to me social welfare is worst thing everr

Imagine you get a house, food and other services for doing nothing. Less you do more you get. Thats the facts in western society nowadays

reward losers and underachievers while penalize producers.

Doesn't that seems counter intuitive???

Anthropologically seems retarded in so far as advancement of human species. IMO if you have like 160 IQ you should get 160K per child. If you make a million should be tax free.

Thoughts?

worst thing ever? ok I raise you this death camp with jews that are gased to death and slavery....

I think the argument could be made that the slavery of the southern United States in the 18th century was a form of social welfare program. One social group had the fruits of their labor taken from them by force; another group reaped the benefits without producing themselves.

But still, the very worst things ever were based not on parasitism, but on pure mass death; the former has at least the respect to wish its hosts to survive, while the latter abandons even that.

Welfare is basically a bribe. The state bribes the poor with welfare so the poor don't become criminals. This results in an increase of quality of life for pretty much everyone.

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

I think the argument could be made that the slavery of the southern United States in the 18th century was a form of social welfare program. One social group had the fruits of their labor taken from them by force; another group reaped the benefits without producing themselves.

But still, the very worst things ever were based not on parasitism, but on pure mass death; the former has at least the respect to wish its hosts to survive, while the latter abandons even that.

you know what... I remove slavery because we can build a fuck ton of cool things out of slavery such as Pyramids

I guess only death camps are bad

If automation can provide food, shelter, and all the bare necessities for everyone, I see no reason not to provide those things to people that need them. I would consider a social class of non-achievers to be a necessary evil -- better they sit at home and play Xbox and eat government cheese than spend their days fucking up everything around them and being less happy in the process.

There will still be scarcity, trade, and opportunities for people to excel in such a world. Not everyone can live in the biggest houses or fanciest toys or have the most prestigious jobs.

I don't think we're post-scarcity even with the technology we have right now, though, and it's probably in our best interest to work on getting there ASAP rather than trying to implement systems that rely on it before it exists.

Currency is a prerequisite for civilization.

I can imagine a future where food is as plentiful as potable water is today (in the first world) and food-dispensing "replicators" like water fountains, perhaps not strictly speaking free but practically so, as a gesture of common courtesy and expected cost of doing business.

You'd need to be living under a rock not to be able to imagine a world without physical currency tokens, where one's wealth is stored not in one's pocket but as data stored in a centralized location, often far away, along with that of millions of other people.

But the only way a society can eschew currency altogether is to completely abandon the notion of "to each according to their ability." The point of currency isn't that you buy stuff with it, the point is that it is the reward given for work done for someone else's benefit. Even the Roddenberry moneyless system has at least one currency: rank, the promotion in social stature of the best workers over the others. The Federation is not without inequality of outcome.

The reason why you can't imagine a society without currency is because such a situation is full communism, a situation so untenable that its existence is impossible. People are so inclined to fashion currencies for trading labor that only a dedicated ideological crusade against money can overcome it. Those who have pursued such things have broken the principle of economic specialization, and thus their civilization, in the attempt.

Doesn't affect me... I stay a way from living in section 8 housing and poverty areas. Which by the way is not everywhere. As long as a child has a house over their head that's what's important. Unfortunately I've seen the horrors of adults taking advantage of the system. But statistically those that take advantage are a very small percentage.

I volunteer my time at boys and girls club and YMCA coaching youths and providing food to them. Many of the kids I coach come from very dramatic lives and mostly are in families that need welfare.

To put it in perspective I'm the type of person that is happy with what I have and donate what I don't need. Unfortunately the average mindset of a human being is "why should I help those in need?" Another mindset is "I work hard for my money why should I share it."

'What these people don't realize, the roadways, much of the architecture much of the way we live is because of a blue collar worker that's on welfare. Welfare based on income, you think people make enough to support their family building the roads you drive on? Absolutely not...

I have little patience for adults but I refuse to see a child suffer because someone that's on welfare seems lazy... Who cares as long as that child is being fed.

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diablofdb wrote:

you know what... I remove slavery because we can build a fuck ton of cool things out of slavery such as Pyramids

They weren't build by slaves.