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Hey jeniuscury, what do you think of animate Guardian? I know we are pretty short on gem slots but assuming we could fit it, would you still run it? Seems like a pretty big damage boost.

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peereiro wrote:

What curse do you drop to get a movement skill? Flammability or Projectile Weakness?

Flammability, this way you keep with Elemental Equilibrium and Projectile Weakness.

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dagoncrowgg wrote:

Hey jeniuscury, what do you think of animate Guardian? I know we are pretty short on gem slots but assuming we could fit it, would you still run it? Seems like a pretty big damage boost.

Hi there.

I used Animate Guardian for a long time and I'm planning to use it again but for this I'm doing a change in the Jewels and the Gems. If you have never played with Animate Guardian, take into account that "yes" there will be hits that it will not support and that is suffered to buy items for the Gear of the Animate Guardian.

But in the way the build is at this moment if you plan to use Animate Guardian you have 2 options.

The first is that you can remove Empower, so your Zombies would die easier, but do not worry, it will not be frequent. It will only be for Sevage Hits, same thing for Animate Guardian.

The second is to remove Blind. In this option you lose the effect of Blind on hard enemies that take more time to be defeated. If you do not plan to do bosses on maps it would be ideal to trade this gem with Animate Guardian.

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jeniuscury wrote:

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peereiro wrote:

What curse do you drop to get a movement skill? Flammability or Projectile Weakness?

Flammability, this way you keep with Elemental Equilibrium and Projectile Weakness.

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dagoncrowgg wrote:

Hey jeniuscury, what do you think of animate Guardian? I know we are pretty short on gem slots but assuming we could fit it, would you still run it? Seems like a pretty big damage boost.

Hi there.

I used Animate Guardian for a long time and I'm planning to use it again but for this I'm doing a change in the Jewels and the Gems. If you have never played with Animate Guardian, take into account that "yes" there will be hits that it will not support and that is suffered to buy items for the Gear of the Animate Guardian.

But in the way the build is at this moment if you plan to use Animate Guardian you have 2 options.

The first is that you can remove Empower, so your Zombies would die easier, but do not worry, it will not be frequent. It will only be for Sevage Hits, same thing for Animate Guardian.

The second is to remove Blind. In this option you lose the effect of Blind on hard enemies that take more time to be defeated. If you do not plan to do bosses on maps it would be ideal to trade this gem with Animate Guardian.

Hi jeniuscury, have you considered replacing the belt with Darkness Enthroned (the belt with 2 abyss sockets and 1.5 multiplier on jewel mods)? I find it quite useful, because we can add ghastly jewel which give minions several bonuses, (such as "minions blind on hit" and "minions taunt on hit"), and it also frees up one gem socket from current setup.

Example jewels in poe.trade: http://poe.trade/search/itawoninosinya

With two +45 energy shield jewels on the belt, we can reach +135 energy shield, and get some flexibility on abyss jewels (good candidates are minions taunt on hit, minions hinder on hit, minions blind on hit, regenerates maximum life).

BTW, I enjoy this build a lot, thank you!

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billybob630 wrote:

Hi jeniuscury, have you considered replacing the belt with Darkness Enthroned (the belt with 2 abyss sockets and 1.5 multiplier on jewel mods)? I find it quite useful, because we can add ghastly jewel which give minions several bonuses, (such as "minions blind on hit" and "minions taunt on hit"), and it also frees up one gem socket from current setup.

Example jewels in poe.trade: http://poe.trade/search/itawoninosinya

With two +45 energy shield jewels on the belt, we can reach +135 energy shield, and get some flexibility on abyss jewels (good candidates are minions taunt on hit, minions hinder on hit, minions blind on hit, regenerates maximum life).

BTW, I enjoy this build a lot, thank you!

Hi There. Thanks for reply.

I was simply updating the guide when I received your reply. I did not make the exact change you suggested but it was something like that.

To have 1 free slot for the Animate Guardian or if some prefer, a Movement Skill, I changed the Cobalts for Ghastly Eyes and one of them has the mod Minions have % chance to Blind and now it is possible to take out the gem Blind Support from Helm.

I do not think wearing the belt with 2 Ghastly Eyes would be interesting. The amount of Energy Shield that could be purchased would be virtually the same. As for the damage would actually be increased, but the real problem is that you need the Belt for Str if you do not want to pick up a point on the Passive.

