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I've played games without death penalties. They're good for about a week.
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Posted byShagsbeardon Jan 17, 2020, 9:03:12 PM
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first guy stacked crit, accuracy and damage on an extra damage map, probably T8 atlas too(sextnats?) and ofc the bird is gonna slamdunk him, he was also "moving" but in fact he stayed perfectly on the bosses slam aoe whole time
second guy dashed into a martyrpack.. yeah i know but you should assume thats gonna happen at some point(again, was it a torment map-->then you should be extra alerted that there might be martyr anywhere, just like DD totem on a totem map)
you dont need to avoid content(maybe some bosses)but you need to play it perfectly aka not do stupid things.
this game used to be a game where you needed to READ mapmods and then even skip some bosses, like in 1.0 running -max hasted Piety was considered suicide.
i think this was also the reason why people hated bestiary/betrayal, they couldn't understand what extra mods does to monsters.
i blame powercreep, people one-shotting everything and killing bosses in 2 hits does this... you can ignore every map/sextannmod and still do everything.
ha-ha
first guy died before the attack actually attacked.
second guy died before showing he was taking damage. first comment states
"
saw in slow motion
He actually died before the explosion
rigged
Next
problem with blaming power creep and people one-shotting everything and killing bosses in 2 hits etc, is that is what we're reduced to doing when defenses do nothing. the game is easy mode 99.9% of the time nothing to worry about then BAM you're dead before you can even react, sometimes before you even see an attack happen or before you even see yourself taking damage.
defenses not meaning a damn thing is what drives us to one shot everything and kill bosses in 2 hits. that is how this gameplay was created, since GGG nerfs defenses for years ever since 1.0 and onward.
so yes in order for GGG to stop us from instantly deleting their game they give them hp buffs, defensive buffs etc - all without addressing our need to instantly delete their game.
i've been saying this since 3.9 patch notes, and for years prior every single time GGG nerfs our defensive abilities
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Posted byxMustardon Jan 17, 2020, 9:08:08 PM
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every defense layer? ever tried to dodge things?
i dodge manually when its possible ... i cant see projectiles fired from outside the screen with the speed of light ...
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I find the 10% xp penalty for dying a bit outdated but that's just me. I get ppl are like, but 100 should be hard!
But on the other hand, why should it be hard? There's no real reason for the penalties imo, other than making ppl frustrated, especially with the BS one-shots we have in the game sometimes.
There's no good reason for the death penalty in the game imo.
/edit/ I basically can't die from mapping (except for when some ghost went lol, yes you can and blew me up through 14k ES in 0.5s) and I'll probably reach 98 tomorrow because all I've been doing is farming Sirus, but still, the 6 portal thing is incentive enough to not die your way through boss encounters/etc.
thats what i dont get why people pull out that argument like hey you could die your way to 100
and well i only seen excuses for the death penalty instead of good arguments ...
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I cant die if I don't want to die. Do tier 15 maps + metamorphs all day, leave more dangerous fights like guardians for later = no problem. I leveled from 30% level 96 to level 97 deathless this way. But right now I don't care. I do 8 modded guardian maps, die sometimes, it doesn't bother me.
if i want to do some hard stuff i expect to die
but i dont expect to die from stuff that isnt obvious its like playing minesweeper ...
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This is the crux of the issue. You simply disagree with GGG (and lots of other people) on this point. The death penalty is not going to change simply because you are in the minority here
i know people who complain about that are a minority
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Death penalty should stay! And this is comming from a melee player not following a meta build!
only because you like it others dont have to
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Player issues
Nothing to see here
Death's avoidable unless you lag 24/7 which in that case why are you playin?
where's the argument? generalizing certain problems isnt a good argument
or are you reffering to that some death is avoidable?
like i said random ..
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I would say that using challenges as something thats easy is kinda weird. Challenges are totally arbitrary and not part of core gameplay. Getting X challenges is less part of the game than killing uber elder or A8 Sirus, its just this random listing of tasks, used by some, ignored by others.
Changing a core gameplay mechanic just for the sake of some random challenge, thats pretty niche.
it shouldnt be easy it should just not be 24/7 grinding and avoiding content or absolutely impossible...
"There are Penalties in the Game, no one's complaining about them"
Chris Wilson Exilecon 2019 Last edited by Wladicorist1 on Jan 17, 2020, 9:27:22 PM
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Posted byWladicorist1on Jan 17, 2020, 9:11:52 PM
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Dying is part of poe, im only enjoying the game when i am 0% xD
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Posted byimcomingheheeon Jan 17, 2020, 9:26:48 PM
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Dying is part of poe, im only enjoying the game when i am 0% xD
im enjoying it running boring t11-12 maps with some random appearences from niko
einhar zana and the other new
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problem with blaming power creep and people one-shotting everything and killing bosses in 2 hits etc, is that is what we're reduced to doing when defenses do nothing. the game is easy mode 99.9% of the time nothing to worry about then BAM you're dead before you can even react, sometimes before you even see an attack happen or before you even see yourself taking damage.
defenses not meaning a damn thing is what drives us to one shot everything and kill bosses in 2 hits. that is how this gameplay was created, since GGG nerfs defenses for years ever since 1.0 and onward.
so yes in order for GGG to stop us from instantly deleting their game they give them hp buffs, defensive buffs etc - all without addressing our need to instantly delete their game.
