Is that a gun in your Pocket? PISTOLS
" Example of advanced technology in Wraeclast In the Scepter of God we see elevators, electrical wiring, and even an electrical force-field (located behind the spot were Dominus stands in the top floor of the Scepter) In the Crematorium, Piety tortures Tolmen on an electrical chair. This sort of machinery is based on inventions that all date back at the earliest to the 19th century by scientists like Michael Faraday, George Ohm, Thomas Edison, Nikola Tesla... ). The flintlock pistol dates back to the beginning of the 17th century. That is 200 years before practical applications of electricity were invented. And the case for flintlock pistols' existence in Wraeclast doesn't end with the technological advancement evident in the world. If you look at the Oriathian elements in Wraeclast (Oriath is to Wraeclast seems to be as Europe was to America/Australia at a certain period) 1- The plate armor of Oriathian Troops (blackguards) 2- the clothes worn by the Oriathian crowds in Descent Champions 3- The architecture of the Oriathian patio at the entrance of decent champion and the dungeon itself. 4- the style of the wraeclast's map drawing 5- the scion talks about a life of dances and suitors back in Oriath which bring to mind renaissance balls. All of these elements combined show that Wraeclast draws heavy inspiration from the late renaissance period as opposed to the medieval period. Now, before anyone goes there, I understand that the world of Wraeclast is different than Earth... But fantasy worlds are based, to a measure, in reality. Hence it requires no significant leap in logic to say that pistols would exist in Wraeclast. Now of course one could argue that gunpowder wasn't invented in Wraeclast or maybe there is no combustable gunpowder and there is no thaumaturgical or technological substitute that allows the creation of guns. But in a world that has electrical barriers, it seems a bit far fetched that they can't manage some sort of pistol! So yeah I guess you are right that one can't definitively say that matchlock or flintlock pistols exist in the world of Wraeclast without the devs making it canon, but all things considered it is a pretty safe bet. :) Last edited by mouhanad on May 8, 2014, 12:52:56 PM
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It's a bit more far fetched to assume someone would bother creating a gun with magic when they could instead use the magic. I could argue that all the inventions seen in Act 3 serve a purpose that wouldn't be solved through pure magic. I can't argue the same for a gun, which is using an explosion to propel a projectile... Why bother with the projectile when I could literally just explode them?
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" Yes, but YOU are using examples of a world where magic DOESN'T exist and applying that logical progression of technology on a world where is DOES. This is a key and fundamental change in how armaments / technology progress. There is no force to drive the existence of gunpowder weapons when they are so inferior to what can be accomplished ALREADY with magic. We aren't talking about the difference between the crossbow / longbow and the flintlock. We are talking about the difference between weapons of mass devastation and the earliest gunpowder weapons. " I'd say it is FAR from a safe bet. Actually, I'd say it is all but certain gunpowder weapons WOULDN'T exist. The technology and crafting capability manufactured in wraeclast is based of magic / thaumatergy. You can't just translate that into how technology and use of firearms progressed in our world, because it would be ENTIRELY different. Remember, this is a world where, for the past few hundred years ( at least ) bows have been capable of firing as fast as machine guns, dealing more damage than is capable of weapons that exist in 2014 in our world. Imagine a weapon like that existing in our world today, and then compare it to a flintlock...What person or company would continue to develop such an ineffective weapon? "I would have listened... I would have understood!" - Scion
Have you removed Asus ROG/GameFirst yet? |
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" he is tring to point out that is posible, if they find it usefull or not is another thing. and to be fair guns are nor diferent than a fire trap, both are mechanism designed to explode when a triger is activated, traps do it with a proximity trigger and guns would do it with a manual trigger. balance wise they could fit as a short-mid range weapon say: blunderbuss 2 handed, str based very low attack speed high crit chance above avg dmg inate atribute: point blank self found league fan
http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/324242/page/1 | |
