Life base gear like ES

"

DarkWap wrote:
I play both life and es builds

es cannot take acrobatics, good luck getting block, you'll always get stunned-frozen-shocked-burned, you won't leech nor regen if you don't invest in it and life get 12hp each lvl, so what?

edit: saying an helm can have 750es makes your argument invalid

i take block as a es bv pathfinder its called a rumi flask, only takes one form of stun mitigation to solve that problem be it valyrium or skyforth if using stone of lazhwar.

"

Fhark wrote:

"

DarkWap wrote:
I play both life and es builds

es cannot take acrobatics, good luck getting block, you'll always get stunned-frozen-shocked-burned, you won't leech nor regen if you don't invest in it and life get 12hp each lvl, so what?

edit: saying an helm can have 750es makes your argument invalid

i take block as a es bv pathfinder its called a rumi flask, only takes one form of stun mitigation to solve that problem be it valyrium or skyforth if using stone of lazhwar.

you're playing the most broken build atm.. and rumi is not "block" if you can't keep it up forever.
stun is not a great problem but you have to invest to mitigate it while life builds can deal with it by themselves

edit: remove vaal pact or your legacy vinktar and go to facetank the shaper or every t14+ map boss. remember to make a video because I'd like to see how they'll totally destroy you

"

Kaz2ndChance wrote:

-Armour (life) builds can't take acro either (only evasion can).
-Frozen? heat flask, check.
-Shocked and burned? both builds have equal chance of getting shocked and burned, but dousing and grounding flask, check.
-Stunned? Most ES builds are ranged (they already more easily avoid stuns), and they can take Practical Application and Nimbleness for a 70% chance to avoid stuns while casting. Cyclone builds are immune to stuns. They can use uniques like Skyforth boots and Eye of Chayula.

Looks like OP's not the only one with invalid points.

- es cannot take acro, it doesn't matter if armour, eva or pure es based
- frozen, shocked and burned.. the flask is not an answer because that's an investment while life builds don't need it (shock and burn work like frozen so es and life builds haven't equal chance of getting ele staus aliments)
- stun is the same, you need investment.

on top of that life builds have mind over matter too, which doesn't work with es

the defence of CI builds is the big hp pool, that's all they have, removing it is like removing dodge from acrobatics. CI chars have to invest in a lot of things which life chars have on their own.
the only problem here is the instant leech, build a CI without vaal pact and let's see how much broken it is

lol it's funny you talk about investment when most life builds have to invest most of their passive points into pretty much all available life nodes + life wheel just to feel tanky enough to not die in maps. This is not even talking about gears. Life builds need to worry about 3 good prefix rolls while ES only 2. ES can also reserve life to get more auras (more resist, etc). And of course it goes without saying CI builds don't need to worry about chaos res at all.

also, it turns out shock duration is based on %maximum life and therefore tends to have longer duration against ES/CI builds (so my bad there). Ignite duration, however, is always 4s. This is all still solvable with flask usage. You call it investment, but what else are you going to use for flask? It's what they're used for...very little investment.

I don't get how MoM matters as it is based on mana not life or ES. Seems like you and I need to get our facts straight before saying any more incoherent things.

"

Kaz2ndChance wrote:

lol it's funny you talk about investment when most life builds have to invest most of their passive points into pretty much all available life nodes + life wheel just to feel tanky enough to not die in maps. This is not even talking about gears. Life builds need to worry about 3 good prefix rolls while ES only 2. ES can also reserve life to get more auras (more resist, etc).

also, it turns out shock duration is based on %maximum life and therefore tends to have longer duration against ES/CI builds (so my bad there). Ignite duration, however, is always 4s. This is all still solvable with flask usage. You call it investment, but what else are you going to use for flask? It's what they're used for...very little investment.

I don't get how MoM matters as it is based on mana not life or ES. Seems like you and I need to get our facts straight before saying any more incoherent things.

CI builds can't reserve life and they need discipline so they have less room for auras than life builds (low life builds are totally different and they'll never reach 10k es unless godly gear).
MoM is based on mana, ofc, but it works only when you get hit on life, not es.
About ignite you're right, it doesn't check max life (while frozen and shock do it).
Life builds need to worry about 1 prefix (life) while es builds need 2 good prefix (if not 3).
If you build life and you go full retard on life nodes you're doing it wrong, you'll never compete with the hp pool of a CI build (it's like saying I wanna dodge like an acro char without getting acro). try to invest those points in other form of defence and it will be fine.

my most tanky build is a life based one, just saying

"

DarkWap wrote:

Life builds need to worry about 1 prefix (life) while es builds need 2 good prefix (if not 3).

3 prefixes: life, %armour/eva, and flat armour/eva

ES builds: %ES and flat ES

in fact, if you count the hybrid prefix: armour/eva/ES + stun recovery, life builds will have to choose 3 out of the 4 available prefix, while ES builds can maximize ES no problem.

by the way, I am not saying that life builds suddenly became more squishy. It's just that the content became harder, bosses hit harder, and there is an imbalance between the effectiveness of life vs ES, not just in terms of tanky-ness but also DPS, efficiency, survivability, etc. If your life build is not built to tank, it will be very squishy.

Darkwap everybody knows bv is broken, doesnt stop a lot of es builds using block and often rumis. Stun mitigation is easy now with a 10 chaos ring and getting some extra cold res.
This whole post is about the advantage es has over life at the moment which is pretty huge.

"

DarkWap wrote:

I play both life and es builds

es cannot take acrobatics, good luck getting block, you'll always get stunned-frozen-shocked-burned, you won't leech nor regen if you don't invest in it and life get 12hp each lvl, so what?

edit: saying an helm can have 750es makes your argument invalid

ES can easily get block. Play Pathfinder or Necromancer, and enjoy near-permanent block (and spell block, if needed) cap.
ES does NOT need acrobatics, because he can use Block instead. And if he uses Vinktar, he doesnt need block cap too.
There is a plenty of ways to get rid of stun/freeze/shock. Many life builds have to get some sort of stun, freeze and shock protection, cause you know, having 6k HP pool doesnt make you immune to that shit, not even close.
Burn chance and duration is irrelevant to your HP pool.
ES build need to get keystone for leech & regen, but with much higher ES pool, he can afford it.

"

DarkWap wrote:

and life get 12hp each lvl

Even at lvl100, ES pool is 2 times larger than life. So, you should say "life loses 12 hp each level before 100", so if you have lower than 100 level, your life build is even more weak than ES one.

"

Kaz2ndChance wrote:

3 prefixes: life, %armour/eva, and flat armour/eva

No, they care about 1 prefix only: life. MoM builds care about 2 prefixes: life and mana. %armour/eva and flat armour/eva are useless for most life builds (exceptions - QotF and AA users, mostly).

Life based is a joke.

Since when do melee chars run MoM
I dont ever use MoM because i have 0 mana from using auras most of the time or so close to that MoM wouldnt matter anyways

I think life based char mostly just care about the highest life mod on an item and if it has that then armor & str since str adds life also... at least for me i dont want a low armor high life item at all myself

I also think ES is better then life i just dont like ES better then life myself as there are some drawbacks to it that i dont like