Scourge Arrow, CI, Raider.

Can someone explain how this build is supposed to work?
(The build all the top Delver's are using)

I have barely touched bow builds so maybe I'm missing some fundamental point. but so far, post story, I cant do a single thing.

Every tiny bit of damage just instantly kills me.
1 of the 5 million projectiles hits me... I die.
Fire trail on the floor?... I die.
Ice patch?... I die.

Enlighten me.
Last bumped on Dec 4, 2019, 10:01:07 PM
Those Kind of builds have a single purpose only:

Deep Delving

You can't map with them, you can't do bosses with them you propaply even can't do blood aqueducts with them relialby (expect if you manually dodge everything)

In Delves 2000+ everything kills you in one hit anyways. Even if you are a jugg with maximum endurance charges and 10k life.

For that reason they go ful glasscanon. Hoping to kill everyting before it hits them. Ofc they die a lot but they can progress delve this way.

Scourge arrow is just a very good damage scaling skill and has good coverage of the delve nodes.
Ci is for the chaos dots that spawn in certain biomes.


I understand its purpose is to delve. This is what I was referring to. It's why I made it yesterday.

Fire trails being from the dogs that come off-screen, and ice patches from the explosions. Projectiles, e.g the totems that fire 50 at a time.

My point is, there is no feasible way to avoid all of it, hence I must be missing something, as they just walk into everything and don't get hit or die to these ground effects at all.
Last edited by Chalace2 on Nov 12, 2019, 4:59:39 AM
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2670925

Here is the guide to this build written by ONTOP (number 2 deepest delve this league).

It is very detailed and i hope you will find some answers there.

He even lists many biomes and how to run them with this build.

"
Chalace2 wrote:
I understand its purpose is to delve. ...
It's why I made it yesterday.
...
My point is, there is no feasible way to avoid all of it, hence I must be missing something, as they just walk into everything and don't get hit or die to these ground effects at all.

I'm looking at your 68 SA Raider - I assume that's the toon we're talking about. A lot of your gem slots are empty. I'll assume that's because you're in the process of changing things around, but it means no way to assess what your build actually looks like.

A few general thoughts...
At 68, there is no way you would have the EH to do serious delving. (By which I mean "normal" deep delving in the 200 to 400 range.) In fact, you have 1200 life and 260 ES in your PoB. I get that the serious deep delvers (1000+) have low EH, but they have a lot of other stuff going on that you don't yet. If you want to learn how to play a deep delve build, you should start with a more normal health pool so you can survive long enough to learn what you need to change. Getting to 500 is different from getting from 500 to 1000, which is different from doing 1500+

Looks like you only have 4 nodes from lab.

You need to learn how to use SA. Getting 20% quality on Infused Channeling is absolutely critical. Goal is to cut the 1.2 sec time to infusion by 50%, which is huge for survival.

Your bow is ok for starting mapping, but that's about it.

Looks like you are going cold, which can be very effective defensively, but you are far from optimized. (Although hard to tell what you might be playing with because you are missing so many gems.)

Overall, it looks like you slapped together a toon, played it in a totally sub-optimal state for a day, and decided it's worthless.

From personal experience, an SA cold/freeze/shatter build can work really nicely both in general and for delve. As with any build, it takes some time to optimize and learn to play it.

Cheers
Last edited by GreyLensman on Nov 12, 2019, 8:16:18 AM
"
GreyLensman wrote:

I'm looking at your 68 SA Raider - I assume that's the toon we're talking about. A lot of your gem slots are empty. I'll assume that's because you're in the process of changing things around, but it means no way to assess what your build actually looks like.

A few general thoughts...
At 68, there is no way you would have the EH to do serious delving. (By which I mean "normal" deep delving in the 200 to 400 range.) In fact, you have 1200 life and 260 ES in your PoB. I get that the serious deep delvers (1000+) have low EH, but they have a lot of other stuff going on that you don't yet. If you want to learn how to play a deep delve build, you should start with a more normal health pool so you can survive long enough to learn what you need to change. Getting to 500 is different from getting from 500 to 1000, which is different from doing 1500+

Looks like you only have 4 nodes from lab.

You need to learn how to use SA. Getting 20% quality on Infused Channeling is absolutely critical. Goal is to cut the 1.2 sec time to infusion by 50%, which is huge for survival.

Your bow is ok for starting mapping, but that's about it.

Looks like you are going cold, which can be very effective defensively, but you are far from optimized. (Although hard to tell what you might be playing with because you are missing so many gems.)

Overall, it looks like you slapped together a toon, played it in a totally sub-optimal state for a day, and decided it's worthless.

From personal experience, an SA cold/freeze/shatter build can work really nicely both in general and for delve. As with any build, it takes some time to optimize and learn to play it.

