Solution to EXP loss/Death Penalty that wont make everyone angry

Many threads are created quite frequently in opposition of the EXP penalty as well as other things like having to beat the story every time you create a character.. I propose a simple solution to make these people happy.


A new gamemode like Standard or Hardcore called Softcore

In Softcore exp would not be lost on death and players who simply do not have the time to spend to reach the highest point in their builds would be able to do so at a steady pace during the time they do have available to play.



What is contributing to the rise of the distaste for exp loss?

Many users likely started playing this game when they were younger and now have familys or demanding jobs, These people are very likely among some of the highest contributors to your MTX sales and other things as well.

Additionally combined with the exp loss and the availability of builds to follow online many people do not take risks when making a character or even attempt to make one themselves because for them the exp loss stops them from pushing their build to the end game.



What would the effects be?

At first i thought perhaps this would destroy the game if exp loss were removed in Standard and for many people it likely would destroy quite a bit of the enjoyment they get out of it however if it is its own gamemode then only people who do not enjoy that aspect would likely shift completely to Softcore.

My second thought was if people are able to reach level 100 very easily they would get bored much faster but going a bit deeper into the eventuality of it this could also turn out going in the opposite direction with players knowing if they put in enough time they will reach the end of their build and perhaps this would encourage them to then make more builds.

Even if a build were to reach 100 it does not mean it would stop dying and this would also encourage them to make better builds in the future since their focus would shift off the exp loss and back to where the core problems are.


It would have a fresh economy!

I cant count the times despite having tons of legacy and other valuables in standard i've thought about what it would be like if GGG were to do a full wipe of all the items there but as nice as that thought is myself and many others are simply not willing to part with items some of which took several years to get or can not be obtained ever again.

If Softcore were to be added it would start completely fresh and everything would have value.. This would entice many players to potentially return or switch to this game mode including traders and crafters, I can only see this as a positive for a great many people even those who prefer the EXP loss would be tempted.



Wouldn't this cost GGG a bunch of money?

Maybe but i don't see why these players could not share the same physical server space as standard users as well as league servers and then expanded into its own servers if it proved to be profitable for GGG to do so.. GGG would simply (if its possible) separate the chat servers for Softcore from Standard and bam.


Conclusion:<-------------------

If you are against EXP loss on death then please support adding the Softcore game mode to path of exile by bumping this thread and contributing any other ideas you have on how this game mode could be added to and differentiated from Standard and Hardcore.

This is the only way i can see for these users to find their happy place here in POE and its quite clear that this complaint is not going away until something is done.


Additional Ideas submitted by the community:
[insert ideas]

3rd tier league is mandatory with current situation.

Great idea.

It will never ever happen, and now i know why.

Standard IS softcore, and noone outside of standard or in standrad should care how many lvl 100's there are or how long it took them via w.e. means they got there.

ahh but this is a HARDCORE game, and if a meaningless xp loss that didnt actually affect anyone, ( it doesnt standard is just a softcore-non-racing league ) without a xp loss the fanboys wouldnt be able brag to others about mastering "thee most hardcore summoner simulator on the market"

the guardians and nebuloch juggs already think this game is super easy, and removing a feature that doesnt affect them in anyway would take away from the accomplishments of having beat thee most complex hardcore blah blah

get fucking real
this game is a broken fucking mess. period. even if i didnt die ever again, id still never make 100, as who ever thought a 65% increase from 98-100 would make the game LOOK more hardcore.

and i know that cuz i dont die, i got so bored of running ez content for safe xp and i took risks again...my char could be alot better, but its good enough....to do what? go to 100? ill never make it. done trying.

so the xp loss...wont ever happen, we got keep up appearances, and if this isnt thee most hardcore arpg out...then wtf are we all playing it for?...fun? wtf is that>? you guys remember fun? in poe?

shits a job now, and xp loss wont change it. a developer more concerned about LOOKING hardcore, and wants its players to die, and doesnt want players too reach 100 and will put ALL of these things OVER fun, trying to look hardcore rather than providing actual enjoyment.

xp loss will stay.
players will leave
noone will care
PERIOD.

I agree that some sort of non-exp loss option would be great for us casuals that play maybe 5-10 hours a week tops.

However, I also see this argument to be similar to the removal of skill based matchmaking in FPS games.

Example: I used to play Apex Legends a ton...like 30 hours a week minimum...I got decent. I was routinely getting put in lobbies with high ranked players (and a few times with really good streamers).

