TeGnGcGent Stash Tab Constriction Non Paying Players

"

blindedbylight wrote:

Whilst I normally tend to avoid commenting on these types of threads I am slightly confused by some of the views expressed and hope that someone can enlighten me on this.

Let's fix this issue!

"

blindedbylight wrote:

For those individuals who are free to play and are unhappy with the stash tabs, why do you feel that TencentGGG should give you more stash tabs?

Because they see it as GGG turned a truth into a lie.
This game is not Free To Play anymore. It's a trial. Over the years, GGG added so much content to clutter the inventory in order to force sells if you wanna enjoy the game. Dont believe me ? Lets take a look at some numbers.
There are 65 currency, 222 div cards, 100 essences, 16 map fragments, 170 maps and most relevant vendor recipe take from half an inventory to a full one. Im not even talking about keeping swap gears like flask, jewels and gears yet...
(It's no wonder so many streamers ADVERTISE stash tabs. You think they do it for free ?)

Seeing as you have more then 1 stack of same currency we can see how fast 65 types become a lot more. What was somewhat an issue is now a big problem for obvious reasons.

Lets say you play free. half the first tab can easily become alts, the other half would be jews, and another page would easily be filled by the remainder of the currency if not overflowing. OK! That was a little epic to manage in the past 2 - 2 1/2 pages just for currency(no essence no div card included yet!). 1 tab for gears you want to keep and for few gems.<--- You Are Now Full! So now that I filled my 4 pages rather easily, where do I put: ----> My 222 div cards, my 100 essences, my maps, my vaal fragment, my shaper set, my items I wish to trade, my divine Vessel, my shaper, Atziri, Abyss, Pale Court fragments*.

Cause you know that without at least 20-30 set. You have about 0% chance to get anything and a set take 4 slot. Not to mention that 1 of them is always rare so you end up with ton of the others.

"

blindedbylight wrote:

Furthermore I would question the ethical position of someone of who looks to access a service for an extended period of time whilst giving nothing back (generally speaking relationships should involve some form of reciprocation, this has been explored in texts from Hobbes to Russell and modern philosophers such as Simon Blackburn - seriously read Blackburn's Truth is a great starter on ethics)

Ouch, did you know that game go free to play because they know "free players" bring paying customers ? Your citation of ethics is more than lacking. Its completely irrelevant. The free players give something back! I myself have brought a few friends that all spent between 60$-300$. I mean you cited something contradicting yourself in the process by pure ignorance of why Free To play Exist in the first place.

Maybe you should read his book: "What do we really know? -The Big Questions of Philosophy".
It would allow you to question yourself before using philosophers quote out of context.

"

blindedbylight wrote:

I raise this as I would strongly encourage those people complaining to assess their own sense of entitlement and rather than complain about those things they do not have, enjoy the things you have. If we could all do this then maybe Wraeclast may be a better place for us all.

But the game is not free to play, its a DEMO/ a TRIAL. Game that offer the same kind of gimmicky limitation will call it "TRIAL" or "DEMO". Think of any mmo trial without time limitation, Diablo 1, 2 demo or another other game. Im pretty sure if it was called a "DEMO" or "Trial" that no one would of even made this topic.

So yeah, please dont ever quote philosophers... You shot yourself in the foot.

I think the main argument that i read all over this thread is : POE2012 => Free, POE2018 => Not Free, and i agree with it. So if GGG trying advertised this game as a free game with 100% content that is not true anymore, and will become completely false maybe in next few patch when they introduce more content that will fill up the 2012 default stash. I doubt that someone is capable to get into the very endgame content in current patch without even buy additional stash tab, maybe a very veteran player capable to do all of that stash management, but for a completely sane new player? total nonsense without a mule player. The first impression that hook me into PoE back in 2013 is the fact that this game is the truly free to play game compare to all other free to play non private server mmorpg, but now that impression is completely dead to new player in this game nowaday.

TL;DR
Free to play? yes it is, 100% content with free to play? not anymore. GGG just need to admit this game is not that free anymore compare to 2012.

But that doesnt change the fact that this game is still not P2W in a sense of buying currency, unique, passive sp and revive HC character, and i appreciate GGG to still hold that till now.

