FAR more effort to do it on a melee who loses more survivability.

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I can do this all day my friend! Please spew more random bs for me to disprove. I'm having a blast! This takes me back to the arguments I enjoyed when I first started posting in these forums. Ahhh, good times. :)

Thats fine, just don't misinterpret my posts please.

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I think people want to get rid of MF because its a boring mechanic and wastes a spot on the table for rolls on items that could have much more rewarding results.

MF also has the placebo effect that causes endless debates on forums - just like this one - about whether or not its needed. Those who do not have it will blame all their bad luck on not having it, and scorn everyone who does have it. Those who do have it, will debate amongst themselves endlessly over whether or not they have enough of it - citing their 'results' which amount to nothing but anecdotal evidence at best.

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Sayyid wrote:

tl;dr argument against removing MF: "If you don't want to run a MF character, regardless of your reasons for that, you are just a silly casual, l2p. Us hardcore folks are going to run MFers because that's what hardcore folks do, and this is a hardcore game. Did I say L2MF yet?"

Back in the real world, some of us don't want to play one of the specialized builds that gets affected less by the need to drop item quality in exchange for magic find.

Dropping a pair of totems then playing "dodge the enemies" does not appeal to me as a playing style. Conjuring a horde of summons then playing "hide from the enemies" does not appeal to me as a playing style.

I could go down the MF-build list further, but that pretty well sums it up.

The real question is actually this: what does magic find actually add to the game?

All it does, to my eyes, is force every player to choose: (1) start with a build whose playing style might not appeal to the player, or (2) get mocked for being poor by people who declare themselves more "hardcore" for having picked the MF character first.

Make a lightning arrow or power siphon MF character then.

These are the people that can only game when their wife/mom is asleep usually.

They simply can't invest the time to get gear the way the game was designed to be played.

So yea they want paragon XXX and free XXXX MF so they can gear up in 1-2 map runs per week.

Just how it is.

EDIT: and also if I was in that situation i'd prob want orb drops quintupled or whatever too. But I really don't think i'd be playing an ARPG on that kind of time budget either. WHen I had only an hour or 2 a week to play way back when, I played garbage like COD, ghost recon, etc.

Get your fix in a few minutes and see you next week kinda games.

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DestroTheGod wrote:

I repeat very clearly: it is NOT easy to get high iir,iiq,es gear. Until you disprove this, you are wrong.

I can't be wrong about something I never said. You assumed thats what I meant without clarifying. What I meant was the loss of ES on those pieces can be easily made up on one good chest. I don't need perfect pieces of gear because I am a summoner, I avoid damage. Thats the entire point.

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Now you are blatantly lying.

If your going to call me a liar then I suggest you don't communicate with me in the future. I was never referring to changing those particular pieces of gear but you can pretend otherwise if you want.

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Again, you very clearly said ANY.

When I said "any" I was referring to making up the loss on those pieces of gear through upgrading other pieces of gear. Its really not that hard to understand. No need to accuse me of lieing.

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You were NOT talking about your character in general

Believe it or not I know better what I was referring to than you do because I typed it.

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You are saying 'it's easy to get this gear'

You made an assumption perhaps based on my wording. Just ask me to clarify instead of freaking out over it.

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Ah yes, another claim with 0 proof. It's very easy to make a claim without any proof. You're a pink unicorn, did you know that? Please don't post random bullshit without any proof to back it up. :)

If I had made the claim you thought I had then I would post proof but your chasing something that isn't true.

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In which way did I misinterpret? I have very clearly quoted you line for line and responded to each one. Provide for me multiple examples of where I have responded to something indirectly and I will absolutely acknowledge my fault.

Really no point in correcting you since you will just call me a liar anyway lol. Really pointless discussion here.

Anyhow you already agreed with my basic point anyway so I don't really care what you believe in regards to the misquote above. Its easier with less risk to stack MF on my summoner then many other builds. Thats the only reason I need to not like magic find.

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DestroTheGod wrote:

I don't need to. You're welcome to go check out this thread: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/522743 and see all the people running mf for yourself. Enjoy.

I really think your thread there backs up my points better than yours. Everyone with really good magic find in that thread is ranged. The only melee guy with ok magic find is running an awesome 6L two hander.

Ready for the fun part? I am! I know the quotes will remain but I'm fine with that. I hope you had time to read this post before I deleted it. :D

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;)