Chin Sol + Point Blank + Burning Arrow (AoE) + Puncture (Single Target) FEEDBACK PLEASE

Hello friends,
I would highly appreciate some feedback on the following build I have recently theorycrafted...

The IDEA:
After noticing the power of the Elemental Buzzsaw build, I figured the core idea should not be limited to Spectral Throw. The main concept of the Buzzsaw build is to spec into a majority of the aura passives as well as the Inner Force cluster, which increases the effect of the Anger, Wrath, and Haste auras by 94% in total. By building into these passives, we are essentially doubling the effect of our auras and increasing the damage output of our elemental attacks to a high degree. Imagine this high degree of damage being further amplified by the Trap and Remote Mine support gems, which each increase a MORE damage modifier when leveled. Now, imagine that degree of damage amplified even further by using the Chin Sol unique bow, which adds 100% MORE damage at close range, along with the Point Blank passive, which adds another 50% MORE damage at close range. Let's not stop there and remember the good old Physical Projectile Attack Damage gem, which adds yet another 49% MORE damage modifier at level 20. Now, let's do the math here and add each of these MORE damage modifiers together...

The MATH:
Chin Sol = 100% MORE
Point Blank = 50% MORE
Trap (lvl 20) = 34% MORE
Remote Mine (lvl 20) = 49% MORE
Physical Projectile Attack Damage (lvl 20) = 49% MORE

100+50+34+49+49 = 282% MORE damage output with this combination!!!

The IDEA Continued:
When using traps and mines, the range of the attack or cast is calculated from the location of the triggered trap/mine, not from the location of the player. Using traps and mines is perfect with Chin Sol and Point Blank because their required close range benefits can always be met while the player is safely at a distance. Reflect is also no issue when using traps or mines because the damage is never reflected back to the player, only to the trap/mine itself. Now, which attacks would be best suited for this setup? Take a look at my gem selection below...

The GEMS:
The gem selection is in order from most to least importance...

[Chest] Burning Arrow - Trap - Chance to Ignite - Elemental Proliferation - Increased Area of Effect - Weapon Elemental Damage

[Weapon] Puncture - Remote Mine - Trap - Physical Projectile Attack Damage - Increased Duration - ???

[Helm] Ice Nova - Trap - Increased Area of Effect - Elemental Weakness

[Gloves] Reduced Mana - Blood Magic - Clarity - Vulnerability

[Boots] Reduced Mana - Wrath - Anger - Grace

The IDEA Behind the Gem Selection:
The gem selection above is what I feel is best suited for a Chin Sol/Point Blank build setup...

[Burning Arrow]
The Burning Arrow attack is buffed by a doubled Anger/Wrath aura effect, a 184% MORE damage modifier total, a 49% MORE elemental damage modifier from the Weapon Elemental Damage gem, and a combination of the chosen weapon elemental, projectile and trap damage passives, which can be seen by clicking on the build's link below. By triggering ONE Burning Arrow Trap, a single target has a 69% chance to be ignited if both the Chance to Ignite and Burning Arrow gems are level 20. With Burning Arrow being buffed so drastically, each initial hit will be very high in damage, resulting in a powerful wide-ranged burning proliferation buffed further by various increased burning damage passives. Burn duration is also buffed considerably by quality gems. Oh yeah, let's not forget an Elemental Weakness curse and an Ice Nova Trap used to apply Elemental Equilibrium to everything right before Burning Arrow proliferates these powerful burns/shock-stacks (from Wrath) to the entire screen...

[Puncture]
The Puncture attack is buffed by a doubled Anger/Wrath aura effect, a 282% MORE damage modifier total, and a combination of the chosen weapon elemental, projectile and trap damage passives. By triggering a Puncture Trap, the target is immediately applied a stationary bleed debuff and knocked back by the Chin Sol unique bow, which in turn applies an even higher damaging mobile bleed debuff. As long as the target is mobile, it is bleeding away health at 145% of the initial damage dealt by Puncture over four seconds. Gem quality will increase this duration. Knockback is always applied to targets when using the Chin Sol unique bow to attack, resulting in constant mobile bleed damage from Puncture to even stationary targets. Using the Vulnerability curse, we increase not only the initial damage of Puncture, but also the damage over time from the bleed debuff, so this curse will always be the best choice for Puncture's single target damage. With this setup Puncture will be extremely powerful...

