Best post i have read since i joined POE

This guy need a Medal if is his own text.

Thx to you i understand now many things.

Bye poe not my type


Posted by WeekendGamer:Most players read the development manifesto and newsletters and get their game design ideas from that. That's the only thing informing them about game design. You have to keep in mind though that these ideas are pretty unorthodox and when they work, they work great, but when they don't they are very destructive. They are really pushing their luck sometimes and if you can't contest these flawed ideas or see what's wrong with them, your toolbox to improve the game gets very narrow.

One buzzword that keeps on coming up is balance. The devs have great trouble balancing the game right now so people keep talking about balance. The devs are using damage formulas and mechanics that are intolerant of balance in the higher regions and cause one-shots. That's too hard edged of a mechanic to be a core mechanic in an ARPG, where you can't avoid taking damage.

One-shots are used in games that have either

A team structure:

Marvel vs Capcom 3, where you have multiple characters on a team (Touch of death combos)
Pokemon, again more characters to take over (It's super effective, OHKO attacks)
Dota 2, a 5 man game with respawns (Nyxnyx)

A point system:

Divekick (Game has only one-shots! 5 Point system.)
Marvel vs Capcom 3 (depends on tournament structure)
Danmaku games (5 Lives)

A way to avoid getting hits by perfect play, AKA a very controlled environment, Hack n slash:

Devil may Cry 3
Dark Souls
etc

The latter applies to some of the boss fights in POE, like the Vaal Oversoul, and that is a well designed fight, mainly because it is very controlled. Nobody complains about that. But POE is not a hack and slash.

The interface, the netcode and the engine don't support that kind of gameplay natively. You'd need frametables, a close third person camera, complex enemy AI, gamepad support, audible tells, a netcode and server system right from the mount of olympus if it were online only.

POE is an ARPG. In an ARPG your playstyle is designed around taking hits, you will take hits, you can't avoid taking hits and you gear up for that.
In an ARPG you lose life constantly and regain it just as fast. It's not a big deal.
All your defenses are passive and you regain life quickly, so taking hits ok.
The genre teaches you from the beginning, getting hit is fine.

Which is unlike a hack and slash where as long as you stay out of trouble, you are completely fine every time. All your defensives are active. You are always in an advantageous position if you actively pursue your safety. If you play perfectly you will never get hit. Thats the main rule you are being taught in Dark Souls. You are never going to facetank so don't even get used to it. Stop getting hit.
If you attack, do it from a distance. If you fight melee, do it reactively and proactively.
Evade every hit or get your shield up.
Passive defenses like life are only there as a margin of error. If you get hit, it's because you're making mistakes. So these are games with a skill requirement. Every hit is earned. Your stamina is very important because your defensive is active, you have to evade everything manually and that costs stamina.
Yes, You have life but don't count on it as a defense. It's a signalling margin.
If you lose life that's always a bad sign.


In one case signal A means "You're fine", in the other case signal A means "You gonna RIP"

The main idea behind POE seems to be that elements of the HnS are being included so that player plays an ARPG like a hack and slash. But these elements are intermixed and not separated.

That means one of the strongest signalling devices the player has to evaluate danger is useless if you mix up the two kinds of gameplay. How is a player supposed to know that the gameplay switches from A to B, here?

In each genre taken separate, the signal is absolutely clear and reliable.
Not so taken together.

When the player hits half health he might still think hes fine, because he's playing an RPG.
But the gameplay changed and hes dead the next second.

Mix that with an unusual damage formula and you are begging for trouble. The player is incapable of evaluating his position in POE.

So you have boring, paranoid gameplay where nothing happens, and leisurely content where you get one-shot out of nowhere. And that's the norm. That's really nothing I would use in a sales pitch. I don't think it would go over well.

Design problem. Not balance problem.

People here take great pride in bearing design flaws like this because it's flattering to them. They think it's difficult and skillful, it makes them hardcore to put up with shit like that. There are more ways to make a game difficult than there are variables in a game. Just being difficult is not a quality. And fake difficulty doesn't make the game more challenging.

It's not fun and most people leaving have some sort of feeling that something is off but can't quite put their finger on it or can't put their thoughts into words. They know that it's broken but because everything is according to the questionable design principles the game gets to keep marching on unaltered. It's kinda sad.

anyone want to broad stroke this?

"

GeorgAnatoly wrote:

anyone want to broad stroke this?

You have played a #Mixer.

You won a Mixer.

People even dont know what are they playng WTF.

They wanted to do a Diablo 2 clone but the clone is mutated in a Mixer?

Ah, I c. My D2 clone is TQIT.

The only thing limiting the ability to manually avoid dmg is desync. The design is fine imo, at no point should we be able to face roll end-game content and the design ensures that.

I dont see in the post any suggestion as to a different design that can effectively threaten players.

"

DonTrafalgarLaw wrote:

Bye poe not my type

Where have I have seen that before?

"

Charan wrote:

"

DonTrafalgarLaw wrote:

Bye poe not my type

Where have I have that before?

Surely not from him..oh wait

If Diablo 2 is shuted down and somone remake itwith new monter new skils every game from same tiype will die in a month.


Ah sory let me reconstruct.

GGG wather you do and you change wone get me back.Better?

I stick my time to mmos better and ceck poe forum just for curiosity and from tomorow i wont post anymore;happy?

This game is not worth the time.

Bye CharanJailemyr

Of course he responded...

Well, since it's not going anywhere, can we have a link to the original source by Weekend Gamer? I'd like to read that, not some mere quotation of it.