Is it possible to take Str on the Abyss Jewels? Yes. But you need to sacrifice at least one other suffix of Hinder or Blind on hit. Note that if you do not want to spend 1 point in Str on Passive Tree you will need to take Str in Both Abyss and still have at least an amount close to +35 Str in each ring.

In my opinion, you lose more than you earn.

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jeniuscury wrote:

I was simply updating the guide when I received your reply. I did not make the exact change you suggested but it was something like that.

Ah, interesting you made the jewel change! Yes, I feel ghastly jewels are perfect choice for summoner builds.

Last league I was following a different style of summoner (FOURmulaic Summoner) and in that one, I used 5 ghastly jewel to cover different minion bonus. I feel the gem gear suggestion provided there is quite inspiring.

To quote one:

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You preferably want at least 7% total chance to taunt on your abyss jewels. Get as much life, damage, hinder, blind as you can.

I got the taunt total by observing how quickly Izaro would get taunted by my Skeleton Warriors during Uber Lab runs. The magic number seemed to be 7% when Izaro would stop aggroing me after his first attack.

That was a suggestion with a dozen of skeletons in the army. I'm not sure whether taunt is effective when we only have 9 zombies + 1 golems now, but i believe adding additional layer of defense is helpful.

Regarding your comment:

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jeniuscury wrote:

Is it possible to take Str on the Abyss Jewels? Yes. But you need to sacrifice at least one other suffix of Hinder or Blind on hit. Note that if you do not want to spend 1 point in Str on Passive Tree you will need to take Str in Both Abyss and still have at least an amount close to +35 Str in each ring.

The Str on Passive Tree is a good point. If you take a look at my Passive Tree, I actually picked the +30 Str node :). The Str on rings are not good point though, since we're both using Str in unset ring.

Then the question goes to "do we really need so many Str"? My answer is no, because the Str is mostly for vitality (which requires 155 Str) & high level blood magic (which requires 111 Str). Both can be kept in low level, and I think 100 Str is enough (for lv21 stone golem and lv21 purity of fire). I was trying to level up to 20 only for 20% quality.

The missing regen from vitality can be made up from additional ghastly jewels. I can see you're using ghastly jewels with 1% life regen while moving in your new setup. If you put that in the belt, it will be regens 1.5% life while moving. Adding two such jewels in the belt will be +3% life regen while moving. That outweighs the penalty of low level vitality, and also outweighs an expensive watcher's eye's regen effect.

The belt I'm using:



When comparing the value between a jewel and a passive node, I feel the former is more valuable. An additional passive node in your tree will be +6% max es, but an additional empty jewel socket can be +8% max es & some nice attribute. Putting existing ghastly jewel to that belt will frees up two such jewel sockets. Curious about your thoughts here.

For better understanding, can you provide a newer version of your passive tree in 3.4? I remember last time I checked your profile, you picked +30 Dex node, and "minion damage" node near "lord of the dead". I think those are not necessary but not sure whether you changed them. I'll try to work out a PoB setup based on my proposed setup. It would be great if I can setup based on your gear.

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billybob630 wrote:

Ah, interesting you made the jewel change! Yes, I feel ghastly jewels are perfect choice for summoner builds.

Last league I was following a different style of summoner (FOURmulaic Summoner) and in that one, I used 5 ghastly jewel to cover different minion bonus. I feel the gem gear suggestion provided there is quite inspiring.

That was a suggestion with a dozen of skeletons in the army. I'm not sure whether taunt is effective when we only have 9 zombies + 1 golems now, but i believe adding additional layer of defense is helpful.

In fact, I think the Taunt in Ghastly Eyes would be even more effective with zombies than with skeletons, since the Taunt effect expires when the target that affected Taunt dies, taking into account that skeletons die fast, the Taunt mod expires, differently from the zombies which survive almost all hits in general.

Why Taunt? It would make virtually no difference in maps, except for the Bosses who take a few seconds to be defeated. If it were possible to at least apply Taunt in Shaper, Elder and their respective Guardians would even be a viable option but unfortunately it is not possible. So I ask you again: Why Taunt? Are you having problems with Izaro? I do not know the amount of your Energy Shield, but from what I could see in your gear it should be close to 8.5k, in that amount it should not be difficult to resist Izaro skills, even because it is defeated very fast.

