why poe is so hard?

I understood that P2W is only good for devs not for players,and when ARPG-s really depend on core players i now understood they dont want risk this with some casuals who just join and leave(maybe like me:P), but then i just dont understand the death penalty( why necessary plz explain and i sleep well tonight:D), and the trading system(why they not make"marketplaces" where ppl can make stands with their items when they online, and ppls need find the items like a in real marketplace(KnightO - in this game it is totaly works)

Like now i want to sell my good rares and all my uniqs what are overflooded my stash, in trading chat the spam is real, nothing for 15-20 min(Im bored for spamming and then i decided to go maps) I want find a map partner and in the Noticeboard is like a big bad mess, with all the traders want to sell their goods, nothing like:exp docks or maps 66-68 looking for party.
I ask- is this good, not need to change?

Edit- i have a forum post with the items but nobody writed anything(1 day post- maybe need some time?)

Death penalty is there for a bunch of reasons, most of them trivial but it adds up:
- It serves as a sort of lategame viability measure, it tells you if your char is good or not, if you can go past level 90 and still gain experience it means your build works.
- It also prevents zerging when playing solo, otherwise you'd just crash yourself against the boss until it gives way or you spend all portals. With experience penalty in effect you need to weigh risk and potential gain, it puts a wee bit of hardcore thinking in your softcore, I suppose.
- It doesn't do to feel overly immortal, it gives people ideas.
- Also, it's tradition. Sacred 2 had a 'survival bonus' system which was a bit unorthodox and would probably work well here, maybe we will get something similar one day, it shouldn't be a problem to pull off.

...

If you're trying to sell stuff in standard, that's a tough one, the demand isn't high. I recommend doing your farming and trading in 4-month challenge leagues. Here are some general tips, though I'm no expert in the subject.
- Make sure what you got is worth buying, if it's too common you will sell it only by dumb luck and some things are nigh impossible to sell. For instance, nothing from your thread is really worth selling, everyone has a few pairs of each unique sitting in stash or just vendors them instantly. Rares are pretty much vendor fodder, if you wouldn't want to use it don't think anyone will want to buy it, that's a good rule of thumb when it comes to rares.
- List buyouts for each item or the whole group, you can do this by using some popular tools or by hand if you don't have a big shop to maintain. People don't like to make offers or ask for prices if they don't have to.
- Be online if you want to sell, you can expect people to contact you by PM or in thread only if you're selling some really rare/good stuff really cheap.
- Trade chat is nifty to use if you need some common stuff in challenge leagues like gems or uniques or to trade currency. It functions much better for buyers because there are people lurking there at all times, it's typically easy to get offers if you want to buy something but it's a lot harder to sell unless you got something that everybody needs, like echo gems at league start.

Yes, trade system is kinda clunky, but it ultimately works. Devs say a better trade system is in the works and should be ready before next major patch but it isn't certain. Anyway, you shouldn't expect a fully hands-off system, it will probably be something like public stash tabs and an indexer of items in them, you will still need to contact the person you want to buy from. According to devs, they are adamant about keeping a level of human interaction in trading instead of automating it.

Death penalty: I understood now , it's like a risk factor, but i think maybe it is too big for me. I try to improve my gear, and see how this is gonna help me.

Anyway the only "positive" in this system for me, that you can't level back. If this don't have im in like lvl 50 and sure I leaved the game at that point( I cleared many bosses with so many deaths in this way, in merc dominus I died like 30 times:D)


Trading: thank you for your post, I learned a lot from it! Now after readed a bit more how I can trade, I understood poe.trade working method, and I used to sell 3 of my uniques!(maybe too cheap, but it is something for me:D)
I try too make better "market" threads and see how this is gonna work.
Anyway thanks for all the great suggestions, I try to get used to the hard parts and see where it is goes!:D

4 month leagues trading: sounds interesting, but i want to stick with my main char for now, although thank you for the great tips!

I don't understand why there are people that can't let people that want a hard game have it. Always there are demands and complaints about X being too hard or the Death Penalty being too punishing.

I have played since shortly after the start of Open Beta or thereabouts. I rarely post and my highest character is an 81 CI summoner witch. Been stuck there for months :D
I have lost count of the xp I have lost to the death penalty. I don't consider my gear elite or myself an elite player. Just someone that wants a challenging game that isn't p2w.

if you find the game too hard, it's probably because it actually seems hard or you.
http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/549432
this might help you find the game a little less difficult.

I don't mean to be the one to bring the pessimistic attitude into these threads...but here we go.

Games are supposed to be challenging to encourage you to play more. That is why flappy bird exploded in popularity, because it seemed so simple but was extremely challenging...

PoE is a very challenging game which caters to individuals who are willing to learn from their mistakes and grow upon them. I am still a very new player, but I've learned so much within a month.