"

petitcrabe1 wrote:

But the game is not free to play, its a DEMO/ a TRIAL. Game that offer the same kind of gimmicky limitation will call it "TRIAL" or "DEMO". Think of any mmo trial without time limitation, Diablo 1, 2 demo or another other game. Im pretty sure if it was called a "DEMO" or "Trial" that no one would of even made this topic.

Totally agree with you on this point.

"

petitcrabe1 wrote:

"

SeCKSEgai wrote:

2 handers weren't the only exclusive ethereals and I don't recall a reliance on merc damage. I mean I don't recall barbs ever going meta, and it even took me a moment to remember those were even a merc choice.

the other ethereals were useless on merc... I dont even wanna know how you can consider a 1 hander even an option as the Barbarian couldnt even equip a shield.


Rogue Merc ? Bow only!
No amazon bow, no crossbow. In short, bad dmg ethereal choices


Desert Merc ?

Spears, Polearms, Javelins
Now, those offer actual dmg!

Barbarians Merc ?
One Sword! No dual wielding! NO SHIELD!
While you claim they never been meta.. They actualy did find some use but were harder to find proper weapon. Why would ppl use them ? Typicaly, people would just make the big ethereal runeword swords to equip on them. It was THE use of those weapons. Non Meta ? Of course it was part of it. You apparently simply never knew about it.
--->Bash and Stun<---

Barb were meta on any stun build as it was easier to stun lock many unique monsters with yourself and the merc.

Edit: Even sorceress and spellcaster necro often preferred the Barb but went with act simply because of the ease of finding the proper weapon as you had more options.. There no incentive from getting useless act 2 aura for a sorceress.

Merc not for dmg ?
https://youtu.be/JJcr811OFdc
Barb merc soloing Baal in hell.

I totally forgot it was rogues act 1.
Desert Act 2 had our wonderful polearm users with aura.
Act 3 had our armor wearing mages the iron wolves
Act 4 was Hell and had none - had to look it up been so long
Act 5 Barbs!

For the majority of builds, Act 2 mercs were meatshields with an aura. Sure you could gear them up quite nicely and not have to worry about degredation, but those mercs offered a little extra utility beyond meatshield and damage. None of the other mercs had exceptional damage to be valued over anything else and rogues/iron wolves couldn't justify their fragility really.

"

petitcrabe1 wrote:

"

SeCKSEgai wrote:

2 handers weren't the only exclusive ethereals and I don't recall a reliance on merc damage. I mean I don't recall barbs ever going meta, and it even took me a moment to remember those were even a merc choice.

the other ethereals were useless on merc... I dont even wanna know how you can consider a 1 hander even an option as the Barbarian couldnt even equip a shield.


Rogue Merc ? Bow only!
No amazon bow, no crossbow. In short, bad dmg ethereal choices


Desert Merc ?

Spears, Polearms, Javelins
Now, those offer actual dmg!

Barbarians Merc ?
One Sword! No dual wielding! NO SHIELD!
While you claim they never been meta.. They actualy did find some use but were harder to find proper weapon. Why would ppl use them ? Typicaly, people would just make the big ethereal runeword swords to equip on them. It was THE use of those weapons. Non Meta ? Of course it was part of it. You apparently simply never knew about it.
--->Bash and Stun<---

Barb were meta on any stun build as it was easier to stun lock many unique monsters with yourself and the merc.

Edit: Even sorceress and spellcaster necro often preferred the Barb but went with act simply because of the ease of finding the proper weapon as you had more options.. There no incentive from getting useless act 2 aura for a sorceress.

Merc not for dmg ?
https://youtu.be/JJcr811OFdc
Barb merc soloing Baal in hell.

I totally forgot it was rogues act 1.
Desert Act 2 had our wonderful polearm users with aura.
Act 3 had our armor wearing mages the iron wolves
Act 4 was Hell and had none - had to look it up been so long
Act 5 Barbs!

For the majority of builds, Act 2 mercs were meatshields with an aura. Sure you could gear them up quite nicely and not have to worry about degredation, but those mercs offered a little extra utility beyond meatshield and damage. None of the other mercs had exceptional damage to be valued over anything else and rogues/iron wolves couldn't justify their fragility really.

"

blindedbylight wrote:

Whilst there have been a lot of words I think these are the main arguments, neither of which appear particularly persuasive. Furthermore I would question the ethical position of someone of who looks to access a service for an extended period of time whilst giving nothing back (generally speaking relationships should involve some form of reciprocation, this has been explored in texts from Hobbes to Russell and modern philosophers such as Simon Blackburn - seriously read Blackburn's Truth is a great starter on ethics)

I raise this as I would strongly encourage those people complaining to assess their own sense of entitlement and rather than complain about those things they do not have, enjoy the things you have. If we could all do this then maybe Wraeclast may be a better place for us all.