[Auras]
We run the Wrath, Anger, Grace, and Clarity auras in this build. Each aura is linked with the Reduced Mana gem, while Clarity, due to various mana reservation passives, can be linked to the Blood Magic gem with no significant penalty to our health pool. Each aura gem can be leveled to 20, and each will have its effect essentially doubled due to various aura effect passives. That's right, DOUBLED. DOUBLE Wrath, DOUBLE Anger, DOUBLE Grace, and DOUBLE Clarity!!! DOUBLE! DOUBLE! DOUBLE! DOUBLE! With the Iron Reflexes passive and a doubled Grace aura effect, our physical damage reduction will be through the roof with the right gear, and mana shouldn't be an issue with a Clarity running at double its effectiveness...

The BUILD:
http://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAAAgIAm40ILu2DGY4AXtN-73p9de4O_roj9lb6u-Pv8PzFdEHEolpIZ6DdDaTClwaHdluvLYNKfU4qGYr7CZu19trDOhqPykpGK2-eTpuDCUZxtAzhiJMn6rodqhzcfrA8jn_G8XZbu1fJJ6kRlnBRKPpabXC72FTr7pitJDzZE7iTp1wvb6cIDH1JUZ2uEH8abBJpxp4ZhfPdFxwkqnF5NunjavrSZp4XL8AaZOeG0ZBVWfNV1iSwp4SsqoCkGjhyqew4fNlX4nflMokEsxRN8B8CcYM4ogDvfDwFn98ppQ==

The CONCLUSION:
This is all pure theorycrafting on my part. I have never built anything remotely close to this build. Please tell me what you think about it all in the comments below...

I think there are a couple of problems with your idea:

1. Remote mines and traps do not use arrow skills. If they do you have discovered something new.

2. Weapon skills from Chin Sol would not apply to trap or to the remote mine since these are local skills to the bow. Traps, mines, totems just use the skills linked to them and not local weapon skills.

3. You can apparently have a trap or mine throw a ranged attack totem - but the totem doesn't use bow skills unless they are global skills (so global crit probably yes - Chin Sol 100% damage no).

If you get to the point that you try some of these ideas out, I would be curious to hear if you have any success in any of your ideas.

I don't think #1 is true, as I've seen several arrow trap builds. You'll have to test how the rest of it interacts, though. Seems like a very point heavy build with not enough focus, but maybe all that could work. (Minus the trap/totem inside of a mine thing. They are nerfing that.)

"

Skywalkerfx wrote:

I think there are a couple of problems with your idea:

1. Remote mines and traps do not use arrow skills. If they do you have discovered something new.

2. Weapon skills from Chin Sol would not apply to trap or to the remote mine since these are local skills to the bow. Traps, mines, totems just use the skills linked to them and not local weapon skills.

3. You can apparently have a trap or mine throw a ranged attack totem - but the totem doesn't use bow skills unless they are global skills (so global crit probably yes - Chin Sol 100% damage no).

If you get to the point that you try some of these ideas out, I would be curious to hear if you have any success in any of your ideas.

Holy misinformation, man. A bow skill can most certainly be connected to a remote mine and trap. Detonate the the mine and you'd be left with a Puncture Trap on the ground. And when you have a bow skill used from a trap, it gets all mods as if you fired it from your bow with your ranged attack stats. So Chin Sol Point bonus and Point blank would work, and use the distance from Trap to target.

As to the OP - way too much going on to ever be really effective, and while you have a lot of multiplicatave things going on, it's also starting from a really crappy base - as well as all those elemental buffs being next to useless for a singular Puncture hit. And Burning Arrow does not do enough Fire damage to do any noticeable proliferated burn damage...despite it's name it's a physical skill that adds a little Fire Damage. You basically are throwing a bunch of single target traps...it'd be horrible slow to play.

The elemental damage passives are for Burning Arrow only, same with the elemental auras, they just happen to add a little damage to Puncture.

Let's talk Puncture for a second... Even on a subpar base, a 282% MORE damage modifier should more than make up for the lack of a good phys base. Chin Sol's base phys damage isn't a number 282% MORE damage can't fix, at least I don't think... When you add in Vulnerability, which buffs both the initial hit and damage over time debuff considerably, I believe we may have some great damage output even from Chin Sol's shitty base.