" " Ah but by that strain of logic, no one would use melee weapons as they would be so inferior to spells. Except as we can see, even an elite regiment like the Blackguards rely mostly on sword and board. There can be several explanations for this: 1-Not everyone is equally attuned to the use of thaumaturgy. 2-People are attuned to casting thaumaturgy in different ways. This is evidenced by the skill tree. For example the same person may cast the same spell (barrage) using a wand and bow with similar stats but achieve different results based on his attunement to the channeling device. 3- Some people may not be able handle the use of thaumaturgical skills… this might explain why a character like Tarkleigh is all talk and no walk. Some may be adversely affected by their use like what happened to Merviel after wearing the thaumaturgical amulet that was gifted to her by Daresso. Some people may even be fatally allergic to thaumatergy! 4- Considering that Thaumatergy have been at the heart of multiple Cataclysmic events that brought down several civilizations, it is highly possible that there are political or religious sanctions regarding the use of thaumatergical skills. There might be a puritan movement for example that frowns upon the use of thaumaturgy or favors devices that consume less thaumatergical energy than others. Pistols for example may be based on pure combustable gunpowerder or alternatively utilize a mixture of conventional gunpowder and thaumatergical gems which would make it a more viable option based on personal attunement/beliefs. And just because certain thaumatergical channeling devices capable of shooting projectiles exist, such as bows and wand, that doesn’t preclude the creation of pistols because each channeling device has particular limitations. For example a wand can cast power siphon but a bow cannot. A bow on the other hand cast cast a poison arrow while a wand cannot. So unlike in this world, the driving force behind invention of pistols is not how to cast projectiles and which device is most efficient? The question, however, is what kind of thaumatergical skills this particular device may help me to channel? And does this device make a particular skill accessible to people to whom it previously weren't? So basically in the world of Wraeclast, Invention of pistols would stem from two needs: 1- To utilize skills that cannot be channeled by other means such as wands or bows. 2- To provide an alternative channeling device to people who are not thaumatergically attuned (or shun) existing devices such as bows and wands. On a sidenote, I think the level of depth we are discussing this, shows that the devs were really successful in creating an interesting universe. Kudos! Last edited by mouhanad on May 8, 2014, 6:53:28 PM
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have wires and electricity and machines which are very reminiscent of the pseudo-Victorian technology in Dishonered.
Just because the godlike endgame boss has these, doesn't mean they are widespread, or available for commercial use. I don't remember seeing those anywhere else, correct me if I'm wrong. Why the FUCK would dominus waste his evil machines on arming the populace (or even piety/the mainland's soldiers?) it just doesnt make any sense. HEY, you know the force is magic, and there's magic in the game, why don't we have JEDI or something? Because that's equally stupid and doesn't fit the feeling of the game, at all. VI |
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Also, who's going to mine all the metal/be producing the ammunition for EXILES?
Thought so. It makes 0 sense all around bro. VI |
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" Next time: Edit function. |
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" Ah, but is there really any need for the invention? There are weapons and battle gear hidden in every nook and cranny in Wraeclast. Since there seems to be no degradation of these weapons, any joe can saunter along and pick up a bow that is more effective than any gunpowder weapon that could be invented for decades. In fact, the older the item, the more powerful it seems to be. Sure those not able to channel thaumatergy wouldn't be able to use gems to add the devastating powers the exiles we control do, but it seems every human you come across as an enemy has the ability to use most any of the weapons just scattered around Wraeclast. Also, most of these human enemies seem perfectly capable of using at least one active skill, so it can reasonably assumed that the ability to use SOME thaumatergy is pretty damned common. It seems unlikely to me people would theorize applications for weapons that haven't been invented yet. Clearly bows, wands, axes and other such weapons are precursors to gunpowder weapons. We know these weapons exist, so the use of thaumatergy MUST have come afterwards. BUT it seems to me that weapon technology simply remained focused on refining existing weapons because, as we can tell from the names of items, these weapons have been made for a very long time, and continue to be a primary focus in weapon making in the current time period. There are ancient axes, and swords etc. And ones that aren't even described as 'old'. So we can infer that this means weapon progress hasn't really happened. Then there comes the armor problem. If powder weapons existed, wouldn't the armor being made reflect this? There doesn't seem to exist in game a single armor which doesn't seem to primary focused on reducing blunt force, or slashing attacks ( excluding ES gear at least, though silk is quite effective against arrows oddly enough ). None of the armor seems to be made to stop bullet, or powder weapon projectiles at all. To me, it doesn't add up... "I would have listened... I would have understood!" - Scion
Have you removed Asus ROG/GameFirst yet? |
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+1 - Been thinking about making a pirate themed build and flintlock pistols would fit perfectly.
+1 more if you could dual wield pistol with a scimitar (or any 1 hander). Hell, even a flintlock MTX for wands would do, sadly you cant dual wield wands and melee. Neither is ever gonna happen tho' :( "Please feel free to report any players you see attempting to acquire/sell items in trade chat." - Bex_GGG
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