When someone has to refer to ethics and philosophy to explain something to people on a video game forum.... it's hard not to be fearful for the future =p.

Given that some folks want to consider Poe a demo, the ignorance is astounding. Compare the Act 1 DEMO/TRIAL of Diablo 3 to the access granted any new account in PoE. One plays like a trial, the other offers full access - because one is a trial and one is a full game.

I get people wanting things free, but these levels of entitlement would make even pirates blush.

"

SeCKSEgai wrote:

Given that some folks want to consider Poe a demo, the ignorance is astounding. Compare the Act 1 DEMO/TRIAL of Diablo 3 to the access granted any new account in PoE. One plays like a trial, the other offers full access - because one is a trial and one is a full game.

I get people wanting things free, but these levels of entitlement would make even pirates blush.

Then I may think that a language barrier is the issue here and you may want to look at what the terminology of words mean. Maybe you will understand more about the perceived opinions of other.

Here a little to get you started:




I think I made my point.

To conclude,

"

SeCKSEgai wrote:

the ignorance is astounding

Is resolved when ignorance itself is abolished and replaced with knowledge.

Good Reading.


Edit:

"

SeCKSEgai wrote:

For the majority of builds, Act 2 mercs were meatshields with an aura. Sure you could gear them up quite nicely and not have to worry about degredation, but those mercs offered a little extra utility beyond meatshield and damage. None of the other mercs had exceptional damage to be valued over anything else and rogues/iron wolves couldn't justify their fragility really.

And yet you quoted my msg that included in a Barb merc that soloed Baal in hell..
Merc could do insane dmg and if you wanna know, while rogue was rather useless in story it offered insane dmg for bming in pvp even if they suffered a huge penalty to dmg.. Teleporting Lightning sorc with a Rogue was the BMpvp of everyday.

It's not a language barrier, its someone not wanting to own their entitlement.

If you were around for D2 and gaming of that era you would clearly know the difference between shareware and demos compared to full game access.

I had access to all available content in Poe before I ever spent a thing.

Its just plain whiny to complain about stash space in Poe if you actually played D2 - because everyone who ever played D2 for any reasonable amount of time never forgot the pain of muling.

Specialized stash pages aren't required for trade - one can trade and sell their goods without relying on the api - we did that in D2 for ages.


Could mercs do "real" damage, sure - but that wasn't practical use. It could be done to be done but wasn't something you were gonna do regularly if at all.

BMPVP? PvP itself hardly took off and for good reason. More than anything it was something to justify all the time spent finding the gear when looking for more was boring.

Bad manners? If pvp alone barely had meaning, cheesing pvp means even less.


But really, what bugs me more than anything is that anyone who's spent a significant time gaming has seen the difference between f2p, free trial, sub only and pay to win. There are countless f2p titles that restrict story/content. And here, some people still want to complain because they want more free storage space.

This again?

Just make another account and store everything on a mule. Simple. You can make a billion accounts if you want. If that is to inconvenient buy some tabs or just deal with it.

They go on sell all the time. Skip some fast food one day and buy some tabs.

"

SeCKSEgai wrote:

It's not a language barrier

It is when you claim ppl are ignorant for using a word and that I even show you the definition from wiki and yet you still try to somehow change the value of the word. ITs not because you consciously experienced 1 or 2 type of demo and/or trial that others dont exist. Ignorance is fixed when it is replaced with knowledge and it often fix arrogance to claim a word mean something based on stimuli experience vs knowledge and fact. Next time you sign up for a hosting service and they give you very little space. Just remember you are experiencing a free DEMO. They DEMO it so you PURCHASE for MORE SPACE. I mean, its simple, I explain it, the wiki explain it, the dictionary can explain it to you. If you say that the green color was blue because in your experience it's blue. I would simply say that your eyes are wrong and deceived by your brain because everyone else KNOW it is green. What we have here is a language barrier.




You speak the dialect of -->Perceptions Based On past Experience<-- and I speak the dialect of -->Definition<--. Go learn what words mean and ignorance will be lifted and replaced with knowledge.