Berserkers make other builds impractical :(

remove insant leech and suddenly not many people will play berserker anymore lol. you will probably mostly have RF and other indirect damage builds that can benefit from warcries and 40% more damage they otherwise cant get easily

everyone else likely move to the next best sustain life facetank mode, which is slayer.

"

Ceryneian wrote:

I can't help but wonder whether some of you just like arguing for the sake of arguing, or how it is possible to have such an ignorant view of this game.

I am absolutely wrong? Hehe.

Do you not realize what is making Berserker so strong is his leech? It is not the damage, as you can get higher damage on other classes than Berserker, and ALSO his main damage node Aspect of Carnage has NOT changed since release.

So damage has nothing to do with it. And his damage buffs have nothing to do with it.


"while the masses hadn't caught on to how strong CI was yet, it definitely affected his popularity"

LOL what the hell? Son, building a Berserker and building CI are not mutually exclusive. There were CI Berserker builds running around using his other nodes. CI has nothing to do with this.

Please try again.

You are really showing your ignorance. I would not be surprised to learn you didn't play during Ascendancy launch, because you keep talking about Aspect of Carnage and Cloaked in Savagery - a combination which takes 8 ascendancy points, even though we launched with 6.

Also you do not seem to understand that the only parts of Berserker that actually work with CI were Rite of Ruin, Pain Reaver and Aspect of Carnage - none of which was inherently broken upon launch (if you really think "40% More Damage" was better than Infinite Flask Pathfinder then I seriously question your understanding of the game). In fact, none of them is broken now, it's just that all other options to do the same thing (like Vinktars) have been nerfed into the ground.

Come to think of it, a Pathfinder with Vinktars got everything Berserker had but better in every way back then, and he also had 4 more flasks to play with.

I wouldn't worry, once VP gets nerfed the zerkers will fade out.

It's definitely not a good idea to boost defense with better offense or via versa. With VP, we are boosting defense with offense. With VP and berserker (40% more damage and 100% leech), it becomes much more crazy.

Are other classes bad? Definitely not. Is berserker much better? Yes.
Are other defenses bad? A bit. Are other defenses worse than VP? Yes. Is VP op? Not sure. Is VP with 100% leech and 40% more damage OP? Sure.

"

sidtherat wrote:

"

Ceryneian wrote:

It was very obvious from the start when Ascendancies were introduced that Berserker would be an OP class.

I remember arguing with people here on forums (particularly sidtherat) who believed Berserker was actually the weakest class and they wanted him to get more buffs.

"

sidtherat wrote:

TL;DR: Berserk is the weakest class released so far. Not only because of 'numbers' but because it brings nothing new to the table while providing mostly conditional, weak or straight deceptive bonuses. I would not, ever, recommend anyone to pick this class. Ever.

Giggles. It just took a few people to make some builds that properly utilized Berserker for the masses to wake up and see how strong he is.

Answer is not to nerf Berserker but to buff classes that are too weak.

'why nerf, buff instead' is one of THE most stupid things to say in a game development EVER

as for my thread on Berserker - read it, read it carefully and check WHEN i made it and what were the numbers on that class on release. check them and get back, ok?

fun fact - most of my suggestions have been actually implemented. i hope that my last remaining gripe (removal of Vaal Pact) will get implemented in 3.1 as well.

Good thing IceFrog never listened to people like you, because all he ever did was buffed underused heroes/items. And I'm pretty sure DotA 2 is far more successful than PoE, and started literally as a fucking custom map for WC3.

Necro OSfrog

"

allbusiness wrote:

Good thing IceFrog never listened to people like you, because all he ever did was buffed underused heroes/items. And I'm pretty sure DotA 2 is far more successful than PoE, and started literally as a fucking custom map for WC3.

???
Icefrog nerfed heroes and items all the time.

---

When calling Berserker op, people always seem to forget the "10% increased damage taken".

That's the same as "reserving 10% of your health pool with aura+BM", and can easily cost you 800+ life.

"

Peterlerock wrote:

"

allbusiness wrote:

Good thing IceFrog never listened to people like you, because all he ever did was buffed underused heroes/items. And I'm pretty sure DotA 2 is far more successful than PoE, and started literally as a fucking custom map for WC3.

???
Icefrog nerfed heroes and items all the time.

---

When calling Berserker op, people always seem to forget the "10% increased damage taken".

That's the same as "reserving 10% of your health pool with aura+BM", and can easily cost you 800+ life.

If you ignore the same passive that give also 40% more damage....

Beside when people talk about op, they meant VP and clock in salvagy interaction. You can choose not to take the passive that takes 10% health, and pick the warcry one.

"

Peterlerock wrote:

"

allbusiness wrote:

Good thing IceFrog never listened to people like you, because all he ever did was buffed underused heroes/items. And I'm pretty sure DotA 2 is far more successful than PoE, and started literally as a fucking custom map for WC3.

???
Icefrog nerfed heroes and items all the time.

He nerfs OP stuff, while buffing weak stuff at the same time. And he does it smart, without "rollercoasters" as we see in PoE.

"

PrimordialDarkness wrote:

You are really showing your ignorance. I would not be surprised to learn you didn't play during Ascendancy launch, because you keep talking about Aspect of Carnage and Cloaked in Savagery - a combination which takes 8 ascendancy points, even though we launched with 6.

Also you do not seem to understand that the only parts of Berserker that actually work with CI were Rite of Ruin, Pain Reaver and Aspect of Carnage - none of which was inherently broken upon launch (if you really think "40% More Damage" was better than Infinite Flask Pathfinder then I seriously question your understanding of the game). In fact, none of them is broken now, it's just that all other options to do the same thing (like Vinktars) have been nerfed into the ground.

Come to think of it, a Pathfinder with Vinktars got everything Berserker had but better in every way back then, and he also had 4 more flasks to play with.

Dude, reading comprehension cannot be that challenging. Mentioning both Aspect of Carnage and Cloaked in Savagery - in the same sentence - does not mean I am talking about combining both.

And please stop talking about Berserker damage and Aspect of Carnage. Issue with Berserker has nothing to do with his damage. Berserker has had 40% more damage since release. His damage has nothing to do with the imbalance - so I don't know why you keep talking about Aspect of Carnage and his damage buffs, when I have specifically said in my post that his damage has been the same AND you can get more damage on other classes.

Berserker has had 100% leech since day one.

Berserker has had access to Vaal Pact since day one.

This problem with Berserker has been apparent since day one.

You are only complaining about Berserker because more of the masses are playing Berserker. He's been like this SINCE DAY ONE.

Changes to CI, Vinktars? Pathfinder? Who? Irrelevant. In fact, most of those builds you are happy got "nerfed" are not even using Vinktars any more for their instant leech, they have enough leech from just the tree already.