Minion classes ruin the game for me

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rflynn74 wrote:

I think I speak for other people that have grouped with summoners here, they make grouping with them not fun at all.

My screen is constantly cluttered with multiple zombies, skeletons, and whatever other abominations they make. Quiet frankly, I now leave groups because of the constant confusion on screen. It's very hard to tell who is friend or foe, they do nothing but really just get in the way.

GGG really needs to limit the amount of pets a class can have, it's ridiculous that someone can summon 20+ pets and ruin a game for others.

I think its a bit rough and a large statement saying that minion classes ruin the game for you.

Its a bit of a 1 sided arguement. And probably minion classes could say that grouping with you ruins the game for them.

So what would you have them do ? Ban summoners and take them out of the game ?
Just because you dont like playing with summoners.

I have only just started trying a summoner build all be it limited. When i play in groups i try not to use my minions as much as i know it causes confusion, but sometimes it does help.

Maybe you don't like it because you haven't fully tried it to unlock its potential for solo play or group play.

I am sure that within time minions will be changed so that they are better recognised but to come on the forums and whine about it is a bit much.

I don't mind Summoners, I kinda think of them like Special Forces.

You see them vaporizing a room full of enemies, I'm going to stay the hell away and try to find another path to the level above or below me.

The ultimate reinforcement, sometimes you have to pull back if you can't handle it all.

If you can't handle someone else getting loot, then maybe you should stick to Solo.

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xanmalone wrote:

I don't mind Summoners, I kinda think of them like Special Forces.

You see them vaporizing a room full of enemies, I'm going to stay the hell away and try to find another path to the level above or below me.

The ultimate reinforcement, sometimes you have to pull back if you can't handle it all.

If you can't handle someone else getting loot, then maybe you should stick to Solo.

This has nothing to do with loot, it has to do with the unplayability of the game with 20000 Million minion on screen. It's a POORLY designed skill, whoever at GGG made it did not even think it through at all. "Let me just make a skill where 20+ pets can spam the shit out of everyone else in the environment"

Yea the amount of stuff on the screen is just to much to make fun. Everything is blocking sight and pathing, it starts to lag and I am pretty much confused. But even making the minions more visible woul still let a lot of problems open. (the mass on the screen)

Am I the only one that gets bothered when you are trying to mouse over an enemy mob to see its hp and there are pets swarming all around and all you pick up is their hp. It's really frustrating and hard to see what the mobs hp is at. Minions really should not show their hp when you mouse over them. Anyone else agree, or is it better to know minion hp despite the annoyance?

The amount of minions on screen is defined by the skills level and the amount of passives. Pure summoner builds (such as mine) need these numbers to replace the damage they lost in using minions as their main damage source. So, as a result we need a metric shit tonne of minions to survive. If we lose our minions, we are boned.

That being said, there does need to be changes to the zombies/skeles.

As people have said we could:
Make friendly minions stand out significantly.
Make them transparent.
Make them non-targetable.

These are the main fixes that have been suggested in this thread and many other threads, and I daresay GGG will listen if enough people have this issue.

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Camdalf wrote:

Am I the only one that gets bothered when you are trying to mouse over an enemy mob to see its hp and there are pets swarming all around and all you pick up is their hp. It's really frustrating and hard to see what the mobs hp is at. Minions really should not show their hp when you mouse over them. Anyone else agree, or is it better to know minion hp despite the annoyance?

I use HP for spectres and zombies. At high levels and with multiple supports they take a lot of mana to summon. I usually mouse over my spectres and zombies after a fight in order to see how they're doing and only re-summon if their HP are getting low. It would be a real pain in the ass if I couldn't mouse over my zombies and spectres and see HP. You only get a HP indicator on the new UI if you're down to one minion, and that's too late.

There is no reason to ever mouse over skellies, except to look for the green outline since you can't tell them from enemy skellies.

What minions need are distinctive models.

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rflynn74 wrote:

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xanmalone wrote:

I don't mind Summoners, I kinda think of them like Special Forces.

You see them vaporizing a room full of enemies, I'm going to stay the hell away and try to find another path to the level above or below me.

The ultimate reinforcement, sometimes you have to pull back if you can't handle it all.

If you can't handle someone else getting loot, then maybe you should stick to Solo.

This has nothing to do with loot, it has to do with the unplayability of the game with 20000 Million minion on screen. It's a POORLY designed skill, whoever at GGG made it did not even think it through at all. "Let me just make a skill where 20+ pets can spam the shit out of everyone else in the environment"

Man, don't groups with summoner builds. What?... devs now need to fuck up summoners, and players that like playing that class so you can group with them? Man that's selfish. You have a choose not to play with summoner, but you want devs to remove a choose and fun factor from people that want to play that class with big number of summons (becouse thats why it is so fun in the first place). Sorry, but your request is bad, remove a fun factor from a class, so that you can play with them. You better request how to improve minions visually, so you can distinguish better things on your screen.

I like what ciknay said 3 posts back.

I'm a summoner too, and I agree that sometimes I feel that my minions may be bothering single targeting classes, and also thought already of fewer but stronger minions as a possibility to reduce this.

But at the same time I feel so much secure with my surroundings covered in minions as they can target individually lots of enemies and don't let them get to me. Fewer minions would leave me an easier target for large groups of enemies.

Also, despite some classes being annoyed, no one can say that they don't feel much secure with lots of minions taking the hits for you, while you target calmly and from safe distance or close but to a preoccupied enemy that won't hit you unless it kills the minion first. Added to this, summoners tend to have several auras and physical vulnerability curses so ANY of those annoyed classes are benefited by summoners, don't lie about it.

That being said, I will agree with some suggestions said before, like transparency, BUT, I'd prefer a ghost type minion rather than transparent zombies, like specters, but a unified ghost form that replaces zombies.

Also, if GGG makes minion targeting available for some reason, I'd like to propose at least to change the HP bar of minions from red to green, so you have an extra thing on screen that tells you that THAT is not an enemy. In fact, I'd add allies HP bars too in this suggestion.

In any case, I hope you don't nerf summoners much more from what it already been done...

And for the one that suggested to go separate ways with a summoner in party, you're an ass, know it. A party is a party for a reason.

summoners were easy to party with in D2 (if your computer didnt suck) because they looked quite different to everything else. Enemy skeletons were usually black or red compared to bone white necromancers.

making them a bit shorter, non-targetable (outside of pvp) and a palete swap would be all thats neccessary.

i'd advocate a value added service for mini summons that are 1/3 their current size. i'd pay 500 points for that :p