if you dont build around reflect... u will die

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LowBudget780 wrote:

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MonstaMunch wrote:

Sorry I'm late to the discussion and not going to read all 13 pages but my 2c;

Reflect is a great mechanic, it requires you to pay attention to what's going on, prevents you from just going all out glass cannon, and rewards people who have experience in dealing with it.

I don't understand why people are still crying now that its been completely removed from all compulsory content. I wish they would bring it back exactly as it was, an affix that you find all the time on rare mobs as you wonder around.

#MakeReflectGreatAgain

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secret_service86 wrote:

so people are saying you cant run reflect as ranger, is that really true?

cant you somehow go chaos pathfinder and use flasks?

voltaxic rift and stuff and somehow convert all damage to chaos?

if anyone knows how to do this or a guide let me know please, thanks!

Lots of options:

- Split some of your damage between ele and phys using the multitude of conversion options that are available.

- Don't aoe spam big mobs, kite them off into smaller groups.

- If you have an ele build, overcap res for whatever element you deal most of

- Enfeeble everything that has reflect (unless you're using Lioneye's Glare, then it's kind of a waste of time)

- If you're phys, keep a granite and basalt up whenever you can.

- Use flasks to convert your damage to chaos

- VP

There are probably a bunch of other options, and you certainly don't need to take all of them, just a couple. Reflect isn't a surprise anymore, you know roughly when you're going to encounter it, so there's no excuse not to be prepared.

I can't really write a detailed response to this atm because I'm using my phone but I just want to point out that these options are ridiculous.

well, can either of you guys show me how to convert 100% of my damage to chaos as a pathfinder ranger using tornado shot? would be very appreciated! thanks, like just point me to a guide or something :D

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secret_service86 wrote:

well, can either of you guys show me how to convert 100% of my damage to chaos as a pathfinder ranger using tornado shot? would be very appreciated! thanks, like just point me to a guide or something :D

Why on earth would you want to do that? I play almost exclusively bow builds and I haven't died to reflect this season. I don't even get how it's possible to die to reflect as a bow user anymore -.- (that's with a glass canon build that has enough damage to nuke Guardians / Uber Atziri / Shaper).

There are plenty of options.
Split your damage.
Get some evasion (Use arrow dancer).
Dodge (+Vaal Grace).
Get Vinctar + VP.
Get +max elemental resist from flasks / flask effect. (Dying Sun, Vinctar, Taste of Hate are all solid options that brings more than just survivability vs. reflect).
If you are mainly going physical use Taste of Hate / Basalt / Jade (if CI)
Avoid the 50% more multiplier from Point Blank by getting a bit of distance OR use the Point Blank node to lower dmg vs. trash mob to avoid reflect damage and utilize it to nuke bosses / tougher mobs.

Reflect is not hard to deal with as a bow user. There are so many options. A bit harder with other builds out there but bow users have it easy.

Reflect should be changed to work like Armour does. Higher the hit, less the reflected damage.

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logosys wrote:

Reflect should be changed to work like Armour does. Higher the hit, less the reflected damage.

Dafuq? Reflect exists to stop knowledgeless scrubs just copying generic glass cannon guides and mindlessly cruising through end game content without understanding what they are doing. Making it apply to everyone except them would completely defeat the point.

This game shouldn't just be about stacking the highest damage numbers you can and facerolling anything that moves, and right now reflect is one of very few things that stand in the way of it becoming exactly that.

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Frankenberry wrote:

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secret_service86 wrote:

well, can either of you guys show me how to convert 100% of my damage to chaos as a pathfinder ranger using tornado shot? would be very appreciated! thanks, like just point me to a guide or something :D

Get Vinctar + VP.

A shit solution that unfortunately completely negates any type of reflect issues. I can't wait for them to address this and hopefully change the meta up a bit.

I mean with double vinktars (or legacy vinktars) you can run ele reflect maps on an ele build :\

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logosys wrote:

Reflect should be changed to work like Armour does. Higher the hit, less the reflected damage.

ummm what?

So if I tap something with a stick, I'm going to take my full damage as reflect but if you nuke something then you brush it off... whats the point of reflect then?

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MonstaMunch wrote:

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logosys wrote:

Reflect should be changed to work like Armour does. Higher the hit, less the reflected damage.

Dafuq? Reflect exists to stop knowledgeless scrubs just copying generic glass cannon guides and mindlessly cruising through end game content without understanding what they are doing. Making it apply to everyone except them would completely defeat the point.

This game shouldn't just be about stacking the highest damage numbers you can and facerolling anything that moves, and right now reflect is one of very few things that stand in the way of it becoming exactly that.

No, it doesn't exist for purpose you stated. At least it doesn't look like that to me.

For example, take a look at map elemental reflect mod: 13% for low tier maps, 15% for mid tier maps, 18% for high tier maps.

If this reflect mod was made to "tone down DPS", its percentage would be in reversed order, to reflect the fact that you need more DPS to play mid tier map, than you need for low tier map etc. Otherwise it doesn't make much sense as “tone down DPS” mechanism.

But main issue of reflect for those complaining about it (excluding knowledge-less scrubs), is that it favors low Hit damage/high ApS builds, while high Hit damage/low ApS builds suffers way more due to less time to recover from reflected hit and lower effect of secondary defenses (e.g. block, dodge, etc.). This is issue I'd like to see fixed. Builds with equal DPS should suffer in equal way and not favor one play style over another.

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e1337donkey wrote:

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logosys wrote:

Reflect should be changed to work like Armour does. Higher the hit, less the reflected damage.

ummm what?

So if I tap something with a stick, I'm going to take my full damage as reflect but if you nuke something then you brush it off... whats the point of reflect then?

I'd like to know that too... “what's the point of reflect?” :)
Read my reply to MonstaMunch for more details about the issue I'd like to be addressed.

I don't think reflect is the problem, the issue is with the general pacing of the game. Currently it's all about speed, people expect to destroy packs and yellow mobs in seconds, and melting map bosses just a little bit slower than that. Hence, any mechanic that, in theory, would force the player to be more careful or switch his gear around, in poe is viewed as a nuisance, and not something that is suppoused to vary up the encounters.

I have started playing this game some time ago, I don't know what was the version, but it was before dominus and labyrinth. I didn't make it far, since I played without any guides on hardcore solo (don't ask why), and stopped playing around cruel. I did not reach endgame like this time around, so I may be completely wrong, but the game back then felt a lot slower, and all encounters had, I don't know, more weight in them. I remember how scared I was when I saw Koyle and thought "oh crap it's Brutus again!". Currently, with a viable build, I am just destroying everything in full brain afk mode, dying occasionally just because I couldn't be bothered to even pay attention to what is happening on the screen. It is all about speed and killing everything the fastest way possible, and any obstacles like reflect or volatiles feel like you are participating in a drag race, and then somebody decides to throw some random garbage on the perfectly straight road to "spice things up". Of course you would be pissed off. This game is not a rally anymore, but a drag race.

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ClickHitBoom wrote:

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Frankenberry wrote:

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secret_service86 wrote:

well, can either of you guys show me how to convert 100% of my damage to chaos as a pathfinder ranger using tornado shot? would be very appreciated! thanks, like just point me to a guide or something :D

Get Vinctar + VP.

A shit solution that unfortunately completely negates any type of reflect issues. I can't wait for them to address this and hopefully change the meta up a bit.

I mean with double vinktars (or legacy vinktars) you can run ele reflect maps on an ele build :\

That might be but the real important question is: does it work? (the answer is yes). Also I listed 6 other options for our Ranger in need so he can choose another way of dealing with it if he doesn't want VP + vinktar.