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The Str on Passive Tree is a good point. If you take a look at my Passive Tree, I actually picked the +30 Str node :). The Str on rings are not good point though, since we're both using Str in unset ring.

Then the question goes to "do we really need so many Str"? My answer is no, because the Str is mostly for vitality (which requires 155 Str) & high level blood magic (which requires 111 Str). Both can be kept in low level, and I think 100 Str is enough (for lv21 stone golem and lv21 purity of fire). I was trying to level up to 20 only for 20% quality.

The missing regen from vitality can be made up from additional ghastly jewels. I can see you're using ghastly jewels with 1% life regen while moving in your new setup. If you put that in the belt, it will be regens 1.5% life while moving. Adding two such jewels in the belt will be +3% life regen while moving. That outweighs the penalty of low level vitality, and also outweighs an expensive watcher's eye's regen effect.

When comparing the value between a jewel and a passive node, I feel the former is more valuable. An additional passive node in your tree will be +6% max es, but an additional empty jewel socket can be +8% max es & some nice attribute. Putting existing ghastly jewel to that belt will frees up two such jewel sockets. Curious about your thoughts here.

I disagree as to your opinion of Str's points. I do not think they are bad in the Passive, but rather unnecessary and without function. I think these points help in leveling and builds that are dependent and really need many attributes like The Baron - Zombie for example. Str in the rings are simply excellent, since all we need is a fair amount of Maximum Energy Shield and All Elemental Resistances, because of that they are easy and cheap to find. One of the main problems of the build regarding attributes is to get enough to use Vitality. The other other skills require less as you quoted Blood Magic, Stone Golem ...

I made an attempt with the Darkness Enthroned, the difference is very little but it did not overcome the Crystal Belt with implicit more Maximum Energy Shield as explicit, so I keep it with the point in the Passive Tree. Using the Unique Belt, the main difference is that you will have more options in the Ghastly Eyes. I think Hinder would be more interesting than Taunt, and of course followed by Blind.

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For better understanding, can you provide a newer version of your passive tree in 3.4? I remember last time I checked your profile, you picked +30 Dex node, and "minion damage" node near "lord of the dead". I think those are not necessary but not sure whether you changed them. I'll try to work out a PoB setup based on my proposed setup. It would be great if I can setup based on your gear.

The profile is open if you want to check Gear and Passive. The point Dex on Tree was just for lack of attribute attribute that was missing. And yes I also gave up the Minion Damage node next to the Lord of the Dead.

Hi ,first off i LOVE this build ,first trying LL summoner and i like it alot , secondly could you possibly check my profile and my character (ThyMischievousLoki)and look where i can maybe get more ES? rocking only 7706 es right now , Thanks in advance :)

jeniuscury, thanks for the reply. I cannot see your character tab since it is private now. Can you share that? I’m a bit suprised the belt change is not effective, want to play around in POB to verify my points.

Regarding the bonus from taunt, how about the usage in delve mines? That 10% damage mitigation can be nice.

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ryan_MD wrote:

Hi ,first off i LOVE this build ,first trying LL summoner and i like it alot , secondly could you possibly check my profile and my character (ThyMischievousLoki)and look where i can maybe get more ES? rocking only 7706 es right now , Thanks in advance :)

I’m not op, but I feel you need to reach the “Arcane focus” node for additional 28% maximum energy shield. I feel you can refund the minion damage node & minion life leech node for this. (my rough estimation is, you can get +560 final ES from this change)

You ideally need a shav with ~340 base ES instead of 300 ES, that is ~120 ES difference after scaling. Purchasing a more expensive one is fine, if you want to upgrade to 6 link, the better 5L shav sells easier.

For skill point priority, my 2 cent is you also need to get that additional jewel socket first (which gives you additional ~40 base ES and ~120 ES after scaling), getting more exp from leech rota / map rota can be helpful for quick leveling.

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billybob630 wrote:

jeniuscury, thanks for the reply. I cannot see your character tab since it is private now. Can you share that? I’m a bit suprised the belt change is not effective, want to play around in POB to verify my points.

lol. My profile is visible to everyone since October 10, which was the day I saw your reply about the Ghastly Eyes.

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Regarding the bonus from taunt, how about the usage in delve mines? That 10% damage mitigation can be nice.

Yes, it would be good. Although it is only 10%, combined with the other defenses of the build would make a difference in hits of many rare, magic or even normal monsters on Delve.