I don't want to have to recast my auras in every zone
UPDATE: Spent some of the morning talking to Jonathan about this - we're now confidant in getting the aura snapshotting fix in for 1.2.0, and we've fleshed out plans for the minion snapshotting fix some more as well.
"I'm not sure why you'd think auras are some form of bitset, particularly given that a character could have any number of different versions of the same aura with different levels, quality and supports. I'm afraid the only part of that code which remotely resembles anything in the game is that "class Player" exists as a class. I'm not saying this to be harsh or put you down, so I apologise if it comes off like that, but no, we don't have anything like that in the code, and your assumptions about how the code works are significantly off-base. "The part where you abstract all the actual problem away as "running a check" without defining any details of what that means. That part. "I already said in my post we could solve all aura snapshotting by preventing auras from ever transitioning between areas, but that the massive quality-of-life cost of that to all players was too much for the benefit. You're correct that we could solve it also by having all auras turn off any time you change your gear in any way (which happens a lot more than I suspect you reaslise). But that would be even worse for player QoL. The correct solution is not to remove everyone's auras all the time. It's to be able to replace them, on the fly, with up-to-date versions, in response to stat changes. That is, as I mentioned, technically challenging, for the reasons I explained. | |
Mark, you're fucking awesome. Your posts really make me feel like you guys care about this game and its players. Thank you for providing are far more information than you actually need to.
Also, I'm super glad that snapshotting might be fixed in 1.2.0! IGN: Korbad Last edited by korbad on May 1, 2014, 10:37:07 PM
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Feed me the tears of the snapshotting people. Mmmm...
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" You do realize I've shipped games on DS, PC, PS1, PS2, PS3, and Wii. Your credentials are what again?? No one is suggesting GGG are idiots. The point about posting code snippets is to get some insight into the issues that we haven't thought about and can't see because we don't know how the code works. It is called "opening a dialog" getting the dev's thought process. |
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" that dev pride. /forum/view-thread/869543 all my builds' compilation
Please PM me on forum to inform me if I won an auction. Thank you. | |
" Thanks for the info Mark. We understand that QoL also effects server load; are you able to share any stats on the percentage of people that use 1, 2, 3+ auras please? I only suggested the bitset for auras as an extremely light-weight fast-cached read check to minimize CPU/network load; obviously, as you said the, actual Player struct needs to do a few things: calculate total reduced mana and reduced mana reserved, # of mana used, # of health used (blood magic) based on the level & quality of the gem(s). We also understand that effectively you are looking to optimize the "on_player_stats_changed" / "on_player_items_changed" events to minimize calculating (and caching) all the costs & stats along the way without placing extra load upon the client/server. If there is only a small percentage of players using (many) auras then a small QoL hit may be acceptable; i.e. a linear algorithm. But without further stats, we as a community, can't give feedback. :-/ Personally I'll be sad to see aura snapshotting going away, but from a game design point of view, I can understand the (original) intention. |
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Will this upcoming change prevent RedMana 'snapshotting'? Basically if you cast two auras with RedMana and then remove the gem, will it uncast them both?
Kinda interested in if that's considered snapshotting in the devs eyes and if this fix would nix it even if it isn't. BreakingHearts/RhoaHood/BackAndVeryLate (Standard) | HushtailSweep/HushtailWeeps (Ancestor)
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" That is a form of snapshotting, yes. If it will be included in the same patch as the fix for aura snapshotting, I'd say it's likely. It depends wholly on how they decide to detect changes, but it is almost certainly going to fit the criteria, and, in any case, will eventually be fixed as it is still seen as a bug. | |
"The auras will no longer have blood magic, so they'll no longer reserve mana. Ideally, they'd switch to reserving mana, and fall off if they don't fit there because too much mana is already reserved. Actual behaviour may depend on the details of the solution, so they may just always fall off, to switch to mana and an arbitrary set of auras are removed (not necessarily those ones) until your mana reserves are back under 100% of mana (this is the default behaviour for overreserving). Last edited by Mark_GGG on May 1, 2014, 11:22:44 PM
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I hope that summoners will be relabanced to make up for snapping being removed. I have played with and without snapshotting, in both expensive and crap gear. Without Snapshotting 70+ maps will be almost impossible. High level spectres will either be unable to survive to deal damage, or summoners will be way to squishy to even attempt it and be instantly killed.
Please do not directly remove something that is seen as vital for most people without considering how it will change the way the class plays. I do not mind if snap shotting is removed, and I agree it makes a lot of types of summoners way to powerful. In saying this however, without some change to the class itself this will kill it as a viable mapping build. I have played a summoner since BETA. Ill do my best to see if I can play without it... however if I find I can't, ill be forced to take another break from the game until they are once again re balanced. IGN JimansNotSummoner
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