i've been saying this since 3.9 patch notes, and for years prior every single time GGG nerfs our defensive abilities
actually the game rotting on my drive like a forgotten rat in my cellar
after 1 and half months because the game give me reason to do so
and as soon as i see friends or people who trying poe i try to convince them not to spend that much time in this game because they gonna end up just like this
"There are Penalties in the Game, no one's complaining about them"
Chris Wilson Exilecon 2019 Last edited by Wladicorist1 on Jan 17, 2020, 9:35:29 PM
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Posted byWladicorist1on Jan 17, 2020, 9:28:23 PM
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I've played games without death penalties. They're good for about a week.
strange
i've played games like that also and spend thousands of hours :D
but well thats only your opinion
"There are Penalties in the Game, no one's complaining about them"
Chris Wilson Exilecon 2019
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Posted byWladicorist1on Jan 17, 2020, 10:57:44 PM
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first guy stacked crit, accuracy and damage on an extra damage map, probably T8 atlas too(sextnats?) and ofc the bird is gonna slamdunk him, he was also "moving" but in fact he stayed perfectly on the bosses slam aoe whole time
second guy dashed into a martyrpack.. yeah i know but you should assume thats gonna happen at some point(again, was it a torment map-->then you should be extra alerted that there might be martyr anywhere, just like DD totem on a totem map)
you dont need to avoid content(maybe some bosses)but you need to play it perfectly aka not do stupid things.
this game used to be a game where you needed to READ mapmods and then even skip some bosses, like in 1.0 running -max hasted Piety was considered suicide.
i think this was also the reason why people hated bestiary/betrayal, they couldn't understand what extra mods does to monsters.
i blame powercreep, people one-shotting everything and killing bosses in 2 hits does this... you can ignore every map/sextannmod and still do everything.
ha-ha
first guy died before the attack actually attacked.
second guy died before showing he was taking damage. first comment states
"
saw in slow motion
He actually died before the explosion
rigged
Next
problem with blaming power creep and people one-shotting everything and killing bosses in 2 hits etc, is that is what we're reduced to doing when defenses do nothing. the game is easy mode 99.9% of the time nothing to worry about then BAM you're dead before you can even react, sometimes before you even see an attack happen or before you even see yourself taking damage.
defenses not meaning a damn thing is what drives us to one shot everything and kill bosses in 2 hits. that is how this gameplay was created, since GGG nerfs defenses for years ever since 1.0 and onward.
so yes in order for GGG to stop us from instantly deleting their game they give them hp buffs, defensive buffs etc - all without addressing our need to instantly delete their game.
i've been saying this since 3.9 patch notes, and for years prior every single time GGG nerfs our defensive abilities
I'm the second guy (girl) tbh I was mostly surprised at how fast it went, tunnels are just shit to dash through no matter what. It's always a risk work torment spirits but even so 14k in an instant and with nothing much can do about it. I have mainly issues with the detonate dead etc set of skills because they are so iffy. It's really easy to die to that kind of effects because the skill is hidden/cast by enemies off screen/instant/etc and you can have a million layers of defense, it'll still one shot you.
Either way, I don't care much for reaching level 100 overall, but I do think there's not much point to the death penalty in the game atm. I can see how frustrating it might be to newer players especially.
Last edited by bluesylph on Jan 17, 2020, 11:09:29 PM
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Posted bybluesylphon Jan 17, 2020, 11:07:50 PM
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The current death penalty as it is now needs to go because it encourages players boring themselves to death instead of trying difficult content.
That doesn't mean I don't think there should be a death penalty. Just that it needs to become something else at this point.
One option would be for death in maps to turn off all your map portals, or Temple portals, or Safehouse portals - you get the idea. In Delve it could clear the node you were headed to (which is already sort of halfway the case).
The real endgame isn't XP. It's gear. Which is why I think the endgame penalty should be related to loot, not levelling.
Last edited by FramFramson on Jan 17, 2020, 11:18:57 PM
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Posted byFramFramsonon Jan 17, 2020, 11:17:35 PM
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The current death penalty as it is now needs to go because it encourages players boring themselves to death instead of trying difficult content.
That doesn't mean I don't think there should be a death penalty. Just that it needs to become something else at this point.
One option would be for death in maps to turn off all your map portals, or Temple portals, or Safehouse portals - you get the idea. In Delve it could clear the node you were headed to (which is already sort of halfway the case).
The real endgame isn't XP. It's gear. Which is why I think the endgame penalty should be related to loot, not levelling.
I really like your idea. It could be something like passing level 97, if the player dies on a map, he cannot enter the same map again (closing the instance, automatically). The map is lost and the invested in it to try better experience and drop is also lost, instead of losing experience and angering the players who have the audacity to try to reach the end of the road (lvl 100).
Bethesda is known for having good ideas and terrible realization of them. GGG is a Bethesda subsidiary or what?
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Posted byActkqkon Jan 17, 2020, 11:48:56 PM
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I agree completely with the OP. I think that GGG absolutely was on the right track with bumping up the resistances of the mobs in 3.9. The game feels much better because of that. If they can somehow fix the 1-shots it will be a wonderful thing (but still keep the content difficult). This is one of the rare parts of Diablo 3 that is better than POE. Pretty much every death in high greater rifts in D3 you know you screwed up. Not so in POE.
Regarding the death penalty.....yes, if GGG is unable or unwilling to stop the bogus 1 shots the death penalty should be lowered (not eliminated).
Last edited by MrWonderful99 on Jan 17, 2020, 11:57:48 PM
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Posted byMrWonderful99on Jan 17, 2020, 11:56:25 PM
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