Life came on fast. I can't even play it anymore because I'm still being put into lobbies with ultra sweaty people with 20,000 kills, because I USED to play all the time...and now I can't, so my skill has dropped, but it still matches me with gods.

POE: Lots of people that used to be able to grind out a whole league in like 2 weeks (8-10 hours a day), are hitting that "life happens" wall. I'm one of them. It takes me the entire league (if I last that long) to hit endgame content.

If my first build isn't perfect, I don't have time to tweak too much or make another. Every death that happens is a HUGE amount of time lost for me and I just recently moved on to other ARPGs.

I get that it's a crazy hard game...but the death penalty is just enough to push me over the line to "I don't want to do this all again in case I get a couple lag deaths."

Long story short - there's a lot of mechanics in games that push away anyone with a life. That sucks.

"

Redthorne82 wrote:

I agree that some sort of non-exp loss option would be great for us casuals that play maybe 5-10 hours a week tops.

However, I also see this argument to be similar to the removal of skill based matchmaking in FPS games.

Example: I used to play Apex Legends a ton...like 30 hours a week minimum...I got decent. I was routinely getting put in lobbies with high ranked players (and a few times with really good streamers).

Life came on fast. I can't even play it anymore because I'm still being put into lobbies with ultra sweaty people with 20,000 kills, because I USED to play all the time...and now I can't, so my skill has dropped, but it still matches me with gods.

POE: Lots of people that used to be able to grind out a whole league in like 2 weeks (8-10 hours a day), are hitting that "life happens" wall. I'm one of them. It takes me the entire league (if I last that long) to hit endgame content.

If my first build isn't perfect, I don't have time to tweak too much or make another. Every death that happens is a HUGE amount of time lost for me and I just recently moved on to other ARPGs.

I get that it's a crazy hard game...but the death penalty is just enough to push me over the line to "I don't want to do this all again in case I get a couple lag deaths."

Long story short - there's a lot of mechanics in games that push away anyone with a life. That sucks.

yea its reasonable.
this is why we need 3rd tier league.
HC is providing the highest difficulty plus some complete unfair situation but usually players in hc can get over it.

Standard is proving the medium difficulty. which we have right now but a lot of people are trying to bring that difficulty down to low which is unacceptable.

"

StonedSword wrote:

It will never ever happen, and now i know why.

Standard IS softcore, and noone outside of standard or in standrad should care how many lvl 100's there are or how long it took them via w.e. means they got there.

ahh but this is a HARDCORE game, and if a meaningless xp loss that didnt actually affect anyone, ( it doesnt standard is just a softcore-non-racing league ) without a xp loss the fanboys wouldnt be able brag to others about mastering "thee most hardcore summoner simulator on the market"

the guardians and nebuloch juggs already think this game is super easy, and removing a feature that doesnt affect them in anyway would take away from the accomplishments of having beat thee most complex hardcore blah blah

get fucking real
this game is a broken fucking mess. period. even if i didnt die ever again, id still never make 100, as who ever thought a 65% increase from 98-100 would make the game LOOK more hardcore.

and i know that cuz i dont die, i got so bored of running ez content for safe xp and i took risks again...my char could be alot better, but its good enough....to do what? go to 100? ill never make it. done trying.

so the xp loss...wont ever happen, we got keep up appearances, and if this isnt thee most hardcore arpg out...then wtf are we all playing it for?...fun? wtf is that>? you guys remember fun? in poe?

shits a job now, and xp loss wont change it. a developer more concerned about LOOKING hardcore, and wants its players to die, and doesnt want players too reach 100 and will put ALL of these things OVER fun, trying to look hardcore rather than providing actual enjoyment.

xp loss will stay.
players will leave
noone will care
PERIOD.

Typical reply, Standard is Standard, there is no softcore, Not yet anyway and while we're at it this game is not even close to really being hardcore.. Minecraft Hardcore is 500% more hardcore than POE since you lose EVERYTHING forever where as in POE you keep everything in standard and you can just trade your GG gear for currency cross league Standard>Hardcore lolz.

This thread isnt about removing xp loss its about creating a gamemode where there is no exp loss for the masses who have been making threads on it daily for well over a year.

Also im not asking for this for myself as i'll stay in standard/leagues, its become quite apparent a large majority of players want the exp loss gone(i don't want it gone in standard) and this is the ONLY way it can happen for them outside of playing on the tencent version.

Lastly getting to 100 is easy, it just takes a lot of time.

"

SilentSymphony wrote:

"

StonedSword wrote:

It will never ever happen, and now i know why.