Cheers


While I appreciate the fact you actually took the time to respond, none of what you said is actually relevant.

My question was very specific, related to nothing more than dealing with the ground effects & projectiles in delve. On a build that runs 1hp & 200~ES, i.e nothing.

I'm fully aware that I slapped this together in 6~ hours yesterday, but the remaining gear/gems/ascendancy points were irrelevant to what I was testing.

"
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2670925

Here is the guide to this build written by ONTOP (number 2 deepest delve this league).

It is very detailed and i hope you will find some answers there.

He even lists many biomes and how to run them with this build.


I shall tke a look when I get chance, thanks.
Last edited by Chalace2 on Nov 12, 2019, 9:34:03 AM
"
While I appreciate the fact you actually took the time to respond, none of what you said is actually relevant.

My question was very specific, related to nothing more than dealing with the ground effects & projectiles in delve. On a build that runs 1hp & 200~ES, i.e nothing.

I'm fully aware that I slapped this together in 6~ hours yesterday, but the remaining gear/gems/ascendancy points were irrelevant to what I was testing.


All the rest is totally relevant. You are testing a low-end build that you don't know how to play to see if 200 EH can stand in delve ground effects and survive.

The guys who are running 1 + 200 builds (a) have expensive builds that do massive damage at long range and (b) know how to use those builds to their full potential.

If they get caught in those ground effects, they die. And they actually die quite often. But they also know how to use that massive damage to one-shot many of those threats before they become threats. EDIT: and I wouldn't write off immunity. You get chaos with CI obviously, but they may have ignite immunity from gear. Or they may even be avoiding zones that have ground effects to which they are not immune. Lots of possibilities.

It's also worth noting that you don't see a major transition from normal EH to CI + 200 until you get below 1500. I don't delve there but I know the map mods change quite a bit as you go deeper. It may be that the transition at 1500 just happens to correspond to when they're able to afford some super expensive gear, but it's also possible that some effects are less common there. This is why I suggested playing a normal EH build and working your way down. The guys doing 500 to 1000 (which is crazy enough) are mostly all running normal EH. I'm sure there's a reason.

Good luck with your approach! (Seriously - nothing wrong with trying something. The thread is interesting and leading to some worthwhile discussion on a topic that doesn't get discussed that much.)
Last edited by GreyLensman on Nov 12, 2019, 11:46:36 AM
"
GreyLensman wrote:


but they may have ignite immunity from gear. Or they may even be avoiding zones that have ground effects to which they are not immune. Lots of possibilities.



That's pretty much what I was asking. The damage wasn't an issue, I was 1-shotting everything already.

I have no intention of going that deep. Currently around 450(?) with my Jugg, but the rares were becoming problematic (Conc path single target sucks), so I wanted to try something else.

I had a spare half-hour so respecced to the life version (thanks to the link posted) and just ran 7 or 8 delves without an issue at level 70'ish. So we will see how it goes when I sort the gems, etc out properly. Bonus, I can run maps with it too as life.
Life version works great. I did not like SA much when I first tried it, but it grew on me as I figured out how to use it. I did it as Slayer last league, but I think Raider or Trickster would be great as well.

You might try your CP Jugg with Pulverise + Blood and Sand if you haven't already. Beats single target for clearing and delving. Although reading again, it sounds like your problem is actually DPS against single rares at that level. I found that Oni has fairly modest damage in my CP Chieftain build. Rare foils withe some other DPS focused gear will up the output quite a bit, but it also gets expensive.

Cheers
Last edited by GreyLensman on Nov 12, 2019, 1:58:17 PM
"
GreyLensman wrote:
Life version works great. I did not like SA much when I first tried it, but it grew on me as I figured out how to use it. I did it as Slayer last league, but I think Raider or Trickster would be great as well.

You might try your CP Jugg with Pulverise + Blood and Sand if you haven't already. Beats single target for clearing and delving. Although reading again, it sounds like your problem is actually DPS against single rares at that level. I found that Oni has fairly modest damage in my CP Chieftain build. Rare foils withe some other DPS focused gear will up the output quite a bit, but it also gets expensive.

Cheers


Yes, only the rares, mainly dogs that appear to be tankier than shaper. Everything else normal/magic dies in 1-2 hits.

I can't really swap weapons, as my build is based around the Nebulochs.
I did intend to try out pulverise when i got a new chest, still deciding what to use tho. (replacing combustion) but I don't think it will make enough of a difference.

There is also the issue of survivability, even with everything I have I still get randomly 1 shot by basic melee attacks as soon as molten shell drops even at 400~ if the zone has anything even remotely suggesting damage increase or -res. It kinda kills the fun.
Last edited by Chalace2 on Nov 13, 2019, 1:30:51 AM

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