Now let's talk Burning Arrow... With a 184% MORE damage modifier, on top of 49% MORE elemental damage from the WED gem, on top of a doubled effect from both Wrath and Anger auras, on top of a group of targets being cursed with Elemental Weakness and debuffed EE with an Ice Nova Trap, AND a 69% chance to Ignite PER trap, it seems like any group of targets would burn to death instantly by the range-increased burning proliferation from Burning Arrow. Increased burning damage from the tree and from Burning Arrow itself adds up to 80%.

I tested bow traps for some time and here are some thoughts:
-remote mine sucks, it takes too long to set and release causing dps loss
-trap is very good
-chin sol can be funny in the beggining, but you will probably do much better with a 300+ pdps harbinger. consider criticals for this build
-i would recommend this combo: vaal burning arrow + GMP + WED + trap. This can wipe most rare packs in 78's. Loads of dmg and fast recharge
-i think you should consider critical firetrapper links. by this approach, increased critical damage + added fire would be better to wipe groups than your increased area + chance to ignite cuz non critical burning sucks. ele prolif got already amazing aoe. also, you can get 95% critical chance and spells can't. you win
-puncture trap is very good but you dont need increased duration. Added fire is much better and do crazy dot's too. consider wed for the sixth
-i've found this combo to be somewhat useful too: rain of arrows + trap + multiple traps + physical damage

you may also die a lot by lack of healing. It's easily fixed by using one actual attack, like rain of arrow + life leech and no trap in it but still will benefit from point blank

"

GenJTC wrote:

The elemental damage passives are for Burning Arrow only, same with the elemental auras, they just happen to add a little damage to Puncture.

Let's talk Puncture for a second... Even on a subpar base, a 282% MORE damage modifier should more than make up for the lack of a good phys base. Chin Sol's base phys damage isn't a number 282% MORE damage can't fix, at least I don't think... When you add in Vulnerability, which buffs both the initial hit and damage over time debuff considerably, I believe we may have some great damage output even from Chin Sol's shitty base.

Now let's talk Burning Arrow... With a 184% MORE damage modifier, on top of 49% MORE elemental damage from the WED gem, on top of a doubled effect from both Wrath and Anger auras, on top of a group of targets being cursed with Elemental Weakness and debuffed EE with an Ice Nova Trap, AND a 69% chance to Ignite PER trap, it seems like any group of targets would burn to death instantly by the range-increased burning proliferation from Burning Arrow. Increased burning damage from the tree and from Burning Arrow itself adds up to 80%.

The base Burning Arrow from the Low Damage Chin Sol has 100 parts physical, and 30 fire. All of that WED and Burning is from that small 30 part and Anger. If you wanna do it, do it, but I am telling you - that proliferated burn is going to be weak as hell.

Maybe stating the obvious here, but remember that your total damage output is a function of %Increased times 1+%More. Which is to say that 250% Increased and 0% More would give you identical results to 0% Increased and 250% More.

Looking to get solid More modifiers is a good idea, but they're generally harder to get than Increased modifiers, and doing the former at the expense of the latter won't actually yield any substantive benefit. You'll just have to do the math to optimize that equation.

Well, thank you guys very much for the feedback. I am quite new to making my own builds and can use all the help I can get. Each reply is much appreciated.

"

Asidra wrote:

Holy misinformation, man. A bow skill can most certainly be connected to a remote mine and trap. Detonate the the mine and you'd be left with a Puncture Trap on the ground. And when you have a bow skill used from a trap, it gets all mods as if you fired it from your bow with your ranged attack stats. So Chin Sol Point bonus and Point blank would work, and use the distance from Trap to target.

As to the OP - way too much going on to ever be really effective, and while you have a lot of multiplicatave things going on, it's also starting from a really crappy base - as well as all those elemental buffs being next to useless for a singular Puncture hit. And Burning Arrow does not do enough Fire damage to do any noticeable proliferated burn damage...despite it's name it's a physical skill that adds a little Fire Damage. You basically are throwing a bunch of single target traps...it'd be horrible slow to play.

Well excuse the misinformation. I should have caveated that I'm not a Trap specialist. Apparently you can use bow skills with a trap if you have a bow equipped (of course the exception I missed). Melee skills not allowed. Ah me ... I guess I'll never be a trapper - but I did start a discussion in a poor thread with no attention.