Standard IS softcore, and noone outside of standard or in standrad should care how many lvl 100's there are or how long it took them via w.e. means they got there.

ahh but this is a HARDCORE game, and if a meaningless xp loss that didnt actually affect anyone, ( it doesnt standard is just a softcore-non-racing league ) without a xp loss the fanboys wouldnt be able brag to others about mastering "thee most hardcore summoner simulator on the market"

the guardians and nebuloch juggs already think this game is super easy, and removing a feature that doesnt affect them in anyway would take away from the accomplishments of having beat thee most complex hardcore blah blah

get fucking real
this game is a broken fucking mess. period. even if i didnt die ever again, id still never make 100, as who ever thought a 65% increase from 98-100 would make the game LOOK more hardcore.

and i know that cuz i dont die, i got so bored of running ez content for safe xp and i took risks again...my char could be alot better, but its good enough....to do what? go to 100? ill never make it. done trying.

so the xp loss...wont ever happen, we got keep up appearances, and if this isnt thee most hardcore arpg out...then wtf are we all playing it for?...fun? wtf is that>? you guys remember fun? in poe?

shits a job now, and xp loss wont change it. a developer more concerned about LOOKING hardcore, and wants its players to die, and doesnt want players too reach 100 and will put ALL of these things OVER fun, trying to look hardcore rather than providing actual enjoyment.

xp loss will stay.
players will leave
noone will care
PERIOD.

Typical reply, Standard is Standard, there is no softcore, Not yet anyway and while we're at it this game is not even close to really being hardcore.. Minecraft Hardcore is 500% more hardcore than POE since you lose EVERYTHING forever where as in POE you keep everything in standard and you can just trade your GG gear for currency cross league Standard>Hardcore lolz.

This thread isnt about removing xp loss its about creating a gamemode where there is no exp loss for the masses who have been making threads on it daily for well over a year.

Also im not asking for this for myself as i'll stay in standard/leagues, its become quite apparent a large majority of players want the exp loss gone(i don't want it gone in standard) and this is the ONLY way it can happen for them outside of playing on the tencent version.

Lastly getting to 100 is easy, it just takes a lot of time.

1.) It doesn't matter how you label it (softcore, hardcore, etc.).

2.) To create such game mods (or new league...whatever u wanna call it) has been a request since PoE started years ago. It's old and nothing new at all. PoE actually promised that everyone would be able to customize the game according to their own needs when the game was still in closed beta. It never happened (maybe a little bit with private leagues).

3.) The masses haven't been making threads about xp loss for well over a year. They have since the very beginning of PoE.

4.) I agree that reaching 100 is easy but it always makes me feel uncomfortable seeing people speak about it who don't have a single lvl 100 char. Nothing is actually too difficult in this game, it just takes time and the willingness to spend that time.

I personally don't want another official league because i don't like to see more people being spread across the leagues (and that's just selfish because I want to be able to trade comfortably). If it were to happen I wouldn't mind. In the end I feel like PoE is a solo-game anyways for the most part (if it weren't for trading).

There is already softcore league. You want another with less penalty, sure but then call it what it is, scrubcore, noobcore, carebearcore. Pretending otherwise by keeping existing league name for yours is just cowardice.

"

Deathfairy wrote:

There is already softcore league. You want another with less penalty, sure but then call it what it is, scrubcore, noobcore, carebearcore. Pretending otherwise by keeping existing league name for yours is just cowardice.

Standard is not Softcore and those other terms are fairly insulting, also I don't personally want it, But a lot of other people seem to they just have not made the connection to what they should be asking for so i made this thread.

I'm also in favor of harsher penalty's in standard and its related leagues

I'd play hardcore if:
Everything were deleted including character upon death
Cross league trading were banned(aka Standard>Hardcore)
Log-Out macro made impossible for cheating death

"

StonedSword wrote:

ahh but this is a HARDCORE game,

This game is motherfucking Cookie Clicker dark medieval fantasy clearspeed edition, with RPG elements layered over just like your typical contemporary first-person shooter except well done.

Or, as one might say, a summoner simulator.

But it is true that Path of Exile's success is due it no small part to its pretensions of hardcoreness so that its playerbase can feel better about themselves as they casually watch Netflix and occasionally grab a sip of Mtn Dew. Hell, even my being aware of it doesn't stop that from working on me a little.

So I guess the question is: would having Carebearcore League break the immersion of pretending one is playing a hardcore game? Quite possibly, if one is playing in it… but almost certainly not, if one avoids it. Playing Standard when a Carebearcore is available might even add to the delusion.