Also, there is no one keeping you here? If you believe this game is too challenging for you then please move on IF you do not want to put forth effort to become better at this game.

You can prevent deaths by playing smart. You can recognize better drops by understanding what is good on certain items. And you can increase your DPS by understanding perfect link combinations and combining it with currency you made by selling good drops.

TL;DR : Leave if this game is too hard for you. But if you are having fun and want to stay, read the wiki and put forth effort to learn!

There are a lot of wrong assumptions being made in this thread. I'm not picking on anybody, just making points. I'm not complaining either.

"

I don't understand why there are people that can't let people that want a hard game have it.

So the forum is supposed to be one-sided? Only people who want the game to be more difficult are allowed to voice their opinion and provide feedback to the devs? I can just as easily change one word in your quote.

"I don't understand why there are people that can't let people that want an easier game have it."

What's the difference? None. I don't agree with either version. But both sides should have a say. GGG will make the final decisions on how to run their business, and that's the way it should be. But GGG also NEEDS feedback from a variety of players. From my experience with games, this game is like most others, with the majority of feedback coming from the hard core players. With almost none at all coming from players who simply quit playing and disappeared.

"

if you find the game too hard, it's probably because it actually seems hard or you.
http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/549432

That's a very wrong assumption. Just because someone thinks the game is too hard doesn't mean they are new players or don't know anything about the game.

Similarly....

"

It serves as a sort of lategame viability measure, it tells you if your char is good or not, if you can go past level 90 and still gain experience it means your build works.

I agree. But the reverse is not true. If someone has a hard time getting to higher levels, it does not mean their build or gear is bad.

"

Games are supposed to be challenging to encourage you to play more.

From a business point of view, I agree that most games have to be challenging to attract and retain players. The huge problem is defining what challenging means. It will mean very different things to different people. It's a difficult balancing act for the devs. But in order to create that balance they need feedback from players at all levels, not just from hard core gamers.

Sure, GGG can make a niche market game for the hardest of hard core players. But for most game companies, genre specific games and niche games are distant history. Virtually all games in the last 20-25 years are compromises and a blend game genres. They are compromises because they want to appeal to a larger player base to make money. To me, Action RPG is an oxymoron. An action game and an RPG are almost opposite types of games. Virtually all games any more are a blend. That's just gaming reality. I didn't like it 20 years ago and I still don't like it. But if I'm going to play games I just have to accept it. Everyone else has to accept it too.

It's 100% a business decision by GGG. But as far as feedback in the forums, the opinion of people who think it's too hard is just as valid as the people who think it's not hard enough. I completely agree that if people don't like the game they can quit playing. But whether they stay or leave, their feedback is valid. Same could be said for any other opinions in the forums. The reason why people quit is probably just as important, or more important, than the reason why people stay.

pretty sure game is intented to be harder in 2.0 so if you find the game challenging right now, prepare yourself for a nightmare :)

( on my side I find the game too easy globally , but if you wan't to make it very hard with insane map mods, you can ... The question is : is it really rewarding ? )

Think of the difficulty as some sort of natural repellent against casuals.

"

Ryan80053 wrote:

Games are supposed to be challenging to encourage you to play more. That is why flappy bird exploded in popularity, because it seemed so simple but was extremely challenging...

I'd say PoE is quite the opposite from flappy bird :)
When you see flappy bird you go 'oh, this looks simple enough, I don't see why people make such a fuss of it, lemme try', and after you fail a first few times you go 'shit, just wait 'till I get serious', and done, you're hooked.

PoE, on the other hand, looks much harder than it actually is, your success in it entirely depends on your ability to distill the game into basics, which takes time. Those with short attention span usually get overwhelmed and give up, some return to give it another shot and some don't, that's why PoE can never have such a huge burst in popularity, it kinda sifts in. And it's also another reason for abstaining from P2W, when he sees a good build in action, a reluctant newcomer would be all too quick to write it off to cash advantage and think that playing the game on that level is impossible without real money investment.

So, whenever you see someone that makes the game look easy, remember that he knows no big secrets and rarely possesses above average skills, he just went at it longer than you.

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harddaysnight wrote:

"

It serves as a sort of lategame viability measure, it tells you if your char is good or not, if you can go past level 90 and still gain experience it means your build works.

I agree. But the reverse is not true. If someone has a hard time getting to higher levels, it does not mean their build or gear is bad.

Oh, I agree, there was once a HC player that died because his cat was choking on a fish bone, but it's usually one of the four:
- unfocused passive tree
- poor gem setup
- unsuitable gear
- unworkable concept
For newcomers, first and the last one are the most dangerous because they're the hardest to fix but it's often the mix of all four and that's when the game feels the hardest. You can often see just the last one at work when an experienced player is testing some build, all the pieces are in place but it won't really flow, death penalty can stop him from claiming it works even if he's very stubborn about it :)